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why midnight runs?
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mytime



Joined: 15 Oct 2006

PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 6:12 am    Post subject: why midnight runs? Reply with quote

So I have been here 3 years now and I met maybe 5 people who "ran away"
And all of them left like a thief in the night
It made me wonder why a teacher don't just tell his boss he's leaving, say on the weekend?

I mean if you don't have outstanding bills or anything else, why run away?
Just tell your boss you quit
Surely your boss can't prevent you from leaving the country. Even if you have a contract and it says you have to give notice, you can leave when you want.

My boss told me that the previous teacher before me ran away and he (my boss) called the police....what can the police do? It's not a crime to break a civil law contract and they definitely cant force a foreigner to stay in a country unless he broke the law.
Or does Korea have different laws?
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mateomiguel



Joined: 16 May 2005

PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 6:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

passive-aggressive revenge?
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ttompatz



Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea

PostPosted: Fri Nov 10, 2006 6:36 am    Post subject: Re: why midnight runs? Reply with quote

mytime wrote:
So I have been here 3 years now and I met maybe 5 people who "ran away"
And all of them left like a thief in the night
It made me wonder why a teacher don't just tell his boss he's leaving, say on the weekend?

I mean if you don't have outstanding bills or anything else, why run away?
Just tell your boss you quit
Surely your boss can't prevent you from leaving the country. Even if you have a contract and it says you have to give notice, you can leave when you want.

My boss told me that the previous teacher before me ran away and he (my boss) called the police....what can the police do? It's not a crime to break a civil law contract and they definitely cant force a foreigner to stay in a country unless he broke the law.
Or does Korea have different laws?


Why run away?

I can think of a couple of good reasons.

The MAIN one is: if you give notice you will NOT get paid afterward.
Your boss will come up with all manner of illegal deductions to deduct from your final month or 2 of pay. I can't think of anyone who wants to work a month or 2 for free.

I have also known some bosses to use intimidation and threats to keep a worker against their will. A hakwon without a teacher soon has no students or revenue. They have a very strong incentive to lie, intimidate, threaten and coerce young foreigners who are a long way from home, may not know any better and are isolated from any support.

I have NEVER known anyone who works in a hakwon who got everything that he was entitled to under the law. Most are cheated out of health care and pension. Most are cheated on overtime and class/working hours. Many are cheated out of airfare or visa run expenses. Most are cheated on their severance to some degree.

If you worked for 3 years in hakwons I can guarantee that you have been cheated out of some of your LEGALLY entitled benefits as REQUIRED by law.
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archer904



Joined: 04 Sep 2006

PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 9:55 am    Post subject: Re: why midnight runs? Reply with quote

[edit]

Last edited by archer904 on Mon Nov 20, 2006 12:24 am; edited 1 time in total
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kangnam mafioso



Joined: 27 Jan 2003
Location: Teheranno

PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i signed a year contract and had to leave after 3 months. i gave a 30 day notice and repaid the one-way airfare back to the hogwan. everything was paid to me that was owed and my visa was cancelled in the appropriate way so if i want to return i don't have to get a release letter and all that. the owners were pretty cool about the whole thing. so -- it is posssible to leave without doing a runner and not get ripped off.
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BigBuds



Joined: 15 Sep 2005
Location: Changwon

PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 12:41 pm    Post subject: Re: why midnight runs? Reply with quote

archer904 wrote:
mytime wrote:

My boss told me that the previous teacher before me ran away and he (my boss) called the police....what can the police do? It's not a crime to break a civil law contract and they definitely cant force a foreigner to stay in a country unless he broke the law.
Or does Korea have different laws?


Korea has different laws. Your E-2 Visa is sponsored by your employer and you may only leave the country with your employer's permission. If you attempt to leave the country without permission, you can be detained (long enough to make you miss your flight), fined (I understand it is about a million won) and then given an exit order (forcing you to get another flight).


You are seriously misinformed.

You don't need your employers permission to leave the country. I've been here over 5 years and have several times gone overseas during Chuseok and Sal lal without my employers knowing I had gone until I returned.

If what you're saying was the case, then no one would be able to do a midnight runner.

If you're wondering how I know this, I now own a hagwon and have foreign teachers working for me and what you've said is in no way a part of the sponsorship agreement.

Before you give out information, check it first.

Edit:spelling mistakes. That's what I get for posting drunk at around 5am.


Last edited by BigBuds on Mon Nov 13, 2006 2:31 am; edited 1 time in total
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babtangee



Joined: 18 Dec 2004
Location: OMG! Charlie has me surrounded!

PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah... totally off the wall assumptions there, archer. "Can't leave the country without your employer's permission." What are we, imported sweat shop workers? ROFLMFAO!
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mateomiguel



Joined: 16 May 2005

PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

despite how you may feel, you are not in white slavery or indentured servitude. The cops will not hunt you down if you are late for class.
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twg



Joined: 02 Nov 2006
Location: Getting some fresh air...

PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 5:21 pm    Post subject: Re: why midnight runs? Reply with quote

ttompatz wrote:
I have NEVER known anyone who works in a hakwon who got everything that he was entitled to under the law.

I have gotten everything that was coming to me, and even a bit of a bonus once.

It really depends upon the hagwon. There are some honest ones out there. But the rule of thumb is "watch your ass" for a reason.

Most of the runners I've witnessed have been people who just decided that they didnt want to do this anymore and left the weekend after payday. I even saw one girl and her boyfriend arrive on a Wednesday, and leave on a Saturday. Why? She didn't like teaching kindy.

I mean, it doesn't take too long to discover if you're working for a sleazeball operation, and if your boss has screwed over others, he or she will probably screw you over as well. But the only excuse I can see for pulling a runner is if you really ARE being screwed over by your boss.

My belief is thus: The money in your pocket is priority number one here in EFL land. If that's not being met, you leave. Makes sense right?
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jmbran11



Joined: 19 Jan 2006
Location: U.S.

PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 7:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I did a midnight run five years ago, so I'll answer on behalf of those in my sitution. Some of us fear that the employer will cause big problems for them, including getting the police involved. Yes, we are not slaves, but when you are young and you have an employer who has demonstrated some particular nastiness, you really don't know what he/she may be capable of. For example, I was positive that if I told my employer that I wanted to quit, I would be immediately evicted from my apartment and told to leave that night. I was afraid I would be locked out or that the police would be there to physically restrain me from leaving the country. Quitting your job may not be a crime, but your employer could report you for virtually any other (untrue) crime under the sun and cause you serious legal trouble. I was afraid I would be sued for breaking my contract and expected to return my airfare or somehow sued for something else, with no idea how the legal system worked. I was afraid that my employer would do anything and use any of his personal connections to wreak vengeance.

Now, five years older, it sounds ridiculous, but when you are scared, you just want to get away. When you see bad enough sides of someone that you honestly, truly believe they are capable of anything, and you live in a country where you don't know the law, don't speak the language, and don't know who to turn to for help - a midnight run seems the only option. Let me say that now that I work for reputable employer whom I trust, I would never, ever consider running.

On the flip side, if someone does something mean enough to you, you just want to screw them over. And, by having a popular teacher simply not show up for work one day, it's a form of getting even.


Last edited by jmbran11 on Tue Nov 14, 2006 2:13 am; edited 1 time in total
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djsmnc



Joined: 20 Jan 2003
Location: Dave's ESL Cafe

PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 8:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Captain Corea



Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Sun Nov 12, 2006 9:43 pm    Post subject: Re: why midnight runs? Reply with quote

archer904 wrote:

Korea has different laws. Your E-2 Visa is sponsored by your employer and you may only leave the country with your employer's permission. If you attempt to leave the country without permission, you can be detained (long enough to make you miss your flight), fined (I understand it is about a million won) and then given an exit order (forcing you to get another flight).


Man, where did you get that load of bull from??

Seriously, where is your source?
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archer904



Joined: 04 Sep 2006

PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 7:50 am    Post subject: Re: why midnight runs? Reply with quote

BigBuds wrote:


You are seriously misinformed.

You don't need your employers permission to leave the country. I've been here over 5 years and have several times gone overseas during Chuseok and Sal lal without my employers knowing I had gone until I returned.


I didn't mean it was physically impossible. I meant it is against the law. Whether or not they choose to act on that if they find out is their own choice.
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archer904



Joined: 04 Sep 2006

PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 7:52 am    Post subject: Re: why midnight runs? Reply with quote

Captain Corea wrote:


Seriously, where is your source?


Experience.
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JongnoGuru



Joined: 25 May 2004
Location: peeing on your doorstep

PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 8:06 am    Post subject: Re: why midnight runs? Reply with quote

archer904 wrote:
Captain Corea wrote:


Seriously, where is your source?


Experience.

Is this something unique to the E2 Visa, that you need your employer's permission to, say, spend a weekend in Japan?
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