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theace41
Joined: 18 Nov 2006
Location: not there yet
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 Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2006 7:01 pm Post subject: YBM in seomyun -info please |
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| Anybody know anything about this place good or bad? I have heard that the pay is slightly lower, but im willing to put up with that if they are otherwise OK. |
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soviet_man
Joined: 23 Apr 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2006 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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I assume you mean "Ssangmun" (note spelling) not "Seomyun" in the Nowon area?
I don't think there is any suburb called "Seomyun" but I could be wrong.
A typical YBM ECC will provide housing, airfare and monthly pay on time. But that is about it.
You will most likely teach 8 x 40 minute classes per day (maybe 3.00pm-9.15pm) PLUS you will most likely also be roped into doing a couple of mornings a week of kindergarten.
Pay is low at 2.0 million. After YBM's various deductions it will be about 1.87 a month. A further unlawful 600,000 housing deposit will be deducted in the first 3 months which is standard policy.
A typical YBM ECC has 5-6 foreign teachers (usually 21/22 year olds who have just graduated) and 5-6 K teachers. Depending on the size of the branch.
Compared to working in factory, yes YBM is "ok" - but most people who have some vague qualifications / experience should be able to do a little better. |
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kat2
Joined: 25 Oct 2005
Location: Busan, South Korea
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| Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2006 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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| or do you mean Seomyeon in Busan? |
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Homer
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| Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:39 am Post subject: |
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Soviet man...not to beat a dead horse here but the deposit is not unlawful if it is contractually agreed to.....
As for YBM...some are excellent first job schools, some are not.
If you mean Somyon in Busan, the YBM school there is an ELS (adult students) and the split shift is pretty brutal (early morning classes, off from 10 to 5pm and then on from 5pm to 10pm). |
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gang ah jee
Joined: 14 Jan 2003
Location: city of paper
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| Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2006 12:47 pm Post subject: |
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| soviet_man wrote: |
I assume you mean "Ssangmun" (note spelling) not "Seomyun" in the Nowon area?
I don't think there is any suburb called "Seomyun" but I could be wrong.
A typical YBM ECC will provide housing, airfare and monthly pay on time. But that is about it.
You will most likely teach 8 x 40 minute classes per day (maybe 3.00pm-9.15pm) PLUS you will most likely also be roped into doing a couple of mornings a week of kindergarten.
Pay is low at 2.0 million. After YBM's various deductions it will be about 1.87 a month. A further unlawful 600,000 housing deposit will be deducted in the first 3 months which is standard policy.
A typical YBM ECC has 5-6 foreign teachers (usually 21/22 year olds who have just graduated) and 5-6 K teachers. Depending on the size of the branch.
Compared to working in factory, yes YBM is "ok" - but most people who have some vague qualifications / experience should be able to do a little better. |
'Ssangmun' to 'Seomyun' would be a pretty impressive typo, sort of like spelling 'New York' as 'Nebraska'.
But yeah, I've worked at an ELS before, and everything is above board and provided as per contract. Actual working conditions at individual branches may vary due to different internal management policies, but overall YBM head office is a fair and honest employer. If you are satisfied with the conditions and are prepared to work split-shifts for a year, go for it.
Also, it might be worth noting that ELS doesn't take a housing deposit. Instead they lend you 10 mil for key money and help you find your own place. |
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spliff
Joined: 19 Jan 2004
Location: Khon Kaen, Thailand
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| Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2006 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
Soviet man...not to beat a dead horse here but the deposit is not unlawful if it is contractually agreed to.....
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But, why would you agree to submit to an illegal action in a contract.  |
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soviet_man
Joined: 23 Apr 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2006 6:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
Soviet man...not to beat a dead horse here but the deposit is not unlawful if it is contractually agreed to.....
But, why would you agree to submit to an illegal action in a contract. |
Obviously the 600,000 housing deposit is basically blackmail to keep the teacher/s from quitting. We know that. They know that.
So if a teacher runs - they won't get the deposit back.
I don't dispute it is certainly their choice to sign such a contract, but that doesn't make it ethical and most sensible people would conclude that such practices can only be justified on very shaky legal grounds. |
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Homer
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| Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2006 9:28 am Post subject: |
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It can be seen as blackmail or as securiy for the school.
A teacher who lawfully quits or finishes his contract while leaving no unpaid bills or damage to the accomodation would get his deposit back.
But of course...its all about the bad schools and the innocent teachers who never, ever take advantage of their employers or just run into the night because they are immature or irresponsible...nawww that could never happen right comrade stalin?
Also..deposits for accomodations are asked the world over...this is no abuse of power unless of course the school ends up cheating the teacher (which happens of course).
I know my YBm school (first job) took a deposit and I got it back in full at the end of my contract as did all the other teachers who worked there save two...the first because he ran into the night after 2 months (went home to mommy) and the other because when the supervisor went to check the accomodation a week before the end of her contract, he found the place to be trashed (broken appliances for example). Then they checked with utility companies and found some unpaid bills so no deposit refund.
A deposit policy can make a lot of sense for many employers. What is required is a level of confidence between the employer and employee for this to work. |
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soviet_man
Joined: 23 Apr 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2006 4:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| But of course...its all about the bad schools and the innocent teachers who never, ever take advantage of their employers or just run into the night because they are immature or irresponsible...nawww that could never happen right comrade stalin? |
Homer, did you know Danny Kim? Because up until this year, company-owned YBM ECC's were paying foreign teachers as low as 1.8 for 95hrs and still taking the 600,000 deduction.
That changed a few months ago. Now they are paying 2.0 for 105hrs minimum, which is just as bad.
So on a 105hr contract, you would teach either 7 or 8 (40 minute) classes per day (Mon-Fri) and still not reach overtime, because of the formula they use to calculate pay.
It is basically coercion and people are usually not told about this structure (by the company) before they sign the contract. |
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Wrench
Joined: 07 Apr 2005
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| Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2006 8:33 pm Post subject: |
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| YBM blows period. They are the worst of the worst imho. |
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gang ah jee
Joined: 14 Jan 2003
Location: city of paper
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| Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2006 8:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Wrench wrote: |
| YBM blows period. They are the worst of the worst imho. |
Have you ever worked for YBM? Or were you working for a franchised mom-n-pop hakwon that bought the ECC logo and syllabus? |
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some waygug-in
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2006 9:09 pm Post subject: |
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I had a "sort of interview" with the branch in question 2 years ago.
The person in charge of hiring came down to talk to me in the lobby.
Why? I guess she was too busy to conduct real interviews..who knows?
She looked over my resume, talked to me a bit, asked how long I had been in Korea...yada yada.
Then she told me that they had no jobs at the moment, but told me that if I wanted, I could be on call as a sub for a month or so and depending on my performance, they would decide if I would be worthy of a real job offer. 
Kind of makes one want to jump up and shout,"yeeeehoooo" doesn't it.
Needless to say, I declined their generous offer. |
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Homer
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 5:19 am Post subject: |
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Your point is what soviet man?
YBM should pay more because they ask for a deposit? 
I am not disputing that YBM pays below the average sometimes. They also ask for a housing deposit.
On the plus side, a YBM gig can be a good first job as many of their schools are well organized with a stable curriculum and live up to the contract to a fault.
That can be a good deal for an inexperienced newbie. Sometimes, higher pay is not everything soviet man. Also, what good is a higher wage if you sign on with a school that does not pay you in full or cheats you?
As for this:
| Quote: |
| It is basically coercion and people are usually not told about this structure (by the company) before they sign the contract. |
If you mean the hours and number of classes per day...it is not a coercion...it is written in the contract plain and simple and a reasonably intelligent person can figure out that x number of hours per day = x number of 40 minute classes...
Same with the deposit as it is included in the contract black on white.
Now if the teacher does not take the time read the contract carefully before signing why should that be an employers fault??? |
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Roch
Joined: 24 Apr 2003
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 10:20 am Post subject: |
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| some waygug-in wrote: |
I had a "sort of interview" with the branch in question 2 years ago.
The person in charge of hiring came down to talk to me in the lobby.
Why? I guess she was too busy to conduct real interviews..who knows?
She looked over my resume, talked to me a bit, asked how long I had been in Korea...yada yada.
Then she told me that they had no jobs at the moment, but told me that if I wanted, I could be on call as a sub for a month or so and depending on my performance, they would decide if I would be worthy of a real job offer. :roll:
Kind of makes one want to jump up and shout,"yeeeehoooo" doesn't it.
:?
Needless to say, I declined their generous offer. |
Word!. |
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