Korean Job Discussion Forums

[icnelly]

I was teaching some Chinese EFL teachers about verb phrases, and one of them gave me this example:

The class will be finished.

The tense = present conditional, but the problem was that he insisted it was a passive sentence. I said "No, because 'class' was the original subject."

'Will be' is acting like linking verb in that sentence with a past participle adjective, but it can also be a passive sentence...

Is context, or a clear referent the only marked difference between the two?

The students will finish the class. The class will be finished by the students.

(active to passive)


The class works hard. The class will be finished.

(linking verb with predicate adjective)

Less ambiguous is using a true adjective over a participle.

The class will be green.

But where does the distinction lie within the the passive sentence, and the linking verb sentence?

Is the only difference the type of adjective?

[Woland]

I think 'finished' is a participial adjective here, but the evidence is not overwhelming.

In The Grammar Book, Celce-Murcia and Larsen-Freeman propose two tests for distinguishing adjectival participles.

The first test is intensification. Adjectives can be modified by 'very', while verbs cannot be:

a) The man is very determined

b)*The magic tricks very amazed us

Intensification in this case yields

c)?The class will be very finished

a sentence which may be acceptable as a jocular form and would support the participial adjective analysis:

Tom: In two days, the last paper and homework will be in and the test will be over.

Bob: Hurray! The class will be finished.

Tom: Yeah, the class will be very finished.

The problems with this analysis are two-fold. First, the sentence created is at best odd, and requires some contextualization to be acceptable. Second, it is increasingly acceptable to use an intensifier like 'very' with some past particple verb forms:

d) We were very shocked by his behavior

and we have no way of determining whether or not 'finish' is one of the verbs we can do this with.

The second test is look at following prepositions. Verbal participles can take only a 'by' phrase, while adjectival participles can be followed by other prepositions (as well as 'by', so 'by' tells us little by itself).

Okay, we can get a 'by' phrase here:

e) The class will be finished by the students

which would seem to suggest that the participle is verbal. However, I would like to suggest that this sentence is not semantically equivalent (not the same proposition) as the OP's original:

f) The class will be finished.

It seems to me that f) would have to be a true agentless passive, if this were the case, and again, here, my gut says no to this reading.

Unfortunately, there's no strong evidence for an adjectival reading here. We can get other prepositions heading phrases here, as in:

g) The class will be finished in two days

The problem for me is that these kinds of adverbially functioning prepositional phrases again seem different from the kinds of prepositional phrases C-M and L-F are talking about:

h) We were amazed at his success

I'm not sure how to describe it. Again, it's a gut sense that these prepositional phrases represent different types.

Beyond this there is nothing. I'm going to take c) as the one weak bit of evidence supporting an adjectival reading of 'finished' here.

But I can sympathize with the student arguing that it's passive. It may also be the case that 'passive' is some meta-language he knows, while he's never heard of a 'participial adjective'.

To give him a sense of the difference, show how these two sentences are each ambiguous between the two forms, and what you would have to do to disambiguate them:

i) Paris Hilton is entertaining

j) We were relieved

All credit to C-M and L-F for most of the examples here, as well as the basic structure of the argument.

[icnelly]

Woland, you really are great!

I've been churning this over in my head for too long now, and you've given some really great input, as well as book marks, so good looks on the references, and help!!

[EFLtrainer]

As with many bits of grammar, why can't it be more than one, an adjective and in passive voice? Or, why isn't finished quite simply part of the verb phrase? ...will be eaten...? All depends on context...

If it is referring to the "class" as meaning the group of people, then it is a verb, no? If "class" means the activity, not the people, then it can be adjectival, no?

Function... what's the word doing? Depends on the context...

Aaargh... this is why grammar as a primary basis for language acquisition is such a fool's errand.

[Privateer]

[Privateer]

[Universalis]

I don't have time to comment at length, but there are cases of clear ambiguity between linking verb+ADJ and passive to be+past participle. For example the sentence "They were married" has two possible meanings:

1) they were married at one point but have since gotten divorced.

or 2) they went through a marriage ceremony and were married *by* an agent.

I would point out to students that sometimes this sort of confusion is just part of English.

Brian