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Alias
Joined: 24 Jan 2003
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 Posted: Sun Nov 05, 2006 8:00 pm Post subject: Panhandling |
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Is it just me or has the problem become worse across Canadians cities?
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On a warm afternoon last April, Toronto city councillor Michael Thompson was hustling across Nathan Phillips Square in front of City Hall with his assistant in tow when a drunk man approached demanding money.
Mr. Thompson was late for a meeting and attempted to brush past with a polite refusal. He made it a few steps before he was struck in the back with a small ball. A confrontation ensued, the councillor was shoved and the man was arrested and charged with two counts of assault, after a brief chase by Mr. Thompson's assistant through the nearby Eaton Centre.
Mr. Thompson appeared reluctant the next day to use the incident to score political points. "I'm not hurt. I'm fine," he told reporters with uncharacteristic sheepishness. But while the councillor seemed to wish the whole incident forgotten, one of his colleagues saw a starting point for a crusade.
Councillor Jane Pitfield, four months into a faltering mayoralty run, immediately introduced a motion calling for a "quality of life" bylaw that would outlaw aggressive panhandling and make the streets safe again for harried politicians.
Her fellow councillors booted the idea into bureaucratic limbo, but Ms. Pitfield continues to champion the idea. Indeed, with days left in the mayoral campaign, her final policy announcement next week will focus on reviving the bylaw idea.
In stride with politicians ranging from former Ontario premier Mike Harris to retired New York mayor Rudy Giuliani, she clearly believes the issue resonates with voters.
From Vancouver's scramble to clean up the city's long-running panhandling problem in time for the 2010 Olympics to various efforts by the city of Halifax to stop people from being harassed whenever they go to a bank machine, politicians across the country have grappled with an issue that is regarded either as a sad consequence of modern urban living or as a civic problem that must be cured.
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MONTREAL
Montreal does not have a bylaw targeting beggars, but police have other legal tools and often ticket people for blocking the circulation of pedestrians and cars. A recent study from a homeless advocacy group found 30 homeless people are jailed a day for non-payment of panhandling-related fines. "Yes, of course there is a lot of people panhandling," said homeless advocate Bernard St-Jacques. ''I work in downtown Montreal, near St. Catherine Street, [and you] can find two, three, six panhandlers on a day where you go around."
VANCOUVER
Vancouver has tried, with little success, to curb panhandling, with public awareness campaigns, spare change meters, a Safe Streets Act and bylaws. Aggressive panhandling is a daily reality, said Walt Judas, Tourism Vancouver's director of marketing and communications. Vancouver's bylaw restricts panhandlers from obstructing pedestrian traffic; continuing solicitation after the pedestrian has refused; soliciting in a group of three or more; and soliciting within 10 metres of a bank or an ATM.
CALGARY
Calgary recently finished its second annual anti-panhandling ad campaign, and this summer the Calgary Downtown Association launched a campaign to persuade people to donate money to agencies instead of beggars. "Calgary is doing well financially, you get people looking to cash in on that ... I'd say the presence of panhandlers is a little higher now,'' said Russ Bugera, who headed the campaign.
HALIFAX
Halifax does not have any bylaws or acts controlling panhandling, but city councillors asked the province more than a year ago to consider enacting a Safe Streets Act, similar to Vancouver's. Councillor Dawne Sloane said the province has yet to get back to the city. "I've heard of people going up to people at bank machines and saying, 'I just saw you take out money, gimme some,' " she said.
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Demophobe
Joined: 17 May 2004
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2006 2:37 am Post subject: Re: Panhandling |
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| Alias wrote: |
| Is it just me or has the problem become worse across Canadians cities? |
It's just you. Nobody else sees anything. |
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Pa Jan Jo A Hamnida
Joined: 27 Oct 2006
Location: Not Korea
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2006 7:55 am Post subject: |
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| It's bad. Just yesterday, I was hit up by a homeless guy who was stationed inside my local McDonald's. Pathetic. |
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Alias
Joined: 24 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2006 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Its that there are so many recreational panhandlers out there that bothers me. You see this in every Canadian city. I've yet to see a young able bodied male panhandling in Korea. |
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laogaiguk
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2006 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Alias wrote: |
| Its that there are so many recreational panhandlers out there that bothers me. You see this in every Canadian city. I've yet to see a young able bodied male panhandling in Korea. |
If you see them, they probably don't really need the money. Many younger (teenage) panhandlers now go back home to their nice families and lives after making money panhandling. Squigee (sp?) kids too. It is becoming a really big problem, even in small towns of 100 000. Laws are being passed now. Most homeless people (and I actually do know several incase you are wondering) don't do that, they already know where the soup kitchen or other help stations are. They also usually try to commit some crime right around now, and go to jail for the winter. |
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sillywilly
Joined: 20 Jan 2003
Location: Canada.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2006 10:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Haven't seen it get worse in Ottawa |
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Dev
Joined: 18 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 10:07 pm Post subject: |
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The solution to this problem is pretty simple really.
Just don't give these guys any money.
If everybody followed this advice, the panhandlers would give up. |
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Alias
Joined: 24 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 10:15 pm Post subject: |
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| There was a problem in my home city last summer. An influx of recreational panhandlers who hitchhiked to our city from bigger centres like Toronto. They came because it was easier to bum money off our naive folks then it was back in Toronto where people would mostly ignore them. |
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Dev
Joined: 18 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 10:46 pm Post subject: |
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| What's the deal with these guys crawling around the sidewalks on skateboards playing the sad music? They also have their (leg or legs???? ) covered in black rubber. When I first saw one, I felt bad. I thought he was a legitimate amputee. But since then, I've been seeing these guys in every city in Korea. I smell a scam. This isn't Cambodia, you know? |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 6:23 am Post subject: |
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| Best thing to do is if you see one saddling up to you, turn to him/her and ask in a a very needy one, "hey man, uhhh, do you happen to have a dollar, I lost my bus ticket." The response you will get will be priceless! |
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uberscheisse
Joined: 02 Dec 2003
Location: japan is better than korea.
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| Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 7:23 am Post subject: |
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| Dev wrote: |
| What's the deal with these guys crawling around the sidewalks on skateboards playing the sad music? They also have their (leg or legs????) covered in black rubber. When I first saw one, I felt bad. I thought he was a legitimate amputee. But since then, I've been seeing these guys in every city in Korea. I smell a scam. This isn't Cambodia, you know? |
i see the same 2-3 guys around seoul and have been since i got here. i see no new people in seoul trying out that particular shtick - which leads me to believe they 1. have a monopoly on the "tires-on-the-legs" look and punch the crap out of anyone who nicks it or 2. they're legit war amp dudes who are legitimately poor in a society that doesn't think too much of welfare for people who actually need it.
odd that you see it in different cities. i think the fact that the dude i see in itaewon has a hook on his arm indicates a real-life amputee situation.
in canada - i'm surprised the legitimately poor haven't ganged up on the younger crowd with strong backs and kicked the shit out of them. panhandling is some serious business.
and - in vancouver especially - despite the DANGEROUS SPECTER OF AGGRESSIVE PANHANDLING the "problem" is generally overblown. people who grew up in the suburbs who never see that stuff move downtown and encounter real poor people - not the kind who own their house but dad lost his job and they have to go to the food bank for a month or two - people who have absolutely nothing... and the sight is a foreign, scary one.
or "wait... i bought this apartment in this neighborhood because the property value was low. now i want the property value to go up, so get these dirty folk out of here". any screed against panhandling is generally driven by making vancouver a "world-class city" - which it's never going to be. olympics or no olympics. |
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tomwaits
Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Location: PC Bong
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| Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 12:51 pm Post subject: |
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Speaking of Canada---Iv'e been in Calgary and Edmonton the last year. While you see all these "shortage of labour" stories the panhandling is out of this world. Go downtown and it's constant----spare change, got a smoke? spare busfare etc etc.
Its depressing and even shames me a little-ASians have too much pride and would not accept this...
Not unsympathetic but too many healthy and sane people on the bum
YES it has got worse- there are tons of jobs in Alberta so it is all a bit absurd. (But I will admit there is a rntal crisies) |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 4:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Alias wrote: |
| Its that there are so many recreational panhandlers out there that bothers me. You see this in every Canadian city. I've yet to see a young able bodied male panhandling in Korea. |
I've noticed even 80 year old men are doing some kind of menial labor in Korea. However much I hate those people selling crap on the subways, I take the view they're at least trying to earn money and not just expecting a hand out. Of course, since Korea offers no actual hand out, they really have little choice.
You do see SOME here but it's not of the recreational type. Like some suburban kids decide they're being abused by their parents because they got a USED car for their 18th birthday and their parents put a VCR and not a TIVO in their bedroom. So they'll go panhandle for a summer and try 'n' make it in the goth scene. Of course, Ontario winter does have a way of thinning the herd of the punters.
It bothered me you'd walk down Yonge street in Toronto and pretty much every pan handler I saw were able bodied young males and females and then you went to the Eaton center food court and everyone cleaning vomit off the tables were East Indians and other immigrants. Maybe things have changed, but I almost never saw an immigrant pan handling.
The squeegee kids bothered me to the max. |
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Green Tea
Joined: 04 Nov 2006
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| Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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| It has gotten worse in the last few years. I've noticed a lot more dirty drunk Natives and scummy looking junkie types stammering around downtown Ottawa and Toronto since I've moved back here. 5 years ago it was not as bad. I hear it has gotten really bad in Vancouver because of the drug culture. I have a cousin from Kamloops who went missing for a year and half, then turned up back home a few months ago. Turns out she had become a crack and heroin addict and was prostituting herself in Vancouver to pay for the habit. |
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davai!
Joined: 04 Dec 2005
Location: Kuwait
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| Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 5:38 pm Post subject: |
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| What do they serve at the Eaton center food court? |
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