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keane
Joined: 09 Jul 2007
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 Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 12:39 am Post subject: Anti-terrorism Prosecutions: failure? |
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Defense rests.
Terrorism cases brought by gov. have made us safer? 58% disagree. 30% agree.
Anti-terrorism laws have made us safer? 80% disagree.
Not surprisingly, DoJ chose not to participate to give the prosecutor's view.
There's more there. Enjoy. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 5:39 am Post subject: |
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Defense attorneys who defended terror suspects like Ramsey Clark and Lynne Stewart. Many of them are radicals who hate the US governments and sympathize with the enemy.
The US justice system isn't up to dealing with AQ. Only around 36 have been convicted of terror and those few cases used up huge resources.
If every terrorist was put before the US justice system in would be overwhelmed in no time and all the methods and techniques that the US uses to get information would be compromised in cross examination. |
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keane
Joined: 09 Jul 2007
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 6:05 am Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| Defense attorneys who defended terror suspects like Ramsey Clark and Lynne Stewart. Many of them are radicals who hate the US governments and sympathize with the enemy. |
Rhhee, you're talking out of your butt. I challenge you to support your slander. I invite you to note that the OP addressed the fact there were no prosecutors in the survey. Whose responsibility was that, Rhhee? Why would the administration not allow their lawyers to comment? Surely they would all have said the opposite of that in the OP? |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 6:45 am Post subject: |
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You are talking out of your butt Kane or whatever your name is.
Defense attorneys who have tried terrorism cases score the legal system's response to 9/11
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If you want to know how well the justice system is combating terrorism, you�ve got to talk to the lawyers involved.
So we asked 50 defense attorneys who�ve worked on federal terrorism cases since 9/11 their opinions of the legal war on terror. (We also asked 50 prosecutors, but U.S. Department of Justice spokesman Dean Boyd told assistant U.S. attorneys across the country not to participate. He declined to tell us his reason. |
They would defend Osama Bin Laden
Famous lawyers who have defended terrorists include Ramsey Clark and Lynne Stewart.
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Who rushed to Saddams' defense Ramsey Clark.
Often those that are willing to defend these guys are those who have a grudge against the US..
anyway where is your proof that the adminstration is the reason the prosecutors would not comment? |
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keane
Joined: 09 Jul 2007
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:39 am Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
They would defend Osama Bin Laden
Famous lawyers who have defended terrorists include Ramsey Clark and Lynne Stewart.
Who rushed to Saddams' defense Ramsey Clark.
Often those that are willing to defend these guys are those who have a grudge against the US.. |
Good god... do you not understand what a defense lawyer does? You appear to have no idea how the legal system is set up. Whether a lawyer agrees with, likes, or approves of their client is irrelevant. What is relevant is that the legal protection that all are considered innocent under the law until proven guilty is upheld.
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| anyway where is your proof that the adminstration is the reason the prosecutors would not comment? |
Proof? Christ on a stick, man, read the damned article! |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:49 am Post subject: |
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[quote="keane"]
| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
They would defend Osama Bin Laden
Famous lawyers who have defended terrorists include Ramsey Clark and Lynne Stewart.
Who rushed to Saddams' defense Ramsey Clark.
Often those that are willing to defend these guys are those who have a grudge against the US.. |
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Good god... do you not understand what a defense lawyer does? You appear to have no idea how the legal system is set up. Whether a lawyer agrees with, likes, or approves of their client is irrelevant. What is relevant is that the legal protection that all are considered innocent under the law until proven guilty is upheld. |
yeah nevertheless they are very eager to take these cases. It is easy to guess why. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:49 am Post subject: |
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They would defend Osama Bin Laden
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So? Adolf Eichmann had a defense lawyer representing him when he was tried in Israel. And I'm sure the Israelis wouldn't have had it any other way. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:51 am Post subject: |
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yeah nevertheless they are very eager to take these cases. It is easy to guess why.
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But what difference does it make if they take the case because they hate the US, or if they take it because they just think that everyone is entitles to counsel. Either way, the lawyer is obligated to put forth his best effort on his behald of his client. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:52 am Post subject: |
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| On the other hand wrote: |
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They would defend Osama Bin Laden
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So? Adolf Eichmann had a defense lawyer representing him when he was tried in Israel. And I'm sure the Israelis wouldn't have had it any other way. |
yeah special case.
I am sure Ramsey Clark just wanted justice for Saddam. and Lynne Stewart wasn't defending Rahman for any other reason except she wanted to make sure he got a good defense. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:53 am Post subject: |
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I am sure Ramsey Clark just wanted justice for Saddam. and Lynne Stewart wasn't defending Rahman for any other reason except she wanted to make sure he got a good defense.
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See my previous post.
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yeah special case.
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What was so special about the Eichmann case? |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 8:15 am Post subject: |
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[quote="On the other hand"]
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I am sure Ramsey Clark just wanted justice for Saddam. and Lynne Stewart wasn't defending Rahman for any other reason except she wanted to make sure he got a good defense.
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See my previous post.
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yeah special case.
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What was so special about the Eichmann case?[ |
A special case for the world to see.
Clark and Stewart have different motives. They want to get enemies of the US off cause they want to see the US have trouble.
Even Ron Kuby the left wing lawyer has stated that he would not defend Bin Laden.
The ones who defend the terrorists in many cases are ones who want to see the terrorists go free not out of giving them justice and a good representation but because they want to see the US have problems.
all so notice that less than 40 terrorists have even been convicted and each one was a major effort.
tens of thousands of AQ plus Hizzbollah would overwhelm the US system. and compromise US intel sources and techniques.
The fact that the lawyers believe what they do when that reality is out there shows a lot about their views. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 8:32 am Post subject: |
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Clark and Stewart have different motives. They want to get enemies of the US off cause they want to see the US have trouble.
Even Ron Kuby the left wing lawyer has stated that he would not defend Bin Laden.
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But what differnece does it make if these people defend Bin Laden or not?
Let's say every single defense lawyer in private practice refuses to defend Bin Laden. Then the court will just appoint a lawyer to defend him. And that lawyer, if he is competent, will make the exact same arguments, dig up the exact same technicalities and loopholes, as a hired gun would. |
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Nowhere Man
Joined: 08 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 11:19 am Post subject: ... |
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| Then the court will just appoint a lawyer to defend him. |
And then, when he's finished defending bin Laden, we can hang him outside the court house.
YEAH! |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for the article, Keane.
Nothing surprising there, but worth the perusal.
The American Bar Association was one short of a unanimous vote in calling Bush's use of torture unlawful.
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| �The use of official cruelty has repeatedly been shown to be far from the best means of extracting truthful information,� said Opotowsky, who proposed the resolution. She noted that a U.S. Army field manual on intelligence interrogations issued last September barred the controversial interrogation techniques that will be available to the CIA. �Unfortunately, the executive order sets a lower standard for the CIA,� she said. |
Yes, Joo, the Bush administration has made the world more dangerous for Americans by allowing the CIA to torture subjects rather than actually interrogate them. This entire time, the lawyers at the Pentagon have been fighting Bush, and they finally won. Bush has rolled back his policy with the Armed Forces, but he has allowed the CIA to continue using water-boarding techniques.
Lastly, Joo, I do not see any profit in attacking lawyers who have defended suspected terrorists. The important word in that sentence is 'suspected.' |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 4:17 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="On the other hand"][
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| But what differnece does it make if these people defend Bin Laden or not? |
The reason they want to is important. Of course everyone is entitled to a fair trial, but the reasons behind more than a few of these lawyers are just they want to see the terrorists go free.
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Let's say every single defense lawyer in private practice refuses to defend Bin Laden. Then the court will just appoint a lawyer to defend him. And that lawyer, if he is competent, will make the exact same arguments, dig up the exact same technicalities and loopholes, as a hired gun would |
Sure I don't have a problem with that.
I am just saying that a lot of the lawyers who defend the terrorsts hate the US government a probably root for the terrorists even when they are not their clients.
Think Lynne Stewart. Ramsey Clark. |
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