|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
jajdude
Joined: 18 Jan 2003
|
 Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 11:11 pm Post subject: Are you cheerful, positive, talkative, outgoing...? |
 |
|
I think one stereotype of Americans (and others) that you'll find in Korea (and elsewhere) is that they/we are like the characters on "Friends" or something like that. If you are not naturally an upbeat, frequently smiling, chatty, outgoing, enthuastic about even routine stuff kind of person, looking friendly and happy even on bad days, Koreans at work may be disappointed. If you are quiet and reserved by nature it could be hard to fit in at the office or with the boss or co-workers. I think the expectation is that you meet the stereotype or else things might go sour. I find it hard to meet this expectation, and I find it tiring to pretend that my personality is like that. I know teaching kids you need to be energetic and talk a lot, and use a lot of gestures and so on, and usually I can manage this, but I must say I find it tiresome, and outside of classes I prefer to have quiet time and not have to put on the act. I have been told, "You must be more outgoing" before, but I am not an actor.
Anyone else have this kind of thing going on at work? I think I've encountered problems before because of this. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
shifdog
Joined: 20 Jul 2006
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 11:18 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I have been told the same thing by my bosses in Japan and Korea.
I'm energetic and cheerful in my classes. However, compared to other teachers I'm not as cheerful and energetic.
I just ignore these requests and do my own thing. You can't please everyone. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
JAWINSEOUL
Joined: 19 Nov 2005
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 11:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I think the struggle you�re speaking of is called being human. Finding a job that fits your personality is the cherry on top of the ice-cream sundae of life. If you take an aptitude test, I�m sure it would not list teaching as a good choice for your profession.
My advice is to try your best to enjoy your classes and be yourself. If you show up on time and work hard your value will be obvious to your boss. Staying true to yourself is not easy, good luck. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
spliff
Joined: 19 Jan 2004
Location: Khon Kaen, Thailand
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 11:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
NEVER....  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Saxiif
Joined: 15 May 2003
Location: Seongnam
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 11:34 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Well I find that acting like that makes me a much better teacher. Its hard to make my students want to be in class if I act like I'm not happy to be there. If you're "quiet and reserved by nature" probably teaching kids isn't the best job for you. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Alyallen
Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Location: The 4th Greatest Place on Earth = Jeonju!!!
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 12:03 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Saxiif wrote: |
| Well I find that acting like that makes me a much better teacher. Its hard to make my students want to be in class if I act like I'm not happy to be there. If you're "quiet and reserved by nature" probably teaching kids isn't the best job for you. |
Doesn't that fall into the idea that English teachers have to BE ENTERTAINING?
I mean...if he was an art teacher would people still pester the OP?
Being quiet and reserved in my opinion is not synonymous with being a horrible teacher of children...
But to the OP, I don't think that's really happened to me. When I'm with my students, I get amped up because of them but I won't fake it if I'm tired or sick.... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Unposter
Joined: 04 Jun 2006
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 12:27 am Post subject: |
|
|
You got to sell the fantasy of what it is to be Western. It is not just being outgoing, tall, blond and blue eyes will get you far. Then, try to be just the right mix of a little dangerous but all gentleman at the same time -ever-so-slightly arrogant and totally in controll. Throw around some cash and a nice wardrobe and Koreans will just go ga-ga over you!
It is what they want to see.
Listen, there is office politics everywhere. It is easy to think that you have traveled half-way around the world to avoid it but you can't. It is here too. You are either part of the group or not. Socializing with co-workers, especially in Korea where there is a real group-think, really does help.
I heard an interesting study at a KOTESOL meeting. Some guy did a questionaire of Korean college students about what they want from a foreign teacher. The questionaire was not that scientific but it met with my experience teaching here. The three most important qualities are an ability to explain things clearly, good time management and energy.
Energy in the classroom is important. You do not have to be funny or dashing. Depending on the students, it may help or hurt. But most, if not all, students do not really want to study. But if you can bring a little excitement, wake them up, show that you are interested and care, most students will respond, though there are always exceptions.
But if it is a question of your co-workers liking you, there could be a lot of different possibilities here too. Being part of the group is important in Korea. If they think you are aloof, they take it as a personal insult and poor education. In Korea, learning how to work in a group is important. Your failure to understand that shows either your lack of care or education.
It could also just be that they feel uncomfortable around you as a foreigner. If this is the case, they may try to attack you or keep you off balance by saying things which they think will upset you. Korean managers often do this to keep you from relaxing and thus not struggling to work harder. It is like some psychological martial arts. They are always trying to keep you off balance and on the defensive.
You need to ask yourself a few questions. Am I effective with my students? Am I basically friendly with my co-workers? If you believe you are, don't listen to the guy. If you think you have a problem, make a change. You need to make a decision on what kind of investment you want to make in your job. And, then you have to live with that decision.
I don't think being reserved is necessarily a liability in this profession. But not playing the game can be.
In oh so many ways, I do not measure up to the Korean fantasy of a Native-speaking teacher but I always give it all I got and that is usually enough.
Good luck and cheer up! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Saxiif
Joined: 15 May 2003
Location: Seongnam
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 12:33 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Alyallen wrote: |
| Saxiif wrote: |
| Well I find that acting like that makes me a much better teacher. Its hard to make my students want to be in class if I act like I'm not happy to be there. If you're "quiet and reserved by nature" probably teaching kids isn't the best job for you. |
Doesn't that fall into the idea that English teachers have to BE ENTERTAINING?
I mean...if he was an art teacher would people still pester the OP?
Being quiet and reserved in my opinion is not synonymous with being a horrible teacher of children... |
Being quiet and reserved is definately not synonymous with being a bad teacher, but definately in my experience people who can't act extroverted in the classroom tend to make worse teachers.
And its not just English teachers. Back in HS I had one math teacher who was obviously marking the days until retirement and never had any enthusiasm at all for the class. Another teacher was a bit loopy, alcoholic and anal to the point of OCD but he was always incredibly energetic and enthusiastic in class so people actually payed attention and tended to learn a lot.
| Quote: |
| Energy in the classroom is important. You do not have to be funny or dashing. |
Exactly. You don't need to be a monkey, you just have to have energy and enthusiasm. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jajdude
Joined: 18 Jan 2003
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 12:42 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Unposter wrote: |
Being part of the group is important in Korea. If they think you are aloof, they take it as a personal insult and poor education. In Korea, learning how to work in a group is important. Your failure to understand that shows either your lack of care or education.
|
I appreciate your response, but why do you assume I fail to understand the above, that is if, "Your failure to understand that..." was directed at me? If not, you might have written simply, "Failure to understand that...a lack of...." |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
captain kirk
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 4:01 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Unposter wrote: |
| they may try to attack you or keep you off balance by saying things which they think will upset you. Korean managers often do this to keep you from relaxing and thus not struggling to work harder |
I don't understand what you've written here because, not being critical, I don't think you explained yourself clearly enough. For example, why would a manager not want you to relax and be effective on the job? Do you mean a crap manager who is constantly hostile just because one is a foreigner, and that manager is uncomfortable with and therefore hates/fears foreigners and so is compelled to be, subconsiously or consciously or both, a vicious little raptor, a 'tire-biter'? (tire-biter; a dog that enjoys ambushing passing cars for amusement, running alongside and barking).
Last edited by captain kirk on Wed Apr 25, 2007 6:12 am; edited 2 times in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sojourner1
Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Location: Where meggi swim and 2 wheeled tractors go sput put chug alugg pug pug
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 4:27 am Post subject: Re: Are you cheerful, positive, talkative, outgoing...? |
|
|
| jajdude wrote: |
| I think one stereotype of Americans (and others) that you'll find in Korea (and elsewhere) is that they/we are like the characters on "Friends" or something like that. If you are not naturally an upbeat, frequently smiling, chatty, outgoing, enthuastic about even routine stuff kind of person, looking friendly and happy even on bad days, Koreans at work may be disappointed. If you are quiet and reserved by nature it could be hard to fit in at the office or with the boss or co-workers. I think the expectation is that you meet the stereotype or else things might go sour. |
The OP has pointed out the very critical cultural aspect of hagwon teaching. An aptitude test might indicate that you can be a good teacher, but living in Korea requires a very different set of appitudes not related to teaching aptitude which is one major reason it only takes any type of bachelors degree to get one of these jobs. (I know teacher supply is lacking too) I sense that the Koreans in my hagwon have different expectations of me than what I really am, despite the fact they tell me I am doing a good job teaching. I know I am doing a good job, but I know they feel indifferent, that I do not fit this stereotype they had in mind. This awkward situation happens to many teachers here. I have managed to turn 3 Korean teachers onto the idea of traveling to America by being a positive and friendly American to them so I am doing something right in the line of relations. I had no intention or efferts to sell the idea, it just happened from presenting a positive image of myself and my country.
Ha ha, my hagwon actually has "Friends" in it's name and perfectly fits the description of what the OP said. I do not like it for this reason and not going to teach in a hagwon ever again despite the fact I like the teaching job. Sure I am cheery and energetic with the kids, but outside the classroom I am more quiet and reserved (kindy teaching is exhausting so I have to relax outside of teaching) which is probably why the Korean school administration do not show much respect for me despite my respect for them through good attitude, gifting, and being a 100% reliable teacher. Screw em' after this one year is up. Unappreciative money motivated people that see me as a puppet that should fit this "Friends" stereotype. Fake and phoney is all it is.
Despite the fact of existing awkward cultural differences, it is still well worth the experience to go learn all that you would never learn by staying home this one year so I still would advise anyone interested in coming to Korea to teach to go ahead and do it. Only after researching it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
pest2
Joined: 01 Jun 2005
Location: Vancouver, Canada
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 5:15 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Unposter wrote: |
You got to sell the fantasy of what it is to be Western. It is not just being outgoing, tall, blond and blue eyes will get you far. Then, try to be just the right mix of a little dangerous but all gentleman at the same time -ever-so-slightly arrogant and totally in controll. Throw around some cash and a nice wardrobe and Koreans will just go ga-ga over you!
It is what they want to see.
Listen, there is office politics everywhere. It is easy to think that you have traveled half-way around the world to avoid it but you can't. It is here too. You are either part of the group or not. Socializing with co-workers, especially in Korea where there is a real group-think, really does help.
I heard an interesting study at a KOTESOL meeting. Some guy did a questionaire of Korean college students about what they want from a foreign teacher. The questionaire was not that scientific but it met with my experience teaching here. The three most important qualities are an ability to explain things clearly, good time management and energy.
Energy in the classroom is important. You do not have to be funny or dashing. Depending on the students, it may help or hurt. But most, if not all, students do not really want to study. But if you can bring a little excitement, wake them up, show that you are interested and care, most students will respond, though there are always exceptions.
But if it is a question of your co-workers liking you, there could be a lot of different possibilities here too. Being part of the group is important in Korea. If they think you are aloof, they take it as a personal insult and poor education. In Korea, learning how to work in a group is important. Your failure to understand that shows either your lack of care or education.
It could also just be that they feel uncomfortable around you as a foreigner. If this is the case, they may try to attack you or keep you off balance by saying things which they think will upset you. Korean managers often do this to keep you from relaxing and thus not struggling to work harder. It is like some psychological martial arts. They are always trying to keep you off balance and on the defensive.
You need to ask yourself a few questions. Am I effective with my students? Am I basically friendly with my co-workers? If you believe you are, don't listen to the guy. If you think you have a problem, make a change. You need to make a decision on what kind of investment you want to make in your job. And, then you have to live with that decision.
I don't think being reserved is necessarily a liability in this profession. But not playing the game can be.
In oh so many ways, I do not measure up to the Korean fantasy of a Native-speaking teacher but I always give it all I got and that is usually enough.
Good luck and cheer up! |
This is the post I most agree with. I think when uposter was talking about co workers and bosses trying to keep you off guard to get you to work harder, he was talking about this sort of thing:
They do you some kind of 'pseudo-favor'... for example, they fix a leaky pipe in your apartment one day. The next day, they ask you to stay and work late and you are supposed to feel compelled to do it because of the "favor" from the day before. Korean relationships are frequent and operate on and for a quid pro quo basis. They are masters at using you and each other to get things they need. This ties back into them being much more social and there being a greater need for you to adhere to the group here. They and you must do this to survive.
Personally, I dont have trouble being outgoing and energetic in the classroom. But when class is over, I like to avoid people and relax. I think my coworkers are pretty understanding about this, though.. and it helps that my students see the energetic side of me; they report back about this, I am sure.
What I DO have trouble with is having to have SO MANY relationships and having to use the people in those relationships exclusively to get things and allowing those people to USE ME. This is made even worse by the fact that Koreans always seem like they're trying to one-up you when this quid pro quo is going on... see above about the fixed leaky pipes. Its like they give you and inch and expect you to give them a mile. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
oneofthesarahs
Joined: 05 Nov 2006
Location: Sacheon City
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 5:28 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Actually, I think my coworkers enjoy my calmness compared to the last English teacher. In the classroom, I work my tail off and I have lots of energy, but between classes I just want to relax and take a breather. That's compared to my last coworker who was consistently insane all the time and would never cease to make jokes with the Korean teachers that they didn't understand. Then she would laugh maniacally and they would just do the "I have no idea what she just said but I should probably laugh now" chuckle. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
The Hierophant
Joined: 13 Sep 2005
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 5:31 am Post subject: |
|
|
Unposter was pretty much spot-on regarding how to be successful in the Korea TEFL racket.
The previous foreign teacher at my hagwon was more or less everything Unposter says a successful foreign teacher should be, and I have failed to measure up.
'Markus teacher was very handsome'. 'Markus teacher was very funny'. 'Markus teacher love Korea'. 'Markus teacher very good'.
YEAH OK I GET THE F**KING POINT!
whew, just needed to vent.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Alyallen
Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Location: The 4th Greatest Place on Earth = Jeonju!!!
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 6:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
wow....And no one called anyone a dancing monkey for faking pseudo-enthusiasm to fit some ridiculous stereotype. My god Dave's may have gotten back to some type of "normal."
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
