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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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 Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 7:14 pm Post subject: Two men charged with firebombing Jewish school, centre (MTL) |
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Two men charged with firebombing Jewish school, centre
Fri Apr 13, 7:49 PM
Montreal police arrested two men Friday in connection with three bombings, including explosions at a Jewish community centre and a Jewish school.
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The men - Omar Bulphred, 24, and Azim Ibragimov, 22 - have been charged with arson, uttering death threats and possessing arson materials, police said.
The two Montreal men were arrested in connection with:
- The explosion of a small bomb in front of the Ben Weider Jewish Community Centre in C�te-des-Neiges on April 3.
[From the last names of the criminals, one appears to be Turkic say from Azerbaijan and the other is quite possibly an Algerian because his last name is Bulphred and many Algerians have Bou at the beginning of their last names one of the former presidents of Algeria Boumedienne. ]
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/13042007/3/canada-men-charged-firebombing-jewish-school-centre.html
[I haven't met many Azerbaijanis in Montreal. Just one, and he was completely secular. But every place has its fanatics. Algeria, on the other hand, has a major problem with fundamentalists.] |
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igotthisguitar
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)
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| Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 7:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Were they "Jewish"? |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 8:37 pm Post subject: |
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| igotthisguitar wrote: |
| Were they "Jewish"? |
No, one was an Algerian Muslim and the other an Azerbaijani Muslim. I didn't get this from a report. I concluded by looking at the last names. |
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Slep
Joined: 14 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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| This has been happening way too often in Montreal. |
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igotthisguitar
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)
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| Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 8:44 pm Post subject: |
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Ibragimov sounds pretty KHAZARIAN, no?
You realize Adventurer how many fanatical "Jews" have been caught "red-handed" engaging in such activities?
PLENTY!  |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 11:57 pm Post subject: |
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| They are part of the new "Canadian" cultural mosaic. Their vibrancy brings diversity and they must have been driven to this act by inequality. We need to tolerate new "Canadians" and include their cultural understandings into our social fabric. |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 12:17 am Post subject: |
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| igotthisguitar wrote: |
Ibragimov sounds pretty KHAZARIAN, no?
You realize Adventurer how many fanatical "Jews" have been caught "red-handed" engaging in such activities?
PLENTY! |
No, it does not sound Khazar. A typical Khazar surname is Kazan, Kaplan, and Kagan i.e. names that end in the letters an which would add ovich sometimes if Slavicised. Also, Bulphred sounds North African. Jews don't have such surnames. I don't see why an Azerbaijani is targeting a Jewish edifice. Unless he is blaming Israel for allying with Armenia, or they are simply blaming Jews for the misery in their lives.
I wager these two fellows were on the low end of the scale economically, many of the unemployed recent immigrants to Montreal who probably arrived at a late age to the city. I doubt they were born there.
Quebec needs to work on improving the economy of the province instead of separation and integrating the communities, and leaders from the Jewish and Muslim communities need to condemn agent provocateurs.
Canada has in place a point system trying to attract professionals.
Canada should also do as the Dutch do and say to new immigrants are coming to an inclusive society that won't tolerate bigotry. Targeting ethnic buildings whether it is a Somali school in Ottawa or a Jewish one in Montreal is simply bigotry. |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 12:21 am Post subject: |
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| Adventurer wrote: |
I wager these two fellows were on the low end of the scale economically, |
Exactly. It must be anything but their religious beliefs (which directly instruct them to harm Jews). In fact, lets find a way to blame it on the kuffar.
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Quebec needs to work on improving the economy of the province
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Ahhh, much better. Ok. Event explained.
Next topic! |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 1:09 am Post subject: |
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| BJWD wrote: |
| Adventurer wrote: |
I wager these two fellows were on the low end of the scale economically, |
Exactly. It must be anything but their religious beliefs (which directly instruct them to harm Jews). In fact, lets find a way to blame it on the kuffar.
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Quebec needs to work on improving the economy of the province
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Ahhh, much better. Ok. Event explained.
Next topic! |
No, I never said it had nothing to do with their religious beliefs or whatever bigoted interpretation they have of their religion leading them to try to harm Jews. I do think, of course, that if Quebec is to take in immigrants it should take in more educated people, and work on job creation and needs to work on integrating its various communities in the society and economy and focus on fixing the economy instead of staying on the same broken record of wanting a referendum. |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 1:16 am Post subject: Men charged with crimes targeting city's Jewish community |
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Pair denied bail
Men charged with crimes targeting city's Jewish community
The Gazette
Published: Friday, April 13, 2007
Sue Montgomery
and Paul Cherry
The Gazette
Two Montreal men have been accused of a raft of attacks against the city�s Jewish community, including the firebombing of a Snowdon community centre that police are treating as a hate-related crime.
Omar Bulphred, 21, and Azim Ibragimov, 23, appeared briefly in Quebec Court on Friday to be arraigned on charges stemming from incidents that began last fall. Both were denied bail.
Azim Ibragimov, left, and Omar Bulphred face nine charges each stemming from events that began last fall.
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Font: ****The case is due back in court on Monday, at which time a date could be set for a bail hearing.
In addition to their alleged roles in a rash of firebombings, the two are accused of conspiring to commit kidnapping and armed robbery. But it�s not known who or what their potential victims were.
Alexandre Bergevin, the lawyer for the two accused, said police used wiretaps to close in on his clients.
�Other than that, I have very little information about the evidence,� Bergevin said in an interview. �I wasn�t even allowed to meet with them at the courthouse, so won�t see them until sometime over the weekend.�
Jeffrey Boro, president of the Canadian Jewish Congress, said police told him the two suspects are Canadian-born Muslims of Russian descent.
�That makes it very disconcerting for those who live here,� he said. �We�re raising people here with such hatred in their hearts for people they�ve never met or had anything to do with.�
He said police had informed the CJC they�d found material during the investigation that suggested the crimes were motivated by hate toward Jewish people.
Sarah Elgazzar, of the Canadian Council on American-Islamic Relations, expressed dismay the accused are Muslims and hoped that fact wouldn�t increase the animosity between the Jewish and Muslim communities in Montreal.
�Religiously speaking, Jews and Muslims should be so close,� she said. �Sure, there are differences, and there are problems in other parts of the world, but that doesn�t justify these kinds of attacks.
�Most Muslims would never even think of doing something like that; it�s horrible.�
[email protected]
http://www.canada.com/montrealgazette/news/story.html?id=485fefb7-fc25-44a0-8ff1-8a69c7ebf600&k=97449 |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 1:44 am Post subject: |
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| Adventurer wrote: |
No, I never said it had nothing to do with their religious beliefs or whatever bigoted interpretation they have of their religion leading them to try to harm Jews. |
You tolerant types really need to stop interpreting for them their religion. It isn't a "bigoted interpretation" but perfectly CLEAR.
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"O believers, take not Jews and Christians as friends; they are friends of each other. Those of you who make them his friends is one of them. God does not guide an unjust people." - 5:54 |
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"Fight against such as those to whom the Scriptures were given until they pay tribute out of hand and are utterly subdued." (Surah 9:27-) |
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"Prophet make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites and deal rigorously with them. Hell shall be their home." (Surah 9:73) |
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"Believers, make war on the infidels who dwell around you. Deal firmly with them." (Surah 9:121-) |
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| "Seek out your enemies relentlessly." (Surah 4:103-) |
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| "Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it." (Surah 2:216) |
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"Slay them wherever you find them...Idolatry is worse than carnage...Fight against them until idolatry is no more and God's religion reigns supreme." (Surah 2:190-) |
And just for fun,
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"Blessed are the believers...who restrain their carnal desires (except with their wives and slave-girls, for these are lawful to them)...These are the heirs of Paradise..." (Surah 23:1-5-) |
Stop protecting an idea. Just be honest! If a nazi firebombs a mosque we say "he did it because his ideology taught him to hate". If a muslim does it we say "it has nothing to do with his ideology and must be because of inequality".
The extent to which some people buy into propaganda is simply amazing. Canada teaches us to jettison out critical thinking skills and it is each of our own responsibilities to get them back. |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 2:19 am Post subject: |
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[quote="BJWD"]
| Adventurer wrote: |
No, I never said it had nothing to do with their religious beliefs or whatever bigoted interpretation they have of their religion leading them to try to harm Jews. |
You tolerant types really need to stop interpreting for them their religion. It isn't a "bigoted interpretation" but perfectly CLEAR.
| Quote: |
"O believers, take not Jews and Christians as friends; they are friends of each other. Those of you who make them his friends is one of them. God does not guide an unjust people." - 5:54 |
| Quote: |
The extent to which some people buy into propaganda is simply amazing. Canada teaches us to jettison out critical thinking skills and it is each of our own responsibilities to get them back. |
I read this years and years ago, and I read the hadiths as well as the TANACH. One can take religion literally or not. You are assuming people all take their religion literally and follow it. Also in Islamic exegesis which means religious interpretation, one is supposed to look at the context of a particular chapter of the Quran or verse. The Muslims for example in the verses you quoted above were fighting the Roman Christians i.e. Byzantium and their allies and the Jews and pagans were allies against the Muslims. There is also in the Quran the praising of Christian monks and nuns. But people who want to point to only one thing will do that. It is also known that Mohammed had a very good impression of an Aramaic Syriac monk before he became prophet and his name the Monk Buhaira. I have read all kinds of scriptures, and I know several languages. I am very critical of things. It is a question of interpretation. Why?
Some Muslims would think it is against their principles to attack innocent Jews at a Jewish school. If they didn't, then they wouldn't be acting Muslim whatever that means. We obviously know Montreal has perhaps 100,000 Muslims and about 100,000 Jews. They aren't clashing all the time, and they are often friends and this among people who both consider themselves Jews and Muslims. These people who committed these crimes against Jews are Jew haters, sectarian bigots and may view it that their religion sanctions such behaviour and some so-called religious people teach hatred of Jews just as Catholic clergymen in the old days did so and people claimed Jews had horns i.e. were the devil. This is nothing new..... |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 2:20 am Post subject: |
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| Stop protecting an idea. Just be honest! If a nazi firebombs a mosque we say "he did it because his ideology taught him to hate". If a muslim does it we say "it has nothing to do with his ideology and must be because of inequality". |
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