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To Kill A Katyusha
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee



Joined: 25 May 2003

PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 2:18 am    Post subject: To Kill A Katyusha Reply with quote

Quote:
To Kill A Katyusha Ibd

Tue Aug 15, 7:00 PM ET
Strategic Defense: Contrary to the conventional wisdom, there is a defense against the Katyusha rockets that Hezbollah has used to pummel northern Israel. And it can help protect the United States too.

As with most things, the conventional wisdom is wrong on this too. The U.S. was routinely shooting down Katyusha rockets at the White Sands proving ground in New Mexico as early as 1998 using a high-energy laser weapon that would explode their warheads in flight, a weapon initially developed as part of President Reagan's visionary Strategic Defensive Initiative .

When Reagan conceived SDI to defend us against a ballistic missile attack, it was envisioned as a multilayered system. One feature was a space-based component using a high-energy laser. Enemy missiles would be targeted in their boost or launch phase before they could deploy countermeasures or multiple warheads.

But it was found this technology had a tactical land-based application too. The problem with rockets like the Katyusha is they are cheap and plentiful, with short flight times and distances. The reaction times and targeting abilities of existing defenses are inadequate. But not with the Theatre High Energy Laser system.

Such a ground-based, rapid-fire laser, operating like a high-tech machine gun, sprays the target sky with enough high-energy pulses that a Katyusha barrage could be stopped in its tracks. The poor man's ballistic missile would be made ineffective, if not obsolete.

So why weren't these weapons deployed? Well, the space-based version ran into objections about the militarization of space -- never mind that space is exactly what enemy warheads must pass through on their way to targets in the U.S.

The land-based version, deemed so effective that it could have been shipped to Israel as early as 1999, also fell victim to "cost effectiveness." However effective, it would still cost more to shoot Katyushas out of the sky than it costs the enemy to make them.

But look at the costs imposed by Hezbollah's Katyushas -- a devastated Lebanese infrastructure, hundreds of civilian deaths, northern Israel rendered uninhabitable. Consider also that a single nuclear warhead -- an Iranian Shahab or North Korean Nodong -- launched from a ship in international waters off our coast and detonated high above the U.S. would unleash an electromagnetic pulse that would fry every unprotected electronic circuit in the U.S., sending the American economy back perhaps a century.

The Soviets are developing new land-based intercontinental ballistic missiles with maneuverable warheads. The Chinese have launched their first ballistic missile submarine, which can blanket the U.S. from home waters. Iran and North Korea are rushing to be able to nuke Israel and the U.S.

The best time to shoot down a missile comes right after launch, when it is big, slow and hot, as opposed to its descent phase, when it is fast and cold, and when its defensive countermeasures and multiple re-entry warheads have been deployed.

Launching a fleet of space-based lasers and deploying its land-based variant would be costly and provocative. Moscow, Beijing, Pyongyang, Tehran and Damascus, not to mention Hezbollah's Hassan Nasrallah, wouldn't be happy.

But imagine a world where Katyushas would be reduced to bottle rockets on steroids, where if Mahmoud Ahmedinejad and Kim Jong Il decided to put ICBMs on the pad, they'd look up to see U.S. space-based lasers ready to shoot them down.
Copyright � 2006 Investor's Business Daily


Copyright � 2006 Yahoo! Inc. All rights reserved.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ibd/20060815/bs_ibd_ibd/2006815issues
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SeoulFinn



Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Location: 1h from Seoul

PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 7:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For a change you posted something interesting! Wink Thank you for this article!
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W.T.Carl



Joined: 16 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 8:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The only problem with stopping those "little Kate" rockets is that they are so short ranged that the flight time is very very brief.
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The Hammer



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Ullungdo 37.5 N, 130.9 E, altitude : 223 m

PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mobile Tactical High Energy Laser (MTHEL)

http://www.defense-update.com/news/MTHEL.htm


http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htada/articles/20060808.aspx
Lasers Over Lebanon
August 8, 2006: Many Israelis are complaining that development of a, laser based anti-missile system, called THEL, which was recently cancelled, could have been used to stop some of the Hizbollah rockets coming out of Lebanon. Meanwhile, the American partner in THEL development is now offering a smaller version, Skyguard, for protecting commercial aircraft from portable anti-aircraft missiles. The manufacturer, Northrop Grumman, originally developed THEL (Tactical High Energy Laser) for combat situations. Tests last year showed THEL was able to knock down barrages of incoming mortar shells.

Israel was a partner in the development of THEL, which was originally supposed to enter service in 2007. When THEL was cancelled earlier this year, the laser still needed work, but the THEL radar was already in good shape. In 2004, Israel used the THEL radar to detect incoming Palestinian rockets fired from Gaza, and this provided an opportunity to operate the radar under combat conditions.

The THEL system was designed to knock down larger, and better made, rockets than the home made Palestinian Kassam rockets. In other words, THEL would have been very useful knocking down the factory made rockets Hizbollah has been firing at Israel over the last few weeks.

The THEL laser and radar system can track up to sixty targets (mortar and artillery shells, rockets) at a time and fire on and destroy these projectiles at a range of up to five kilometers. THEL can destroy about a dozen targets a minute, at a cost of some $3,000 per shot. Each THEL system (radar and laser) could thus cover about ten kilometers of border. Most Hizbollah rockets were fired in groups of a dozen or more, so THEL, if it was in the right place, could zap about half of them. Of course, given how difficult THEL was to move, Hizbollah would endeavor to fire their rockets over some other stretch of border. The Israel-Lebanon border is 79 kilometers long.

It took nine years, and over a half a billion dollars, for American and Israeli engineers to get as far as they did (one working prototype system) with THEL. Aside from the systems size and cost, there's also the problem of lasers being weakened by clouds, fog, mist or even artificial smoke. For that reason, there's not a lot of enthusiasm for proceeding right now on such a bulky and expensive system for use against small rockets. But by the end of the decade, a smaller, and cheaper, version will be more attractive, and more likely to be purchased.

THEL is a bulky system, and not really mobile. Each system requires half a dozen or more large tractor trailer trucks to carry the radar, fuel supplies and laser. A new version, the MTHEL (Mobile Tactical High-Energy Laser) was designed (using three tractor-trailers) and was tested. Engineers believe that MTHEL could be ready for battlefield use in about six years, at a cost of another billion dollars. In another few years, engineers believe they could create a MTHEL that could fit in a hummer.

The costs of THEL and MTHEL were so high, that both the American and Israeli governments pulled their support earlier this year. The manufacturer put some of their own money into the project and came up with Skyguard. This is basically THEL, which is actually suited for defending an airport against someone using portable anti-aircraft missiles (like Stinger, or the Russian made SA-7) to attack aircraft landing or taking off. Skyguard would be cheaper than equipping thousands of aircraft with individual anti-missile systems. But first, THEL has to prove that it is reliable enough to stay on-line 24/7 (or nearly so), and act effectively if there is ever an attack. No one has yet tried using these missiles in the United States, but it has happened elsewhere, especially in Africa.

The first Skyguard system would cost about $150 million, with subsequent ones costing about 70 percent less. Skyguard will also be able to handle rockets, artillery projectiles, mortars, unmanned aerial vehicles and cruise missiles. In other words, if you had a billion dollars to spare, you might be able to get a Skyguard system to defend northern Israel from rockets fired from Lebanon. Maybe. THEL is another example of technology that got out of the lab before it was ready to survive in the wild.


Lasers Over LAX
July 25, 2006: The Department of Homeland Security is being offered a laser anti-projectile system, Skyguard, for protecting commercial aircraft from portable anti-aircraft missiles. The manufacturer, Northrop Grumman, developed THEL (Tactical High Energy Laser) for combat situations. Tests last year showed THEL was able to knock down barrages of incoming mortar shells. Israel was a partner in the development of THEL, which was originally to enter service until 2007. The laser still needs work, but the THEL radar is already in good shape. In 2004, Israel used the THEL radar to detect incoming Palestinian rockets fired from Gaza, and this provided an opportunity to operate the radar under combat conditions. The THEL system was designed to knock down larger, and better made, rockets than the home made Palestinian Kassam rockets.
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bignate



Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Location: Hell's Ditch

PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting article Joo.... a very feasible solution, though very expensive solution...it sure would be a better alternative that what Lebanon has just been through...
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee



Joined: 25 May 2003

PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 10:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The US could improve its strategic situation with missile defense , Rods from God, The Space bomber and most of all alternative energy.
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Yu_Bum_suk



Joined: 25 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 11:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bignate wrote:
Interesting article Joo.... a very feasible solution, though very expensive solution...it sure would be a better alternative that what Lebanon has just been through...


Oh to think of those Lebanese runways, hospitals, apartment blocks, fuel depots, coastlines, motorways, bridges, and power stations - that Americans care so deeply about - which could have been saved had America only spent billions more on laser research. How ordinary Americans must be wallowing in such sorrow for Lebanese without power, food, or homes because they didn't throw their money at miracle technology that could have prevented Israel from killing 50 times the civilians their enemies did.
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Junior



Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye

PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 1:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="Yu_Bum_suk"]
Quote:
How ordinary Americans must be wallowing in such sorrow for Lebanese without power, food, or homes


Why would Americans mourn for Hesbollah or the people that support them? They perpetrated terrorist attacks on America before now.

Quote:
prevented Israel from killing 50 times the civilians their enemies did.


How do you know most of those "civilians" weren't militia?
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee



Joined: 25 May 2003

PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 3:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yu_Bum_suk wrote:
bignate wrote:
Interesting article Joo.... a very feasible solution, though very expensive solution...it sure would be a better alternative that what Lebanon has just been through...


Oh to think of those Lebanese runways, hospitals, apartment blocks, fuel depots, coastlines, motorways, bridges, and power stations - that Americans care so deeply about - which could have been saved had America only spent billions more on laser research. How ordinary Americans must be wallowing in such sorrow for Lebanese without power, food, or homes because they didn't throw their money at miracle technology that could have prevented Israel from killing 50 times the civilians their enemies did.



Hizzbollah ought not have started the war.

But as I said if Hizzbollah is an organization that is not dedicated to destroy Israel then Israel's actions are probably not justified.

If Hizzbollah is an organization that is out to destroy Israel well then Israel's actions are understandable or even justified.

The problem is Hizzbollah, and Khomenism, Bathism and Al Qaedaism.

They ought to give up their war.

Shame on all in the west who say they pretend to be anti war when actually they support Hizzbollahs' war. although they claim that they protest out of moral concern the fact is that they don't. These people are slime.
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ddeubel



Joined: 20 Jul 2005

PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 6:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The problem is Hizzbollah, and Khomenism, Bathism and Al Qaedaism


Wow, you have changed your thought pattern!!!! Miracles are occuring........

Quote:
Shame on all in the west who say they pretend to be anti war when actually they support Hizzbollahs' war. although they claim that they protest out of moral concern the fact is that they don't. These people are slime


If being against "death" of innocents and the destruction of life/homes/hospitals/hills/memory..........is slime, then I am slime.

The question is not for or against "war" . The question is for or against what future???? The future for those like Joo, is all about blowing up, killing, fighting, technological death, my way or nothing..........it is frightening.

I won't defend Hizbollah but I will defend their right as Lebanese to protect their country.

Israel. the U.S.A does not need to bomb these people into oblivion or to teach lessons or to enact revenge or to build billion dollar laser systems in space.

What they need is to speak, meet, negotiate, act in a civil fashion, use all means to ensure peace for their children (and all children of the world should be "their' children.). Israel should be brave and step forward to create a new way of doing things (and so should the Lebanese). This is the only way out of the quagmire.... If only we had a president worthy enough to do this, to communicate this. Instead we have Bush and his pork barrel rhetoric of "do what I want or I'll blast you to kingdom come....."

DD
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee



Joined: 25 May 2003

PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 6:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Wow, you have changed your thought pattern!!!! Miracles are occuring........


the miracle will come when you get out of denial

Quote:

If being against "death" of innocents and the destruction of life/homes/hospitals/hills/memory..........is slime, then I am slime.



Then why did Hizzbollah start the war?

Why don't they give up their war.

Quote:
The question is not for or against "war" . The question is for or against what future???? The future for those like Joo, is all about blowing up, killing, fighting, technological death, my way or nothing..........it is frightening.


You don't get it Bathists , Khomeni followers and Bin Laden followers don't believe in coexistance.


Quote:
I won't defend Hizbollah but I will defend their right as Lebanese to protect their country.


when they attack Israel were they defending their country?

Is their war defending their country?

Quote:
Israel. the U.S.A does not need to bomb these people into oblivion or to teach lessons or to enact revenge or to build billion dollar laser systems in space.


really how can Israel make those who are determined to destroy it happy?

Quote:
What they need is to speak, meet, negotiate, act in a civil fashion, use all means to ensure peace for their children (and all children of the world should be "their' children.). Israel should be brave and step forward to create a new way of doing things (and so should the Lebanese). This is the only way out of the quagmire.... If only we had a president worthy enough to do this, to communicate this. Instead we have Bush and his pork barrel rhetoric of "do what I want or I'll blast you to kingdom come....."



You don't get it Bathists , Khomeni followers and Bin Laden followers don't believe in co existance. That is the reality.

Israel got out of Lebanon , they got out of Gaza and they were attacked.
That is the reality.

Your fantasy world isn't
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Yu_Bum_suk



Joined: 25 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 11:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Junior wrote:

How do you know most of those "civilians" weren't militia?


Because most of them are women, children, and the elderly.
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bucheon bum



Joined: 16 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 1:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yu_Bum_suk wrote:
Junior wrote:

How do you know most of those "civilians" weren't militia?


Because most of them are women, children, and the elderly.


And they can't be part of a militia?

Quote:
In 1986, British authorities stopped a pregnant Irish woman whose Palestinian boyfriend packed her off with a bomb as he flew her to Tel Aviv, ostensibly to meet his family.


Quote:
As to complaints that seniors and children are searched needlessly, Melendez cited the 67-year-old man who hid a 9-inch knife in his prosthetic leg and the 10-year-old boy who unwittingly brought a teddy bear with a loaded gun -- a gift -- to the airport. Although, I should note, Melendez failed to establish that these weapons would have been used in an attack.



Go ahead, search granny

In addition, I suggest you read about Jill Carroll's experience in Iraq. There were Iraqi women and children involved.

Quote:
The first had been a tiny, three-room house among tall crops on Baghdad's western outskirts. It was a poor place, built of cinder blocks. My captors gave me a new set of clothes, and I changed in the bathroom while the stern-faced woman of the house looked on.


Kidnapped

Quote:
Then one of them said in Arabic, "What are you? What are you?"

A tiny voice next to me replied, "I'm a mujahid," a holy warrior.

It was a boy -- I'd learn that his name was Ismael, and he was 5 years old. Just a child, already indoctrinated.


Part 2

Now this is coming from an Arabic-speaking, left-leaning reporter.
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bignate



Joined: 30 Apr 2003
Location: Hell's Ditch

PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bucheon bum wrote:
Yu_Bum_suk wrote:
Junior wrote:

How do you know most of those "civilians" weren't militia?


Because most of them are women, children, and the elderly.


And they can't be part of a militia?

Quote:
In 1986, British authorities stopped a pregnant Irish woman whose Palestinian boyfriend packed her off with a bomb as he flew her to Tel Aviv, ostensibly to meet his family.


Come on bb, that one is a stretch:

Ann-Marie Murphy was duped into carrying that bomb by her lover Nezir Hindawi, the father of the child...she was never found to be complicite in that action...just a little naive. Besides that whole thing was stung by Mossad, because they had Hindawi's cousin under their thumb, and he had set him up.....
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bucheon bum



Joined: 16 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bignate wrote:
bucheon bum wrote:
Yu_Bum_suk wrote:
Junior wrote:

How do you know most of those "civilians" weren't militia?


Because most of them are women, children, and the elderly.


And they can't be part of a militia?

Quote:
In 1986, British authorities stopped a pregnant Irish woman whose Palestinian boyfriend packed her off with a bomb as he flew her to Tel Aviv, ostensibly to meet his family.


Come on bb, that one is a stretch:

Ann-Marie Murphy was duped into carrying that bomb by her lover Nezir Hindawi, the father of the child...she was never found to be complicite in that action...just a little naive. Besides that whole thing was stung by Mossad, because they had Hindawi's cousin under their thumb, and he had set him up.....


Fair enough.
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