Korean Job Discussion Forums

Ilsanman · Joined: 15 Aug 2003 Location: Bucheon, Korea

Do you think this is acceptable?

So this kid came to my class. He was sitting there staring off into space like a little retarted child. I told him to work.

No motion.

I told him again. I asked him where his pencil was. He didn't answer.

He has no pencil, so I told him to get one. Borrow from a friend.

Then I grabbed his friend's pencil to show him. P-E-N-C-I-L....just to be sure that he understood me.

He proceeded to stare into space with his jaw dropped for the rest of class.

Is he even worth teaching?

kat2 · Joined: 25 Oct 2005 Location: Busan, South Korea

Is it the first time you've taught him?

I had a kid like this and after about month he was so energetic and in to class. He became my favorite student. I would keep encouraging this kid and being nice to him. You may see a big turn around.

laogaiguk · Joined: 06 Dec 2005 Location: somewhere in Korea

Give him time. I have no doubt you showed up to work a couple times (as I have) with very little energy and interest in English. Could be having a bad day? Heck, his father could have died and his mother still sent him to the hagwon (happened to me once)...

Ya-ta Boy · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: Established in 1994

It's a judgement call. And a lot of the determining factors need to be considered.

If this kid has been coming to class for some time and taking part, then this is a sign something special is going on. Check up on it.

If this kid has been coming to class all along, acting like this, then you have to make a judgement. How much of your time should be spent trying to get basic compliance (since that time is taken from the kids who are ready to study). Personally, I would say very little of your time should be spent on him. The other kids deserve your attention more.

seoulunitarian · Joined: 06 Jul 2004

It all depends on how many other students you have (in that class, and total). I have over 650 students total, and cannot possibly deal with the 10-15 students who act (or are) as you described. Reasons for the behavior, learning disability or not, do not change the fact that I cannot possibly spend extra time on these students.

Peace

anyway · Joined: 22 Oct 2005

try a little sympathy. kids go through a lot in every country, but especially this one...

John Henry · Joined: 24 Sep 2004

I sometimes give up for a day or two, but then you get a second wind.

You just get frustrated, but it will pass.

thegadfly · Joined: 01 Feb 2003

So, you told him to get a pencil out, you showed him what a pencil was, and you spelled the word pencil for him, and got no response? And that took you through you entire bag of tricks as a teacher? You have absolutely NO idea of what else could/should/might possibly be done to get the student's attention and get him involved in class? I'm sorry, if you consider yourself a teacher, get back in there and try again. If you are just here for a working holiday (de-emphasis on the work, emphasis on the holiday), then by all means, give up!

Some students will not learn from you, no matter what you do. Some students will not learn as much from you as they would from a different teacher, no matter what you do. Some students will love you and think you are the greatest teacher in the world, no matter what you do...so I think it comes down to giving it your best shot with every student every time -- not even really for them, but for yourself. That way, you will never have to wonder, "what if I had tried a little harder...." If you have sincerely, seriously done as much as you can think to do, have talked with others to see if there are strategies or insights that might help you, if you believe the student is incapable of learning no matter WHO the teacher is, then give up.

Teaching is not telling kids the answers, it is not even passing on information -- there are a gazillion books with enough English knowledge to replace every teacher here, if that were the case. It is about motivating and modeling. One class with the kid and you are giving up?

I don't measure teachers by their performance on the good days with the good kids, I measure it by their performance on their worst days, with their worst kids. This kid definitely sounds like a challenge, and may be too much time/effort/stress to try to teach...but from what you posted, you are nowhere near being able to make that judgement...I would say until you have tried everything you can possibly think to do, and tried each two or three times, that you should not give up on the kid. Assuming, of course, that you care about being a good teacher.

Dan The Chainsawman · Joined: 05 May 2005

Give him a couple of weeks, keep working on the basics with him, and if that does not work then quietly assign him to a seat in the corner and let him drool on himself and pay him no mind.

Yu_Bum_suk · Joined: 25 Dec 2004

It really depends on the context. At a public school (if you have hundreds and hundreds of students) or a crap hogwan (where you have no support) there's really not much you can do. At a good hogwan I'd suggest sitting down with him and a KT and seeing what the problem is.

kiwiliz · Joined: 20 Apr 2006 Location: New Zealand

[quote="thegadfly"]So, you told him to get a pencil out, you showed him what a pencil was, and you spelled the word pencil for him, and got no response? And that took you through you entire bag of tricks as a teacher? You have absolutely NO idea of what else could/should/might possibly be done to get the student's attention and get him involved in class? I'm sorry, if you consider yourself a teacher, get back in there and try again. If you are just here for a working holiday (de-emphasis on the work, emphasis on the holiday), then by all means, give up!

Hey now that paragraph was just plain unfair. Who made you judge and jury of this guys teaching ability. You weren't there. If the guy was a jsut here on a holiday would he care tht the kid did nto appear interested in being there at all????

Some students will not learn from you, no matter what you do. Some students will not learn as much from you as they would from a different teacher, no matter what you do. Some students will love you and think you are the greatest teacher in the world, no matter what you do...so I think it comes down to giving it your best shot with every student every time -- not even really for them, but for yourself. That way, you will never have to wonder, "what if I had tried a little harder...." If you have sincerely, seriously done as much as you can think to do, have talked with others to see if there are strategies or insights that might help you, if you believe the student is incapable of learning no matter WHO the teacher is, then give up.

[b]This is much more constructive, and helpful. although I take it you never had a student in any of your classes who was not interested in learning and made no effort? You are are very lucky

PaperTiger · Joined: 31 May 2005 Location: Ulaanbataar

How about this kid: nine year-old girl with decent English skills and fairly good motivation goes from the best kid in the class to lazy, rude, uber-b1tch?

She used to pipe up with the right answer every time and do her homework, study for spelling tests. Now it seems she mainly comes to class to talk to her friend and outright refuses to do her classwork and ignores me every time I speak to her. If I try to get her to do anything other than follow her own inclinations, she looks at me either with the evil eye or a contemptuous sneer. She's been like this for more than three weeks and shows no prospects of changing. It's pretty rare that I have student's that are this uncooperative, but each time it happens I do my best to get them out of my class before their ill-bred behavior infects the rest of the class...in this case it's too late.

I've tried repeatadly to get my co-worker and the girl's mother to help her with her $hitty attitude and extremely disrespectful behavior, but obviously one or both of those "adults" is the problem since she has shown no change. I basically told my co-worker to call the girl's mother and keep her home for the next class untill I have a chance to talk to the boss about getting her out of my classroom.

simpleminds · Joined: 04 May 2006

"Like a little retarded child."

Is being retarded a crime? Do you know what "retard" means? It means, "to hinder", "to cause to move or proceed at a less rapid pace.", "to be delayed".

Too right he is worth teaching.

Is this kid new? Give him time.

Has he always been like this? Give him time.

Is he shy, sensitive, anxious, socially inept? Give him a lot of time.

At my hogwon I was told about this girl who said ditto, did ditto and knew ditto. He said he tried his best to drew her out.

One look at her told me she was sickly. One observation of his teaching style told me it didn't suit her at all. He was a good teacher, but a LOUD teacher who joked with the students, made them laugh, then got them to work with a friendly bark.

Not her style at all. Some kids can't tolerate noise.

My style was quieter. Seldom do I raise my voice. I would ask her one easy question at the beginning of the class, and she would mouth her answer. I didn't care she understood or not at that point; she needed encouragement, not correction. After, I asked her no questions, merely encouraged her to join the others.

It took three months before she began to participate, and another month for her mischivous personality to show. Another month, and she was screeching out her answers in her high thin voice. Never mind she still knew ditto, but she was having a good time. However, when an observing teacher took over for five minutes, she went back into her shell.

Some kids need time... a lot of time.

Yelling will do no good at all. Impatience kills what little confidence the kid has, and will cause him to withdraw into his world, where he is safe. Too much noise and stimuli is such a kid's enemy. Structure, rythm (sp?) patience, and encouragement is all you can give. The rest is up to the kid.

Trust me. I have a learning disability, and I hated noise. Everybody called me a retard. I didn't learn to speak until five, and I didn't read until eight, and that was because I had a very patient grandmother.

The point is this: When an impatient teacher barks, hisses and yells, it's distressing to the say the least, and traumatic at worst. This kid of yours may not be like me or the sickly kid, but you don't know this kid, and you don't want that, do you?

You need to watch your mouth, dude.

poet13 · Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 1:23 am Post subject:

I gave up on a child about two months ago. After fifteen months, I couldnt keep explaining the lesson once to the class and then once again to her. I have very little to be ashamed about as a teacher (except my grammar skills), but every time I see her (every day), I am reminded that I have a long, long way to go as a teacher.

Wrench · Joined: 07 Apr 2005

Been here 18 months. I stopped caring about 15 months ago. I don't care if some falls behind. Peer pressure is great motivator. I keep going, and then they quickly realize that they will not be able to leave the classroom unless all work is completed. End of story, I let the Koreans deal with the special children.

Imho if some one doesn't want to be helped don't help. Maybe because I am a self motivated person, learning isn't easy or even fun on the most part but it�s a necessity and lots of the kids don't get that. Not just in Korea but all over the world.