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Adventurer

Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 8:01 am Post subject: Arab-Israeli peace would promote understanding- Kofi Annan |
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ISTANBUL, Turkey - U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan said Monday that any effort to stop growing violence between Islamic and Western societies must include an end to the Arab-Israeli conflict.
Annan spoke after receiving a report from a high-level group of experts on ways to alleviate Muslim-Western clashes and misunderstandings.
"We may wish to think of the Arab-Israeli conflict as just one regional conflict amongst many," said Annan, who leaves his post at the end of the year. "It is not. No other conflict carries such a powerful symbolic and emotional charge among people far removed from the battlefield."
Annan said he would work along with his successor, Ban Ki-moon, to help implement the recommendations of the report, which called for renewed efforts toward the goal of establishing "two fully sovereign and independent states coexisting side by side in peace and security."
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061113/ap_on_re_mi_ea/annan_israel |
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mateomiguel
Joined: 16 May 2005
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Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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In other news, bunnies and rainbows on every streetcorner would curb organized crime. |
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Interested

Joined: 10 Feb 2003
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Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 4:41 pm Post subject: |
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mateomiguel wrote: |
In other news, bunnies and rainbows on every streetcorner would curb organized crime. |
I think you have little understanding of how the Israel/Arab conflict affects Arabs and other muslims. They regularly see horrific footage of maimed or killed Palestinian (and this year - hundreds of Lebanese children), that we in the West do not. They are regularly reminded of the occupation in a way that we are not. It's consistently part of their collective consciousness. I think we ignore that at our peril. |
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mateomiguel
Joined: 16 May 2005
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Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 6:52 pm Post subject: |
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Interested wrote: |
I think you have little understanding of how the Israel/Arab conflict affects Arabs and other muslims. They regularly see horrific footage of maimed or killed Palestinian (and this year - hundreds of Lebanese children), that we in the West do not. They are regularly reminded of the occupation in a way that we are not. It's consistently part of their collective consciousness. I think we ignore that at our peril. |
WHAT?! I'm constantly bombarded with the exact numbers of Palestinians who are killed each and every day. There's not a news outlet in the world that doesn't focus on this conflict with obsession. Its been the #1 news story since before I was even born. Its discussed on the Internet endlessly in ever more ludicrous circles.
I think its entirely inaccurate to say that we are not aware of the conflict. I'm TOO aware of the conflict. |
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Slep
Joined: 14 Oct 2006
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Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 7:00 pm Post subject: |
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I'm sorry, unless you've walked through a checkpoint, just missed being killed by a suicide bomber or cowered during an incursion, you don't get it. The major networks do a horrible job of expressing this. |
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Interested

Joined: 10 Feb 2003
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Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 10:39 pm Post subject: |
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mateomiguel wrote: |
Interested wrote: |
I think you have little understanding of how the Israel/Arab conflict affects Arabs and other muslims. They regularly see horrific footage of maimed or killed Palestinian (and this year - hundreds of Lebanese children), that we in the West do not. They are regularly reminded of the occupation in a way that we are not. It's consistently part of their collective consciousness. I think we ignore that at our peril. |
WHAT?! I'm constantly bombarded with the exact numbers of Palestinians who are killed each and every day. There's not a news outlet in the world that doesn't focus on this conflict with obsession. Its been the #1 news story since before I was even born. Its discussed on the Internet endlessly in ever more ludicrous circles.
I think its entirely inaccurate to say that we are not aware of the conflict. I'm TOO aware of the conflict. |
Slep is quite correct. You have no idea.
You may be 'bombarded by numbers' but that's all pretty abstract without the in your face footage of the carnage, and personal testimony of eyewitnesses that Arabs are regularly exposed to. What you get on the BBC is all pretty sanitised.
Whether you like it or not, Arabs feel a great sense of injustice, and that's feeding into the radicalisation of young muslims that we are seeing now. The conflict is a treasure trove for Al Quaeda's recruiters to exploit. Implement a satisfactory peace agreement - and you take a lot of fuel out of the militants' cause. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 11:08 pm Post subject: |
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Interested wrote: |
mateomiguel wrote: |
Interested wrote: |
I think you have little understanding of how the Israel/Arab conflict affects Arabs and other muslims. They regularly see horrific footage of maimed or killed Palestinian (and this year - hundreds of Lebanese children), that we in the West do not. They are regularly reminded of the occupation in a way that we are not. It's consistently part of their collective consciousness. I think we ignore that at our peril. |
WHAT?! I'm constantly bombarded with the exact numbers of Palestinians who are killed each and every day. There's not a news outlet in the world that doesn't focus on this conflict with obsession. Its been the #1 news story since before I was even born. Its discussed on the Internet endlessly in ever more ludicrous circles.
I think its entirely inaccurate to say that we are not aware of the conflict. I'm TOO aware of the conflict. |
Slep is quite correct. You have no idea.
You may be 'bombarded by numbers' but that's all pretty abstract without the in your face footage of the carnage, and personal testimony of eyewitnesses that Arabs are regularly exposed to. What you get on the BBC is all pretty sanitised.
Whether you like it or not, Arabs feel a great sense of injustice, and that's feeding into the radicalisation of young muslims that we are seeing now. The conflict is a treasure trove for Al Quaeda's recruiters to exploit. Implement a satisfactory peace agreement - and you take a lot of fuel out of the militants' cause. |
Well, the isn't the reason there is so much violence in Gaza is because Sharon pulled out, and thereafter Hamas took power and refused to recognize Israel. You can't have a peace agreement that way. The current violence seems to me to be Israel's way of discrediting Hamas.
Call it terrorism, I think it is exactly that. But if Israel can abide by an equitable peace deal that includes the Hamas PM stepping down, at least we can have an argument over whether the ends justify the means (as opposed to Iraq, where the ends are so poor the argument can't even be advanced). |
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Adventurer

Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 5:27 am Post subject: |
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Kuros, you are right Mateus does not quite understand the mental anguish that the Palestinians feel, the feeling of being stuck between the scylla and charybdis or a rock and a hard place. There are thousands of Palestinians who have been arrested, tortured, who have had relatives who were simply killed as collateral damage, had tons of their homes bull dozed in Gaza while the world says nothing. We know that when the U.S. was hit with Sept.11th in a particular part of the country, mind you, there was so much rage. Most of Palestine's West Bank, for example, is not spared from checks points everywhere disconnecting the people from each other, settlements taking more and more land from the Palestinians, harassing settlers, farmers who sometimes cannot access their olive trees, and so many cannot get a proper education.
The Arabs and Muslims feel much sympathy when it comes to the Palestinians. And when they keep getting accounts from the West Bank and Gaza, they feel immense rage and feel they want to get even with someone. Capisce?
However, I will say I am not pleased with this Hamas government. They are quite annoying, not respecting past agreements. I will say, however, Israel has had governments that didn't recognize past agreements or understandings. Netanyahu would not recognize Oslo, for example. But, that is another topic. |
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Slep
Joined: 14 Oct 2006
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Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 6:35 am Post subject: |
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i was reading on haaretz today that the ratio of palestinians to israelis killed since july is almost 80:1 |
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