Korean Job Discussion Forums

[polarbearbrad]

Ladies and gentlemen.

The internet being the most powerful communications tool mankind has ever known is also the single greatest excriment distribution tool mankind has ever known.

I have searched high and low for information and so finally after finally finding s source to be trusted I feel it is my duty to pass this on to you.

I have contacted the Immigration department and posted on their Q & A board the following questions:

I have several questions regarding letters of release.

First scenario:
If a teacher finishes his or her contract, and wants to go home, never to come back, does that teacher need a letter of release?

Second:
If a teacher finishes his or her contract and wants to start working at a new school, does that teacher need a letter of release?

Third:
If a teacher does NOT finish their contract and wants to go home, never to come back, does he or she need a letter of release?

Fourth:
If a teacher does NOT finish their contract and wants to start working at a new school, does he or she need a letter of release?

If a teacher asks for a letter of release, is a director obligated to hand over the letter to the teacher?
If yes, what does one do if the director refuses to comply?

If a teacher quits their contract after four months of working, does that teacher have to wait 8 months (to the end of the original contract) before starting a new job IF the director of the first school does NOT give a letter of release?

What language must the letter of release be written in?
What details must be in the letter of release?
How much notice does a teacher have to give, by law, to an employer to be able to leave a contract and start a new one with a different school?
How much notice does a DIRECTOR have to give by law to a teacher?
Is a director allowed to withold pay/security deposit/income tax refund/pension or any other form of financial earnings from a teacher if the teacher notifies the director of his or her intention to leave?

Are all directors of schools (hogwons, elementary schools, middle schools, high schools, universities, after-school programs and so on) REQUIRED to provide national health insurance to all teachers? Are they also REQUIRED to contribute to the National Pension Plan?

If yes the answers to those last two questions are yes and yes, what recourse does a teacher have if the director refuses to comply and does NOT provide national health insurance or refuses to contribute to the pension plan?

How do teachers get income tax forms from the government of Korea? We pay taxes and in some of our home countries, we are required to prove that we did pay foreign taxes and therefore governmnet issued forms are required.

I know this is a lot of information I have requested and most of it has to do with people leaving but I am quite happy here and I am just trying to find out for the benefit of the many new people I have met whom are not familiar with the system.

When you answer my questions would you please include your name and position within immigration so the information can be referenced and not just stated "according to someone at immigration". I am sure you understand why information must be verifiable to be valid.

Thank you for your time and effort.

To date there is no reply but to their defence I posted said questions yesterday.
Today I have posted these questions:

If a teacher is FIRED, that is to say let go for any reason, is that school, by law, required to give a letter of release?
If not, under what grounds can a school refuse to give one?
If the school is by law required to hand over a letter and does not what happens?
If the school is not required to hand over a letter of release, what can the teacher do?
If the school does not issue a letter of release and the teacher leaves the country, how long does he or she have to wait before applying for a new visa at a different school?

Is there a "black-list" of teachers?
Who maintains it?
What does it mean?
Who can add names to the list?
What do you have to do to be added to this list? In other words how grievous an offense do you have to commit to be black-listed?
If you are on the list can you be taken off?
If so, how?
If not, why not?
How do you check to see if your name is on this list?
If you are on the list, is this a permanent mark or can your name come off after a certain length of time?

Is there a similar "black-list" of schools?
Who maintains it?
What does it mean?
Who can add schools to the list?
Does this list only contain school names or can directors also be added to the list?
What does a school, director, organization or recruiter have to do to be added to this list? In other words how grievous an offense do any of them have to commit to be black-listed?
If a school, director, organization or recruiter is on the list can they be taken off?
If so, how?
If so why?
If not, why not?
How does one check to see if a school, director, organization or recruiter is on this list?
If a school, director, organization or recruiter is on the list, is this a permanent mark or can the school, director, organization or recruiter in question come off after a certain length of time?

Here is the link to the Q & A board:

http://www.immigration.go.kr/indeximmeng.html

If you post a question, make sure that it is left OPEN so that everyone can view it.
I will keep everyone informed and please if you post responses to the "questions" then please site your source with the name of the person you talked to, the date, time and their position within immigration. Sorry to be such a teacher about it but I want to pass on verifiable information not hearsay.

I hope this helps people.
PBB

[TheUrbanMyth]

Umm..the answers to your first four questions can be found on this board and have been verified by countless people. That being said here are the answers.



1. No. Your contract is finished and your visa is finished as well. You do not need a letter of release...you DO need to leave the country.


2. No. Once the contract is finished, ALL obligations to that school are finished as well.

3. No. Contracts have a clause about giving notice. Simply follow the clause. So you do not need a release letter if you don't want to come back.


4. Yes. You need a release letter in this scenario.


Release letters are ONLY needed if you have NOT finished your contract, and WANT to stay in Korea and want to work at a new school. Other than that, they are not required. That is their sole purpose.

I know because I have experienced getting a release letter myself and have helped several foreigners get theirs.

[TheUrbanMyth]

oh and BTW good luck in getting answers to all those questions. If I were an officer at Immigration (even assuming I understood the English) I couldn't be bothered.


Not only that, but why would they post personal information on the 'Net such as you are asking for?

[Yu_Bum_suk]

[Young FRANKenstein]

First scenario:
If a teacher finishes his or her contract, and wants to go home, never to come back, does that teacher need a letter of release?
No. You're finished the contract. No LOR needed.

Second:
If a teacher finishes his or her contract and wants to start working at a new school, does that teacher need a letter of release?
No. You're finished the contract. No LOR needed.

Third:
If a teacher does NOT finish their contract and wants to go home, never to come back, does he or she need a letter of release?
No. You're going home. No LOR needed.

Fourth:
If a teacher does NOT finish their contract and wants to start working at a new school, does he or she need a letter of release?
Yes. Now is when you need the LOR

If a teacher asks for a letter of release, is a director obligated to hand over the letter to the teacher?
No. There is not one law on the books that will force him to give you one if he doesn't want to.

If a teacher quits their contract after four months of working, does that teacher have to wait 8 months (to the end of the original contract) before starting a new job IF the director of the first school does NOT give a letter of release?
Yes. No LOR means you have to wait until the end of the visa. Tough luck.

What language must the letter of release be written in? Korean or English, but both is best.
What details must be in the letter of release? look for example of them floating around
How much notice does a teacher have to give, by law, to an employer to be able to leave a contract and start a new one with a different school? It is purely contractual. What does the contract say.
How much notice does a DIRECTOR have to give by law to a teacher? Minimum 30 days notice, unless the contract stipulates more than that.
Is a director allowed to withold pay/security deposit/income tax refund/pension or any other form of financial earnings from a teacher if the teacher notifies the director of his or her intention to leave? Legally, no. Hasn't stopped some crooks from doing it though.

Are all directors of schools (hogwons, elementary schools, middle schools, high schools, universities, after-school programs and so on) REQUIRED to provide national health insurance to all teachers? Are they also REQUIRED to contribute to the National Pension Plan?
100% required to provide National Health Insurance. No exceptions.
100% required to provide National Pension (unless you work less than 80 hours a month or the school is on a private pension)

If yes the answers to those last two questions are yes and yes, what recourse does a teacher have if the director refuses to comply and does NOT provide national health insurance or refuses to contribute to the pension plan?
Complain to the Pension Office and the NHIC office nearest you, and file a complaint.

When you answer my questions would you please include your name and position within immigration.
Abso-Fing-lutely not. If you want verifiable and valid information, then call Immigration, Pension, Labor, and NHIC your damn self.

If a teacher is FIRED, that is to say let go for any reason, is that school, by law, required to give a letter of release? No.
If not, under what grounds can a school refuse to give one? Any reason, including spite.
If the school is not required to hand over a letter of release, what can the teacher do? Nothing.
If the school does not issue a letter of release and the teacher leaves the country, how long does he or she have to wait before applying for a new visa at a different school? He must wait until the visa expires before getting a new work visa.

Is there a "black-list" of teachers? No.
Is there a similar "black-list" of schools? No.

I want to pass on verifiable information not hearsay
Then stop asking questions on a webboard and do your own damn dirty work

[TheUrbanMyth]

[ttompatz]

[TheUrbanMyth]

[sadsac]

It's amazing how many times the issue of the LOR has been broached on this board. I am in complete disagreement regarding the LOR, I have never received an LOR and have never been required to present one to obtain my E2. Horses for courses I suppose.

[polarbearbrad]

I thank you all for your attempts to "answer the questions" but I really was not doing this to GET information, but rather to inform people of the questions I have already ASKED Immigration my own damn self.


Damn it people read the thread completely!!!!!!


I HAVE POSTED THOSE QUESTIONS, IN THAT EXACT FORMAT TO IMMIGRATION!

I don't want YOUR personal information, I want the name, and title of the IMMIGRATION OFFICER answering said question so it can be verified.


What I said to you was:
please if you post responses to the "questions" then please site your source with the name of the person you talked to, the date, time and their position within immigration

I called the immigration centre at 02-2650-6399 and I spoke with Suzanne Kang at the call centre and here is what she told me thus far:

For scenario 1 you do not need a letter of release.
For scenarios 2, 3, and 4 YOU DO NEED A LETTER OF RELEASE!!!!!!!!!!!
Now, do you see why I am asking for sources to be cited???
If you wish to check the status of my questions AT THE IMMIGRATION Q & A BOARD, then you can do so at

http://www.immigration.go.kr/indeximmeng.html

At the time of my post, my questions are listed as "waiting" as in waiting for an official response.
I am trying to help people in this thread, NOT get information. That is why I have gone to immigration "my own damn self".

Sincerely,
PBB

[Yu_Bum_suk]

[polarbearbrad]

I have several questions regarding letters of release.

First scenario:
If a teacher finishes his or her contract, and wants to go home, never to come back, does that teacher need a letter of release?

Second:
If a teacher finishes his or her contract and wants to start working at a new school, does that teacher need a letter of release?

Third:
If a teacher does NOT finish their contract and wants to go home, never to come back, does he or she need a letter of release?

Fourth:
If a teacher does NOT finish their contract and wants to start working at a new school, does he or she need a letter of release?


Context Thanks for your question.
Answer for 1 : need not a letter of release
Answer for 2 : need a letter of release
Answer for 3: need not a letter of release
Answer for 4: need a letter of release
I'm sorry but for the perfect answer, you'd better visit local immigration office or make a phone call to the immigration officers.
Have a nice day!

There we have it from immigration although I am pretty pissed that I can not verify this with contact information.


The following questions have not been answered.


If a teacher asks for a letter of release, is a director obligated to hand over the letter to the teacher?
If yes, what does one do if the director refuses to comply?

If a teacher quits their contract after four months of working, does that teacher have to wait 8 months (to the end of the original contract) before starting a new job IF the director of the first school does NOT give a letter of release?

What language must the letter of release be written in?
What details must be in the letter of release?
How much notice does a teacher have to give, by law, to an employer to be able to leave a contract and start a new one with a different school?
How much notice does a DIRECTOR have to give by law to a teacher?
Is a director allowed to withold pay/security deposit/income tax refund/pension or any other form of financial earnings from a teacher if the teacher notifies the director of his or her intention to leave?

Are all directors of schools (hogwons, elementary schools, middle schools, high schools, universities, after-school programs and so on) REQUIRED to provide national health insurance to all teachers? Are they also REQUIRED to contribute to the National Pension Plan?

If yes the answers to those last two questions are yes and yes, what recourse does a teacher have if the director refuses to comply and does NOT provide national health insurance or refuses to contribute to the pension plan?

How do teachers get income tax forms from the government of Korea? We pay taxes and in some of our home countries, we are required to prove that we did pay foreign taxes and therefore governmnet issued forms are required.

I have reposted the next question, perhaps the idea of so many questions was a little daunting to them. This way I can carve the questions up and hit them one at a time. Maybe they will be faster.
Hope this helps.
PBB

[Yu_Bum_suk]

#2 is still ambiguous. If one wants to go directly from one job to the next without leaving the country I believe a LOR is necessary. If there's any gap between jobs, why would it be? Most people have to make a visa run between jobs but some don't. It's still all very odd.

It still seems to be a matter of 'ask 10 different officials and get 10 different answers'.

[Curious George]

Well since I experienced this last year I will tell you what I know.

I accepted a job at what I thought was a good hogwan in Jeju. After being there 2 months and the owner not providing health care, pension, or health insurance and a very sparsely furnished apartment, I investigated and found out that YES, they are required by law to provide these things. NO exceptions. If they tell you differently, they are lying.

So, I brought these things up to my employer who initially gave me the run around trying to tell me he didnt have to do these things, blah, blah, blah. So, I went and got the laws and telephone numbers of immigration, the tax office, pension office, NHIC, etc. and told him he had to provide these things, so he fired me. (Because he had 7 other foreign teachers there and didnt want to pay for all of them either).

So, I forced him to give me a letter of release so I could get another job. How did I do this? I kindly told him that if he did not give me a letter of release that I would report him and his school to all the agencies and he would be screwed. He didn't believe me until he got a phone call from the pension office. Then he decided it was better to just give me the LOR.

He tried to get me to work out a notice. I DO NOT recommend this either because they will just keep the money you earned from the time you told them you were quitting. Just get out or you will be basically working for free during your notice period.

He also tried to tell me I had to pay him back for the plane ticket and apartment utilities and deposits during the 2 months I was there. I just laughed at him and told him I had no money (and I refused to work out a notice).

He had no choice but to give me the LOR and let me go because if I had turned him in he would have been in a world of doodoo and maybe even lost his schools.

Now I am happy to say I have been working at a public school up in Seoul and am very happy (and making more money and working less too!)

So, don't allow yourself to get screwed over by dodgy hogwan owners. If you show them you are serious about reporting them to the authorities they will give you a LOR in return for your silence because no matter what they say IT IS ILLEGAL to do these types of things.

Even better is do not work for hogwans at all. I personally will only ever work for Korean government schools from now on. You get treated a whole lot better and more importantly, you know everything is legal.

[polarbearbrad]

Good morning my fellow teachers.

I finally got a response that makes some sense from immigration.

I asked if the director is obligated under law to give an LOR and the answer is NO!

So there we have it, no director is OBLIGATED to hand one over. Yes, you can blackmail them into it or simply ask for it and you may get it but no matter what we do to them, they do not HAVE to hand it over to us.

It only took a month to get the answer but at least I got one.
Cheers,
PBB