Korean Job Discussion Forums

Francis-Pax · Joined: 20 Nov 2005

I have been reading posts here and there about university contracts in Korea getiing worse and worse.

Is it worth getting an MA TESOL to work at a university or is it a waste a time?

HapKi · Joined: 10 Dec 2004 Location: TALL BUILDING-SEOUL

For me, getting my MA improved my college teaching situation.
Large salary increase, Assistant Professor status, tenure-track--- basically considered the same as an entry level Korean professor, without a lot of the extra work Koreans have to do.

On the other hand, I am now evaluated more, both by the students and faculty, which can effect resigning. Also, I must publish something like 300% over the next 3 years, as my Korean counterparts do.

Over-all, better. What's your hold-up?

indytrucks · Joined: 09 Apr 2003 Location: The Shelf

According to the doomsday prophets over here, the quality of uni jobs is going to go quickly down the toilet. I'm sure what these smug windbags over at EFL Law are hypothesising won't apply to everyone (I know it won't for me), for some, contract quality will diminish. You simply have to be a little more choosy when applying to and considering uni positions. It's not rocket science.

As far as getting the MA TESL/TEFL, it can broaden your horizons beyond Korea. Think other parts of Asia, Europe, Middle East and North America.

Of course it's worth doing if you have the time, patience, motivation and of course, the money. I assume the OP is talking about doing an online programme?

Chow · Joined: 24 Nov 2005 Location: Cheongju

Where's the best place to get the TESOL MA? (online)

Barking Mad Lord Snapcase · Joined: 04 Nov 2003

HapKi · Joined: 10 Dec 2004 Location: TALL BUILDING-SEOUL

indytrucks · Joined: 09 Apr 2003 Location: The Shelf

sid · Joined: 02 Feb 2003 Location: Berkshire, England

This might sound a bit smug, and I'm really not one of those teachers who thinks EFL in Korea is a sort of competition to do the lowest possible amount of work for the most possible money/benefits. I just can't stand them pessimists spreading doom and gloom everywhere. Anyway, in the two years I've been at _____ University the contract and conditions have changed in the following ways:

- weekly hours reduced by three.
- cost of living pay increases (4-6%) on top of the yearly 'step' raise.
- change to two year contract (pay rise in the middle).
- moved from the national pension to a more lucrative private pension scheme (one where all teachers regardless of nationality can claim the money back when they leave).
- severance replaced by a bonus for vacation teaching (works out more for everyone, quite a lot more in my case).
- moved from dingy on-campus accommodation to nice off-campus housing.
- increased foreign teacher staff numbers (now 25 I think).
-more opportunities to teach credit/content-based classes.
-improved timetable with no evening (6pm) classes.

And in contrast to a couple of other things which 'they' always say about Uni jobs:
- there is no 3-year or any other limit on contract renewal.
- no closed shop: the school advertises on the net and hires new teachers every semester.
- you don't need an MA (but I think it helps to have / be doing one).

goodbyekoreasale · Joined: 12 May 2005 Location: Yongsan, Seoul

Real Reality · Joined: 10 Jan 2003 Location: Seoul

Foreign scholars merit equal status
The foreign professor -- colleague or hired hand?
... foreign professors... do most of the heavy lifting in terms of course loads, devoting themselves almost exclusively to teaching. Nevertheless, they tend to be treated as hired hands, without academic standing, and lacking the possibility of career advancement or tenure. They must submit to yearly contracts (compensated at a rate only 60 percent of their Korean peers) while walled off from the permanent Korean faculty who benefit from travel, research funding, sabbaticals, etc....
by John B. Kotch, JoongAng Daily (June 14, 2002)
http://joongangdaily.joins.com/200206/14/200206142349223599900090109011.html

sid · Joined: 02 Feb 2003 Location: Berkshire, England

What took you so long? I was expecting that to be the first reply on the thread.

BigBlackEquus · Posted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 6:29 pm Post subject:

bellum99 · Joined: 23 Jan 2003 Location: don't need to know

Again real reality is not actually adressing the point. There are many foreign professors who don't teach English. It is not the same. The foreigners who teach English are not the same as those other professors. You can argue that I am wrong...but in most cases it is true. The title and honor due to a professor is because of his long years of research and expertise. English teachers in universities usually do not fall into the same category.
The English teachers (they are not professors) do not have any actual expertise or knowledge above that of most English teachers in Korea. Unless you are teaching something other than English..I don't consider you a professor and neither do most Koreans. This being said, I would consider most people in university easily replaceable.

BigBlackEquus · Posted: Sun Dec 25, 2005 9:10 pm Post subject:

Koreans call nearly anyone who teach at a university a "professor."

Some of you are applying a western mindset to the culture here, and allowing yourself to become offended.

The issue here is not whether or not someone with a BA is truly a professor. In Korea, it is possible, In the USA or other countries, no. We all know that. It is just a word: Professor. Koreans use it differently, as they do with other words. That is the culture. Being called that would make me uncomfortable too, but I would deal with it.

The issue some of you are really upset about is that Koreans don't consider a foreign professor as enough of an asset to consider such a person over someone else who has merely a BA or MA. You can't have your life here as you want it, so you are upset. Your psychological reaction to it is to cut down those who you consider beneath you, and the schools who hire them.

It is a matter of injured pride, on your part, to be marginalized. You feel you are owed something, and Koreans just don't want to pay you what you are worth. In the Western world there are certain standards, and you can take advantage of those that you have earned. Korea is not the west. Or, more importantly, you are not Korean (the other real issue here). Life can be unfair, but there are other jobs in other countries, where you can take your title and revel in the respect you feel you are due. Korea is not one of them, with the exception of a few schools.

They aren't looking for a Limo to drive them to the land of Englishee. They are often happy with a compact or a mid-sized car that looks acceptable, and just don't care to pay for anything more expensive.

Real Reality · Joined: 10 Jan 2003 Location: Seoul

Are most qualified foreign educators compensated fairly and appropriately?

1. Are foreign educators treated as colleagues or hired hands? Do foreign professors usually teach more hours than Korean professors? How many foreign professors have sabbaticals?

Foreign Scholars Merit Equal Status
The foreign professor -- colleague or hired hand?
John B. Kotch, JoongAng Ilbo (June 14, 2002)
http://joongangdaily.joins.com/200206/14/200206142349223599900090109011.html

2. Do foreigners experience difficulties and discrimination in Korea? What is the quality and size of most of the housing for foreign educators?

Foreigners Experience Difficulties in Living in Korea
by Jae-Dong Yu and Soo-Jung Shin, Donga.com (July 4, 2004)
http://english.donga.com/srv/service.php3?biid=2004070522448
For Housing Rentals, Foreigners Easy Victims
by Byun Duk-kun, Korea Times (August 28, 2003)
http://times.hankooki.com/lpage/nation/200308/kt2003082818233111970.htm

3. How often do foreign educators receive a 12% increase in monthly salary? Have foreign educators ever received a 12% increase in monthly salary?

12% Increase of Professors Salary Last Year, but Part-Time Lecturers' Were Decreased
Donga.com (February 14, 2002)
http://english.donga.com/srv/service.php3?biid=2002021400798

4. Do the average salaries of foreign educators come near $5,000 per month? How much does experience and education really figure into determining the salaries of foreign educators?

Professor Salary (2000 Salary)
South Korea: $5,511 per month
South Korea: exchange rate 1,134 won equals US$1
http://www.asiaweek.com/asiaweek/features/salaries/2000/popups/content/21prof.html

5. Who does the hiring and determines the salaries for foreign educators? Who controls the contract renewal process?

Corrupt Professors Common, Students Say
by Baek Il-hyun and Kim Ho-jeong, JoongAng Daily (April 28, 2005)
http://joongangdaily.joins.com/200504/27/200504272214239309900090409041.html
Stop Corruption in Academia
Editorial, JoongAng Daily (April 27, 2005)
http://joongangdaily.joins.com/200504/27/200504272153216879900090109011.html
A Country of Liars
by Kim Dae-joong, Chosun Ilbo (July 3, 2005)
http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200507/200507030027.html
Ex-pats Describe Korea's Culture of Corruption
by Kim Hong-jin, Chosun Ilbo (December 16, 2004)
http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200412/200412160027.html