|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| How long have you been at your current job? |
| 1 year |
|
13% |
[ 7 ] |
| 2 years |
|
15% |
[ 8 ] |
| 3 years |
|
15% |
[ 8 ] |
| 4 years |
|
7% |
[ 4 ] |
| more than 4 years |
|
5% |
[ 3 ] |
| less than 1 year |
|
42% |
[ 22 ] |
|
| Total Votes : 52 |
|
| Author |
Message |
cubanlord
Joined: 08 Jul 2005
Location: In Japan!
|
 Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 12:37 am Post subject: There seems to be an influx in the amount... |
 |
|
of posted threads regarding resigning and bad hogwons. In light of the current trends, I would like to see how many of you have been at the same place. What has kept you there?
My wife and I have been at the same place for approximately 3 years. A balance of good pay and vacation coupled with a kind and helpful staff has kept us resigning. Most likely, we'll be staying a few more years. Truth is, I'd hate to give up a good thing for an unknown. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ilovebdt
Joined: 03 Jun 2005
Location: Nr Seoul
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 1:18 am Post subject: |
|
|
I have been at my present school for nearly two years.
What kept me here was my great co-teachers and lovely kids.
I won't be staying any longer because of the inflexibility of the principal. Also, I need a new challenge and want to diversify into youth work and child counselling therefore I need to go back to uni.
ilovebdt |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Saxiif
Joined: 15 May 2003
Location: Seongnam
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 2:02 am Post subject: |
|
|
Bit over two years.
The $$ is nice  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Alyallen
Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Location: The 4th Greatest Place on Earth = Jeonju!!!
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 2:06 am Post subject: |
|
|
Over a year. It will be a little under two when I finally leave. I want to go back to the U.S. and get my masters in TESOL and/or Special Ed.
Why I stick around:
Good money
Great students
Supportive co teacher
autonomy in the classroom
Great resources
Good place for ME to learn about teaching |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
schwa
Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Yap
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 3:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
I was very content at one hagwon for a couple years & had every intention of recontracting. Just then a public school position presented itself, offered some fresh incitements, & after a bit of hesitation, I jumped.
Quantum shift. Sometimes there really are greener pastures. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
wylies99
Joined: 13 May 2006
Location: I'm one cool cat!
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 4:51 am Post subject: |
|
|
With so many crooked recruiters and hogwan owners/directors out there, expect stories to be posted. 
Unis English in Wonju was the latest to be posted for no pay, pension or health insurance. Ever hear of that hogwan, cubanlord? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Corporal
Joined: 25 Jan 2003
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 5:43 am Post subject: |
|
|
| It's in my ticker. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sadsac
Joined: 22 Dec 2003
Location: Gwangwang
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 6:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Into our 3rd year, previously spent 3 years at another hogwan. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 6:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
I've been here for less than a year; the last place went bankrupt. Many people have done runners, because they had bosses who paid them late, exploited them, didn't pay their pension and went home. Your poll won't capture those who were swindled. I know two people who did runners.
One girl from New York got tired of being exploited. I doubt she got her pension. She was paid late here and there, he would try to cheat them every penny he could. So she left. The other fellow was an Irish guy who got fed up with his boss's attitude, the fact that there weren't really any materials there, real sense of business there, kids of different levels were in the same class. So, when he got a call from Ireland "Your uncle is sick, so if you don't like too much down there come on home". And he had little motivation to stay and left.
I feel more confident about my current job. I like my current management. I think, however, there is a reason there is a shortage of teachers. There are too many horror stories. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
polonius
Joined: 05 Jun 2004
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 9:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
| I have been at my hagwon for almost 5 years. I have been a manager for 4. I run the foreign staff, my supervisors trust me, and allow me to pass that trust onto my teachers. I like it because when I speak, they listen. I am not a yes man. I have gone up against upper management when I thought it was right, but I have also come down on my subordonants when I thought it was needed. Perfect place to work...perhaps not, but I have yet to find the perfect place. I am happy, and will stay here. There is at least mobility for foreign staff here. Not simply the monkey in front of the class to appease the parents. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cubanlord
Joined: 08 Jul 2005
Location: In Japan!
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 3:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| wylies99 wrote: |
With so many crooked recruiters and hogwan owners/directors out there, expect stories to be posted.
Unis English in Wonju was the latest to be posted for no pay, pension or health insurance. Ever hear of that hogwan, cubanlord? |
As a matter of fact, yes. I recruited English_Ocean & Half_Pint (aka Rhonda Parsons: the same person with 2 different names on Dave's) for that hogwon. I knew the owner before she started the Hogwon. The part-time foreigners and the full-time foreigner I knew there never had a problem except for the owners unorganized way of doing things. They always got paid on time and had everything else covered (though I did know of another dude, whom I spoke to once, pulled a runner because he liked it better in Japan). I spoke to him and that was his reasoning. He stated and I quote, "Japan is much better than Korea, I can't wait to go back". This guy was fluent in Japanese; little did anyone know that he was going to miss Japan that much. This is what he told me.
The hogwon DID not pay into the pension and insurance. However, wylies99, what you are missing here is the other side of the story. Allow me to elaborate:
Never once did Rhonda go up to the hogwon and put her foot down. Never once did she say, "hey, I am not going to work or go to the labor board and report you." She could have stood up for herself and said if the hogwon does not pay for her pension and medical, then, she doesn�t work. She didn't as she states in a previous thread that "going to the labor board is intimidating" (http://www.eslcafe.com/forums/korea/viewtopic.php?t=82515&start=0) .
I'm sorry, but, if you cannot stick up for yourself, then of course you will get walked on in life. Is that to say the hogwon is innocent? No, it is only to say that Rhonda allowed this stuff to happen and did NOTHING. And, to add to it, when Rhonda was hurt, the owner of the hogwon took her to the hospital and paid for 50% of the expenses. Now, considering the hogwon owner was inexperienced, I think she tried to do the best. Still, that isn't acceptable but only shows the flaw in Korea allowing anyone to become a hogwon owner.
Both parties were at fault here: The hogwon for not paying pension and health care (though they did provide it and paid 50% of the expenses through a private practitioner) and Rhonda's fault for not sticking up for herself and letting people walk all over her.
Regarding the pay?  Rhonda was paid in full every time (I made sure of this). As a matter of fact, the morning that Rhonda left Korea, she called up the owner of the hogwon and said, "today is payday, can you please pay me in the morning?" The hogwon owner went immediately to the bank to pay her salary in full (as she always did). She didn't have to pay Rhonda in the AM, but did out of courtesy to Rhonda's request. Little did the owner know that Rhonda was pulling a runner on her and wanted the last pay before she flew out of here. Now, you ask ME who is at fault? Both were. Plain and simple.
And to clear up things about the hogwon; it is not closing. The owner is going to England for a few years and is looking for someone to buy it. I never knew it was the responsibility of an owner of a business to tell its� employees what they are thinking before it actually happens. I have never seen this practiced in any business in any country Please. This is what happens when people yearn so badly to be part of a �click� to make themselves feel important, that is, they believe whatever someone tells them without researching the facts. I hope I have clarified a few things that a couple of you seem to take such interest in. Frankly, it sounds as though (English_Ocean & Half_Pint aka Rhonda Parsons) things worked out for the best.
I am happy that Rhonda is content with her decision. I wish her the best and hope nothing such as what she did to the hogwon happens to her and vice-versa, I hope the hogwon has nothing happen to it like not paying into pension (remember, healthcare was provided through a private company and she was taken care of when she needed it). Afterall, I do believe that things do come around full-circle in life.
So, I hope that concludes things. Adventurer and Wyliess99, next time, before you PM me, please find out the FULL facts before sending me such interesting messages. Oh, and Adventurer, I am a teacher, not a hogwon owner. Ask anyone else here. All I did was help someone find a worker. Never again. Too many headaches. I will only do it for my school (which I must say, I have found 3 teachers and all are happy). |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
PRagic
Joined: 24 Feb 2006
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 6:41 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| I have to say that I am astounded when I hear of people working for years on end at hakwons. Really, why do you do it? There are so many better ways to go. If you are treated well and content, then I guess more power to you. Still, can you trust them over the long haul? Can you rely on that experience to help you transition to any other job in the future, whether in Korea or in your home country? Do you have time to improve your credentials? Are you making satisfactory yearly gains in vacation time and pay? I am curious as I don't have any friends who have stayed on the hakwon path longer than a year or two. Why do it? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
xCustomx
Joined: 06 Jan 2006
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 7:34 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| PRagic wrote: |
| I have to say that I am astounded when I hear of people working for years on end at hakwons. Really, why do you do it? There are so many better ways to go. If you are treated well and content, then I guess more power to you. Still, can you trust them over the long haul? Can you rely on that experience to help you transition to any other job in the future, whether in Korea or in your home country? Do you have time to improve your credentials? Are you making satisfactory yearly gains in vacation time and pay? I am curious as I don't have any friends who have stayed on the hakwon path longer than a year or two. Why do it? |
I stayed at my hagwon for 2 years, but even after my boss offered to pay me 2.5 and share part of the profits with me for special classes that I would design, I still resigned. I would imagine that most people stay in hagwons because of the money, and they get in a comfort zone and don't want to venture out and try anything new. I'll admit that I was nervous about leaving and teaching in a public school, but now I think I was crazy for not leaving the hagwon after my first year.
The upside of a hagwon is that you can make more money and be physically present at the school for fewer hours, but the downside is the lack of vacation time and the fact that teaching in a public school or university probably looks better on a resume. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
English_Ocean
Joined: 17 Mar 2006
Location: You don't have the right to abuse me!
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 7:35 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| cubanlord wrote: |
| wylies99 wrote: |
With so many crooked recruiters and hogwan owners/directors out there, expect stories to be posted.
Unis English in Wonju was the latest to be posted for no pay, pension or health insurance. Ever hear of that hogwan, cubanlord? |
As a matter of fact, yes. I recruited English_Ocean & Half_Pint (aka Rhonda Parsons: the same person with 2 different names on Dave's) for that hogwon. I knew the owner before she started the Hogwon. The part-time foreigners and the full-time foreigner I knew there never had a problem except for the owners unorganized way of doing things. They always got paid on time and had everything else covered (though I did know of another dude, whom I spoke to once, pulled a runner because he liked it better in Japan). I spoke to him and that was his reasoning. He stated and I quote, "Japan is much better than Korea, I can't wait to go back". This guy was fluent in Japanese; little did anyone know that he was going to miss Japan that much. This is what he told me.
The hogwon DID not pay into the pension and insurance. However, wylies99, what you are missing here is the other side of the story. Allow me to elaborate:
Never once did Rhonda go up to the hogwon and put her foot down. Never once did she say, "hey, I am not going to work or go to the labor board and report you." She could have stood up for herself and said if the hogwon does not pay for her pension and medical, then, she doesn�t work. She didn't as she states in a previous thread that "going to the labor board is intimidating" (http://www.eslcafe.com/forums/korea/viewtopic.php?t=82515&start=0) .
I'm sorry, but, if you cannot stick up for yourself, then of course you will get walked on in life. Is that to say the hogwon is innocent? No, it is only to say that Rhonda allowed this stuff to happen and did NOTHING. And, to add to it, when Rhonda was hurt, the owner of the hogwon took her to the hospital and paid for 50% of the expenses. Now, considering the hogwon owner was inexperienced, I think she tried to do the best. Still, that isn't acceptable but only shows the flaw in Korea allowing anyone to become a hogwon owner.
Both parties were at fault here: The hogwon for not paying pension and health care (though they did provide it and paid 50% of the expenses through a private practitioner) and Rhonda's fault for not sticking up for herself and letting people walk all over her.
Regarding the pay? Rhonda was paid in full every time (I made sure of this). As a matter of fact, the morning that Rhonda left Korea, she called up the owner of the hogwon and said, "today is payday, can you please pay me in the morning?" The hogwon owner went immediately to the bank to pay her salary in full (as she always did). She didn't have to pay Rhonda in the AM, but did out of courtesy to Rhonda's request. Little did the owner know that Rhonda was pulling a runner on her and wanted the last pay before she flew out of here. Now, you ask ME who is at fault? Both were. Plain and simple.
And to clear up things about the hogwon; it is not closing. The owner is going to England for a few years and is looking for someone to buy it. I never knew it was the responsibility of an owner of a business to tell its� employees what they are thinking before it actually happens. I have never seen this practiced in any business in any country Please. This is what happens when people yearn so badly to be part of a �click� to make themselves feel important, that is, they believe whatever someone tells them without researching the facts. I hope I have clarified a few things that a couple of you seem to take such interest in. Frankly, it sounds as though (English_Ocean & Half_Pint aka Rhonda Parsons) things worked out for the best.
I am happy that Rhonda is content with her decision. I wish her the best and hope nothing such as what she did to the hogwon happens to her and vice-versa, I hope the hogwon has nothing happen to it like not paying into pension (remember, healthcare was provided through a private company and she was taken care of when she needed it). Afterall, I do believe that things do come around full-circle in life.
So, I hope that concludes things. Adventurer and Wyliess99, next time, before you PM me, please find out the FULL facts before sending me such interesting messages. Oh, and Adventurer, I am a teacher, not a hogwon owner. Ask anyone else here. All I did was help someone find a worker. Never again. Too many headaches. I will only do it for my school (which I must say, I have found 3 teachers and all are happy). |
Alright, let's get this right! I want to know why I should have to demand what's stated in the contract? You assured me before I traveled to South Korea that the hogwan was legit when you knew perfectly well it wasn't ? The previous foreign teacher left for the same reasons I did. No taxes, no medical no pension, hours changed to splits and the vacation stated in the contract was not given.
There is no reason why I should have to demand anything which is clearly stated in the contract. I didn't go to Korea to fight battles with a director over a contract.
Did you know when I thought I had broken my arm she had me finish my class before she drove me to the hospital? For god's sake she wouldn't even call a cab for me!
What's this crap about my last pay? I had to call the director from the bank and ask her to pay me! Payday was the 18th, it was 10:30am of the 18th. Is there a problem with that? YOU never made sure of anything Ralphie, you washed your hands of all of it. Short term memory problems?
When I complained about having to work splits, what did you say to me?
You said "Give the customer what she wants." WTF?? How about honor the fricking contract!
Did you forget she asked me for 700,000 won for medical, then dropped it down to 300,000 when I told her no?
Health Care was provided for? What are you talking about? I had no healthcare coverage!
When I e-mailed about the taxes you gave me a warning. I'm not going to post your e-mails here unless I have to.
You recruited me into a crap hogwan and I left. That's it.
If that director sells the hogwan my visa is void yet you don't think that is important? To me it means no severance and no airfare home!
FT! I went to Wonju in good faith that the contract I accepted would be honored based on Your word Ralphie!
The contract was in the toilet from the start and you wre fully aware of it
When I e-mailed you about the director not wanting to reimburse me for the visa costs you didn't even bother to respond. You couldn't be bothered with me anymore which is fine with me. The only problem I have is you trying to hide the truth.
You were not there, you didn't work there, I did.
Here is the bottom line. Unis English School in Wonju pays no taxes, medical or pension. The hogwan does not honor the contract in regards to the working hours stated nor does it give the vacation days agreeded upon! I never stated that I was not paid in full or on time. Yet, the last two months I did have to call and REMIND her that it was my payday.
Yes, Ralphie, do everyone a favor and stop trying to be a recruiter!
And if you think both parties were at fault, you are dead wrong.
I accepted a contract that was not honored in anyway and I left.
It's that simple.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
polonius
Joined: 05 Jun 2004
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 7:46 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| PRagic wrote: |
I have to say that I am astounded when I hear of people working for years on end at hakwons. Really, why do you do it? There are so many better ways to go. If you are treated well and content, then I guess more power to you. Still, can you trust them over the long haul?
I have been with them for 5 years, if I can't trust them at this point, what is the appropriate time allotment for trust? I trust my managers at my hagwon more than I have trusted past employers in NA.
Can you rely on that experience to help you transition to any other job in the future, whether in Korea or in your home country?
I have been offered a job with them as long as I want, for myself and my wife, in Canada and Korea. We have offices in Canada. Do I ever plan on being a teacher in a public school back in North America, not on your life. I may teach ESL on the other side, but what I learn or have learned thus far will suit me quite well.
Do you have time to improve your credentials?
I am a manager right now, not head teacher. I continually improve my own skills, and managing a staff of 25 teachers, in Korea or elsewhere looks good.
Are you making satisfactory yearly gains in vacation time and pay?
I am extremely happy with my salary, and earn more money when you consider taxes and housing in the equation then my family members who are managers for companies back in Canada.
I am curious as I don't have any friends who have stayed on the hakwon path longer than a year or two. Why do it? |
Not that I want to make this out to be a public vs. hagwon stint, but I much rather work with a small group of children where I can see progress over my time teaching. I have taught a girl phonics, and then 3 years later, we went through The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe prior to it being a movie. I would never have had that job satisfaction at a public school. Obviously different people require different things from their jobs. My needs are being met. As for your vacation question, I get the vacation I need. If I need to take a month off to visit my family, I can. If I need to go to Thailand and get married on a beach I will/did. Furthermore, I am a night owl, and the idea of going to work for 8 or 9 am doesn't appeal to me. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
