Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Adventurer]

I am inviting sober thoughts and a debate on the issue of how Israel and the Palestinians are held accountable or not accountable for their misdeed whether it is terrorism by the militias of Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade and what is labeld as state sponsored war crimes by various human rights organizations vis-a-vis Israel.

People on the Left, will tend to sympathize with the Palestinians, but that is not so much the case in the U.S. where those on the Left are often to the right of many on the Left in Canada and Europe. People who are influenced by the U.S. media and religious beliefs, will tend to sympathize with Israel. Of course, as time goes by more Americans also blame Israel along with the Palestinians whereas they only blamed one side.
In Canada, a study by a Jewish organization found that the more Canadians felt they knew about the issues, the more they tended to sympathize with the Palestinians.

Here are my views on the matter. I believe Israel has a right to exist.
It is essentially democratic to the Jewish and Druze components of its population but not really towards the Christian and Muslim Arab citizens of the country.

Israel is recognized government, it is a coherent state with fair elections. Whenever it engages in violence it officially engages it in the name of a democratic polity. When the Palestinians engage in violence and terrorism, it is via militias like Hamas. You may argue that Hamas is now elected. I find it harder to fault the Palestinians for a lack of peace because they are not the occupying power, they are the occupied. It does not mean that I think Israel is wrong at every turn.
It was not wrong in Lebanon when it responded initially. However, after a certain point Israel was definitely wrong. I also find it strange that many seem to overlook that the settlements in many cases involved first ethnic cleansing the Arabs there and putting settlers. How is that right?
I don't understand why so many in the media pass it off as if it is nothing.


Of course, I do understand that Israelis have Christian and Jewish advocates in the U.S. and the Palestinians hardly have any. It also does not help that most are Muslim and there is a certain hostility towards Muslims after 9/11.

[Gopher]

[Adventurer]

[quote="Gopher"][quote]It is the presence of the Jewish state of Israel on territory that was once Palestine that causes the basic Middle Eastern political problem, whose magnitude cannot be exaggerated. It has been and remains the most intractible problem of world diplomacy. From 1948 on, most Arabs have refused to agree that the state of Israel has a right to exist, while the Israelis have insisted...that the Palestinian refugees have no right to a national state of their own...

Robert Stookey has writen, "The land of Palestine belongs of right to a people uniquely favored of God, the vehicle of His revelation respecting the salvation of mankind, charged with a permanent mission for the enlightenment of humanity and the establishment of justice, long the object of repression and unjustice, whose enemies are presently sustained by a world superpower for its own imperial interests."


Gopher, thanks for your contribution. I do believe religion does play a role in this. You do know Palestinians are not all Muslims and many are Christian as well. Many of the Arabs believe it is their right to be there from a historical connection to the land in being an indigenous population. This is present in the arguments Palestinians give, and they often hold old land deeds to high light that. Of course, it is a major idea touted by many supporters of the Jewish state in both the U.S. and Israel that it was decreed by the Architect of the Universe, God, Elohim that the land is for the Jews and from an Evangelical standpoint they believe
the Jews will bring them Jesus.

I agree with the idea that a Jewish state was not accepted by Arabs except secretly by Nasser (never voiced) and by the King of Jordan, unofficially. The PLO did not begin to hint at recognition until 1976 when it stated it would accept a two-state solution. Now, however, there a few states that recognize Israel.

The author is right to say that displacing many of the Palestinians by the Jewish refugees sparked the conflict. It is understandable that many Jews fleeing Germany felt they had no choice.

I do believe, it is evident that the U.S. favours pro-Israeli interests over Arab interests. There have been no Muslim Arab Congressmen or officials. We cannot count the Lebanese Catholic Maronites as they are more like the American Christian Catholic mainstream. Yet, we know many Jews have served in prominent positions including those with strong links to Israeli politicians. Of course, the Arab interests encouraged by oil does play a role as you mentioned. Saudi Arabia has its influence and Jordan has its role since it has long been pro-British and pro-American and friendly to Israel. So the Arab interests from those governments don't strongly diverse from Israel in some cases.

[Gopher]

[Julius]