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Troll_Bait

Joined: 04 Jan 2006 Location: [T]eaching experience doesn't matter much. -Lee Young-chan (pictured)
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Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:46 am Post subject: Superman discussion thread |
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(Started from here.)
| Troll_Bait wrote: |
I can't recall right now what the worst movies I've ever seen might be, but the worst one I've seen recently was definitely "Superman Returns."
Warning: Movie Spoilers Ahead
Who is this movie for? It's too childish for adults. Kevin Spacey was great as an over-the-top Lex Luthor, but all the other characters were flat. Yes, it's based on a comic book, but that doesn't mean that characters need to be one-dimensional. Look at relative depth of the characters on the TV show "Smallville," which is also based on the Superman mythos. It's too boring for kids. There isn't enough action. And if it's supposed to be for kids, then why did Superman and Lois Lane have a child out of wedlock? Try explaining that to young children.
If you want a great Superman movie that both adults and children can enjoy, the only one that really fits the bill is Superman II. Adults can enjoy the development/maturation of the relationship between Lois and Clark Kent/Superman (cumulating in Clark first admitting his secret identity to Lois, and then giving up his powers to be human like her.) And kids can enjoy the scenes where Superman takes on criminals from his home planet of Krypton. Superman whips General Zod around before hurling him up into a giant electronic billboard! WHAAAAAAM! But wait! A Kryptonian gangster picks up a bus and uses it like a battering ram against the Man of Steel! POOOOOOW! |
| Maserial wrote: |
(Weren't there two Kryptonian gangsters that picked the bus up: Non and Ursa? Anyway.)
I'm with you on the Superman II accolades, but I figure, now would be an appropriate moment to segue into the awful Superman III (the link offers a lengthy, but accurate review of the film). The movie was terrible. To sum things up:
1. Crappy 1983 3-D? Bad idea.
2. Adding tar to kryptonite in lieu of an element? Dumb.
3. Robert Vaughn? Scary villain. No, really.
4. An endless barrage of 'slapstick' humor? Dude, it's a Superman movie.
5. Richard Pryor? Great comedian, but yeah, it's a Superman movie.
6. Clark Kent versus 'evil' Superman? Another great villain, naturally.
7. Dropping a frozen lake onto a burning industrial facility? I'm speechless, in 3-D.
If anything, a person should watch Superman III just to intensify a fondness for Superman movies that are actually good.
On another note, I loathed Dreamcatcher. I'd rather watch Superman III ten times over, than sit through that monstrosity again. |
| Troll_Bait wrote: |
| Maserial wrote: |
| (Weren't there two Kryptonian gangsters that picked the bus up: Non and Ursa? Anyway.) |
Jesus H. Chrishna! You remember their names? Actually, I did remember that there were two of them. I was just too lazy to point it out while I was writing. And actually, they weren't exactly gangsters, but rather war-criminals, hence General Zod. |
| Maserial wrote: |
| That's true. As long as we can agree that Superman II was cool, and that Superman III sucked, the world shall remain in balance (and stuff). |
| SPINOZA wrote: |
| Maserial wrote: |
| As long as we can agree that Superman II was cool, and that Superman III sucked, the world shall remain in balance (and stuff). |
(see bold)
in best Korean middle school girl's voice......아냐 ! |
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SuperFly

Joined: 09 Jul 2003 Location: In the doghouse
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Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 7:00 am Post subject: |
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I heard on NPR the other day that SUPERMAN was originally written by a Jewish guy who parallelled the moses story in the bible to superman.
i.e. Moses was found floating in the river, superman was found by his mom & dad along a rural country hwy, etc. |
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hermes.trismegistus

Joined: 08 Sep 2005
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Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 7:50 am Post subject: |
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| SuperFly wrote: |
I heard on NPR the other day that SUPERMAN was originally written by a Jewish guy who parallelled the moses story in the bible to superman.
i.e. Moses was found floating in the river, superman was found by his mom & dad along a rural country hwy, etc. |
Yup.
Originally he couldn't fly and he was quite prone to abuse. He'd toss boats on drug dealer's houses and drop people over ledges, etc. It wasn't until his first major revision that he became such a 'boyscout'.
My fiance� and I went and saw 'Superman Returns' on the IMAX 3D in Yongsan. We both came out of it highly enthralled. I've slowly gotten her into 'Smallville', but she doesn't really qualify as a fan of the series or the genre, but she still greatly enjoyed it.
I found it all-around groovy entertainment, and I was glad they added the non-canonical twist - it makes the character much more complicated. Unfortunately, the high sticker price and the steep competition may delay any talk of a sequel. The furor over Routh's sexual-preference may not have helped matters either. Routh satisfied my preferences in the role of Supes, but his Clark just didn't sit right... perhaps I'd just need to see him in the role longer.
Dunno.
I've heard folks who didn't like it and folks who did. We were pleased, and that seems good enough for us.
Namaste. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 4:03 pm Post subject: |
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A couple problems I had:
The huge problem I had with original batman movie back in the late '80s was it wasn't about batman but it was a Jack Nicholson movie. Jack was huge back then. Seems to me the movie was about Kevin Spacey. And even then Spacey couldn't do much with the lame script.
Some thugs beat up Superman. You're like "ha ha you thugs, just wait until Superman gets back his powers! You'll pay!" You're waiting for that juicy moment and it never comes. The thugs are offed by a hunk of ice. It seems to me comics are made for skinny kids who get beaten up every day by thugs. The pay off is the thugs get a thumping at the hands of the super hero. Did the script writer miss that essential point of the lore?
Superman fights an island. And what was with the whole kryptonite in the island thing? Does superman generally know when he's around kyrptonite? Why did he fail to notice its effect this time around, other than the script writers need it to advance the plot?
The whole Jesus thing was over long. Yeah we got it at the start when his dad says he gave the world his only begotten son. Falling back to earth in a cross shape should have been enough to tip off the red necks.
Was there no Christopher Reeve dedication? I figured something would come at the start or the start of the end credits. Maybe it was at the very end. I didn't wait. Nothing about the movie compels you to sit out the full credits. |
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seoulsucker

Joined: 05 Mar 2006 Location: The Land of the Hesitant Cutoff
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Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| Was there no Christopher Reeve dedication? |
Yeah. Routh's performance.
It looked and sounded like he studied hours and hours of film so he could get the voice and mannerisms of Reeve down for the part. His whole performance felt like a tribute.
The movie was entertaining, but I had forgotten what a family-friendly pu$$y the character is. I would have loved to see him take it to some bad guys, but noooooooooooooooo....chucking a hunk of rock into space was the climax of the film. |
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SuperHero

Joined: 10 Dec 2003 Location: Superhero Hideout
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Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 4:31 pm Post subject: |
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| the movie sucked. Spacey was the wrong choice for luthor, there was no script, the acting was mediocre and the movie didn't end. Worst movie since King Kong |
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DHX
Joined: 11 Jun 2006
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Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 4:34 pm Post subject: |
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| I found the movie slow and boring. Apart from Kevin Spacey the casting was terrible. Both the Superman and Lois characters should have been played by different actors. |
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andrew

Joined: 30 Jan 2003
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Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:52 pm Post subject: |
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*****
Last edited by andrew on Fri Jul 21, 2006 8:10 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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The Chewbacca Defense

Joined: 29 May 2004 Location: The ROK and a hard place
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Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 7:26 pm Post subject: ... |
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Just watched at the theatre in Oz.
Can't say I was too impressed (I have my reasons). However it did kill a spare 2.5 hours I had.
My opinion......don't pay to see it, but DL it and enjoy a rainy sunday afternoon with it.
That is all! |
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rocklee
Joined: 04 Oct 2005 Location: Seoul
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 1:35 am Post subject: |
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OP,
Did you really watch the movie?
Spacey was terrible, everybody else was ok.
I liked it, though Singer could have done more with the plot and special effects. I guess they couldn't do a remake of the first movie because that was already a classic. Nobody was better than Hackman to play Lex, Christopher to play Superman and or Margot to play Lois. Those were big shoes to fill, so I think the new cast did a good job (except for Spacey). Personally I felt that Kevin tried to play a darker, colder Luthor who was not unlike an evil European gangster from a bond movie.
I wish we saw more of Superman's connection with planet earth, feeling the water, browsing the deserts, the mountains, stuff not found on his old planet (I think Supergirl achieved this). There also wasn't enough about his childhood life, schooling and other facts that could've been made interesting.
The soundtrack however was astonishing, beautiful. |
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djsmnc

Joined: 20 Jan 2003 Location: Dave's ESL Cafe
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 1:40 am Post subject: |
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Superman is a Jewish conspiracy to diminish respect for Jesus.
Well, I don't believe it, but it seems some people have flirted with similar ideas: http://www.unomaha.edu/jrf/superman.htm |
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WorldWide
Joined: 28 Apr 2006
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 5:26 am Post subject: |
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| djsmnc wrote: |
Superman is a Jewish conspiracy to diminish respect for Jesus.
Well, I don't believe it, but it seems some people have flirted with similar ideas: http://www.unomaha.edu/jrf/superman.htm |
The creators of superman were Joe Shuster and Jerry Siegel. Both Jews! |
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sjrm
Joined: 27 Jul 2005
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 5:32 am Post subject: |
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| WorldWide wrote: |
| djsmnc wrote: |
Superman is a Jewish conspiracy to diminish respect for Jesus.
Well, I don't believe it, but it seems some people have flirted with similar ideas: http://www.unomaha.edu/jrf/superman.htm |
The creators of superman were Joe Shuster and Jerry Siegel. Both Jews! |
so was Jesus. |
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WorldWide
Joined: 28 Apr 2006
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 5:46 am Post subject: |
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| sjrm wrote: |
so was Jesus. |
Do you really believe that Jesus was a real person? Is Harry Potter real?
FICTIONAL CHARACTERS!!!!!!!!! |
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djsmnc

Joined: 20 Jan 2003 Location: Dave's ESL Cafe
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Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 7:07 am Post subject: |
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| WorldWide wrote: |
Do you really believe that Jesus was a real person? Is Harry Potter real?
FICTIONAL CHARACTERS!!!!!!!!! |
See! You were brainwashed by Superman. |
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