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gang ah jee
Joined: 14 Jan 2003
Location: city of paper
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 Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 12:21 am Post subject: BBC Documentary: The Power of Nightmares |
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The Power of Nightmares: the rise of neoconservatism and Islamic extremism is an excellent documentary from the BBC on what Adam Curtis calls the last two ideological movements in American and Arab-world politics. It looks at the origins of neoconservatism and Islamic extremism, and how the two ideologies have shaped today's world.
Part 1 - "Baby, it's Cold Outside"
Part 2 - "The Phantom Victory"
Part 3 - "The Shadows In The Cave"
It's hosted on google video, and each part is about 1 hour long.
Highly recommended. |
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gang ah jee
Joined: 14 Jan 2003
Location: city of paper
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| Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 4:50 am Post subject: |
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Has anyone checked this out yet? It's incredible. Definitely the best documentary I've seen on neoconservatism and radical islamism.
Watch it! |
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Sooke
Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Location: korea
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| Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 4:59 am Post subject: |
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Yes, they're fantastic documentaries. I downloaded them well over a year ago. They really show how this whole 'war on terror' is/was constructed.
Unfortunately, it will fall on deaf ears here, as the people who really need to see it won't.
I personally thought the best part was a slick black-haired Rummy (back in the day-mid 70's) saying that the Russians had stealth submarines. His proof was that because they (US intel) couldn't find anything about the stealth submarines, that proved the Russians had stealth submarines.
Fantistic Documentary. But it won't change the minds of the people who need to see it. (Although it is excellent for the choir!)
Other good documentaries:
BBC: Why We Fight.
PBS: The Dark Side (about how Cheny twisted intel to make Iraq the focus of the war while pulling troops out of Afghanistan). |
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Sleepy in Seoul
Joined: 15 May 2004
Location: Going in ever decreasing circles until I eventually disappear up my own fundament - in NZ
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| Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 6:03 am Post subject: |
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| Saw it over a year ago and burned DVD copies (for personal use only). Very thought provoking and not a little eye-opening. |
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Troll_Bait
Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Location: [T]eaching experience doesn't matter much. -Lee Young-chan (pictured)
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 9:18 pm Post subject: Re: BBC Documentary: The Power of Nightmares |
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| gang ah jee wrote: |
The Power of Nightmares: the rise of neoconservatism and Islamic extremism is an excellent documentary from the BBC on what Adam Curtis calls the last two ideological movements in American and Arab-world politics. It looks at the origins of neoconservatism and Islamic extremism, and how the two ideologies have shaped today's world.
Part 1 - "Baby, it's Cold Outside"
Part 2 - "The Phantom Victory"
Part 3 - "The Shadows In The Cave"
It's hosted on google video, and each part is about 1 hour long.
Highly recommended. |
While watching Part 3, the video stopped working. I tried again the next morning and, again, no dice, so I tried a different version here ...
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3649090417189127240
Here's an interesting follow-up:
Power of Nightmares re-awakened
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The Power of Nightmares is to be turned into a feature film to be screened at the Cannes film festival. It was first screened on BBC Two in Autumn 2004 as a series of three one hour documentaries questioning whether the threat of terrorism to the West is a politically driven fantasy and if al-Qaeda really is an organised network.
The BBC was inundated with correspondence, some critical much of it very positive. Viewers were invited to put their questions to the creator of the series, Adam Curtis. Here he responds to some of those correspondents, chosen to represent a broad selection of your questions. |
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"I know you have already been asked, but PLEASE, PLEASE, release the series on video or DVD"
Peter Grant, London
The problem is that the films are full of archive film and music from a multitude of sources. The reason my series are normally not released on DVD is that it is prohibitively costly and a nightmare - no pun intended - to clear the rights.
But so many people have now asked for the series to be released in this form that I think it probably will happen.
NOTE: We are very keen that the programmes are made widely available including in America and although the main networks have shown little interest, we are confident that the programmes will be shown in some form. There are however no plans for a book or that the BBC should publish transcripts in addition to the unofficial ones already existing on the internet. Further news about the Power of Nightmares and in particular availability of a DVD or video will be published here.
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"I have sat through your documentary tonight. I hope your programme is shown again following the next terrorist attack. You sound like the hedgehog who claims that cars won't hurt you!!!! I'm amazed!!!!!!!"
Iain Foster, Portsmouth
In the face of much more tangible threats in the past - like the IRA, the Soviet Union and even Nazi Germany - British governments did not encourage the people to behave like hedgehogs.
Why roll up into a ball now in the face of what is a serious but in no way an overwhelming threat to our nation and our freedoms?
The programmes did not say that there was no threat. What they argued was that although there is a serious threat of terrorism from some radical Islamists, the nightmare vision of a uniquely powerful hidden organisation waiting to strike our societies is an illusion.
The question the series tried to answer was why contemporary politicians and other elites, like the media, want you to feel frightened - to behave and feel like a hedgehog trapped on a motorway - when the reality and the scale of the threat is actually very different.
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"Surely, the danger is from the primitive belief in a god of whatever kind. Don't you agree that all sane people must reject religion whether Islamic, Christian, Judaist or whatever, as only such fanatical beliefs claim there is an absolute truth?"
Keith Hose, London
Stalin managed perfectly well without religion. To be blunt I think that religion has very little to do with this.
In the case of Islamism I think religious ideas were taken up and used by thinkers like Sayyid Qutb for political purposes to drive what is essentially a nationalist movement that flourished in the wake of the failure of the secular politics of Nasser.
I would suggest you read a fascinating article in this month's edition of Prospect magazine by Michael Hirsh. He argues that it was the marginalisation of Islam in Arab societies by Kemal Ataturk and Nasser that left Muslim societies unprotected against dictatorships. His view is that Islam will come to play a crucial role in the growth of future democracies in the Middle East.
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"Please can you attach to the website some suggestions for further reading"
Chris Drinkwater, Rochdale
For Islamism the best books are:
Jihad - The Trail of Political Islam by Gilles Kepel and his earlier book, The Prophet and the Pharaoh
The best insight into the ideas behind all this are in the writings of Sayyid Qutb - in particular Milestones (also translated as Signposts Along the Road)
Olivier Roy - The Failure of Political Islam and Globalized Islam.
Jason Burke - Al Qaeda
By far the best book on Afghanistan is The Fragmentation of Afghanistan by Barnett Rubin and his follow up called The Search for Peace in Afghanistan.
And Zawahiri's own account of the struggle which is actually very revealing - It is translated as Knight's under the Prophet's Banner (I think you can still find it on the internet)
For the history of Neoconservatism try:
The Rise of the Counterestablishment by Sidney Blumenthal
Neoconservatism by Irving Kristol
Leo Strauss and the American Right - Shadia Drury
Antiliberalism by Stephen Holmes
Recasting Conservatism by Robert devigne
Neoconservatism by Irving Kristol
The Closing of the American Mind by Allan Bloom
And for the weirdness of the 1990s:
Blinded by the Right - David Brock
The Gang of Five - The Leaders at the Centre of the Conservative Ascendancy - Nina Easton
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Many more question and comments follow, all answered by By Adam Curtis, the writer, producer and narrator of "The Power of Nightmares."
Also ...
Cannes to screen BBC's Nightmares
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| BBC documentary The Power of Nightmares is being turned into a feature film to be screened at Cannes' film festival. |
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wormholes101
Joined: 11 Mar 2003
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| Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 6:32 am Post subject: |
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Just watched the first two parts. It's a very revealing documentary. Thanks for the heads up. Some of the admissions are quite stunning.
For those interested in getting on a torrent rather than google video, here is the TORRENT LINK - DOWNLOAD HERE |
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ddeubel
Joined: 20 Jul 2005
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safeblad
Joined: 17 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2007 4:21 am Post subject: |
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it is an amazing documentary but i feel its getting dated fast, now the war on terrorism has poured so much oil on the fire. the radical islamists have now outgrown the role in which they were cast in the film.
i heard the only reason that they didnt make a movie of it was because they would have to pay so much money in royalties (the bbc gets to use short clips free), i love the way the film is edited with old movie clips thrown in for effect and crazy old footage of egyptians watching american stuff on tv in the 50s...things like that
http://www.wanttoknow.info/powerofnightmares |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2007 6:02 am Post subject: |
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| safeblad wrote: |
it is an amazing documentary but i feel its getting dated fast, now the war on terrorism has poured so much oil on the fire. the radical islamists have now outgrown the role in which they were cast in the film.
i heard the only reason that they didnt make a movie of it was because they would have to pay so much money in royalties (the bbc gets to use short clips free), i love the way the film is edited with old movie clips thrown in for effect and crazy old footage of egyptians watching american stuff on tv in the 50s...things like that
http://www.wanttoknow.info/powerofnightmares |
The war on terror has poured oil on the fire but only cause the US is not hitting hard enough. It is kind of like taking only half of the antibiotic required to cure the illness.
Remember for the record Algeria , Egypt , Syria , Iraq , and Jordan crushed and destroyed insurgencies in their own spheres of influence. Force does in fact work. |
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twg
Joined: 02 Nov 2006
Location: Getting some fresh air...
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| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2007 6:18 am Post subject: |
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| Okay Joo. What steps do you feel need to be taken by the US before it can be considered "Hitting hard enough"? |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2007 6:38 am Post subject: |
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| twg wrote: |
| Okay Joo. What steps do you feel need to be taken by the US before it can be considered "Hitting hard enough"? |
First of all the US needs to lift the ban on assassinations. And start killing mideast elties and put in a new policy: anyone who calls for holy war against the US is themselves a target for assassination. Targeted killings work.
The US can also indemnify CIA agents from lawsuits and prosecution when they undertake anti terror operations. Right now the CIA is too intimidated to do anything really effective.
That is a start.
Also the US needs to invest in the next generation of weapons so it can project power far more effectively than it does now.
Also invest in and deploy this
and this
and keep them focused on Iran. |
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