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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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 Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 11:47 pm Post subject: Is �Do Unto Others� Written Into Our Genes? |
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Where do moral rules come from? From reason, some philosophers say. From God, say believers. Seldom considered is a source now being advocated by some biologists, that of evolution.
At first glance, natural selection and the survival of the fittest may seem to reward only the most selfish values. But for animals that live in groups, selfishness must be strictly curbed or there will be no advantage to social living. Could the behaviors evolved by social animals to make societies work be the foundation from which human morality evolved?
In a series of recent articles and a book, �The Happiness Hypothesis,� Jonathan Haidt, a moral psychologist at the University of Virginia, has been constructing a broad evolutionary view of morality that traces its connections both to religion and to politics.
Dr. Haidt (pronounced height) began his research career by probing the emotion of disgust. Testing people�s reactions to situations like that of a hungry family that cooked and ate its pet dog after it had become roadkill, he explored the phenomenon of moral dumbfounding � when people feel strongly that something is wrong but cannot explain why.
Dumbfounding led him to view morality as driven by two separate mental systems, one ancient and one modern, though the mind is scarcely aware of the difference. The ancient system, which he calls moral intuition, is based on the emotion-laden moral behaviors that evolved before the development of language. The modern system � he calls it moral judgment � came after language, when people became able to articulate why something was right or wrong.
The emotional responses of moral intuition occur instantaneously � they are primitive gut reactions that evolved to generate split-second decisions and enhance survival in a dangerous world. Moral judgment, on the other hand, comes later, as the conscious mind develops a plausible rationalization for the decision already arrived at through moral intuition.
Moral dumbfounding, in Dr. Haidt�s view, occurs when moral judgment fails to come up with a convincing explanation for what moral intuition has decided.
So why has evolution equipped the brain with two moral systems when just one might seem plenty?
�We have a complex animal mind that only recently evolved language and language-based reasoning,� Dr. Haidt said. �No way was control of the organism going to be handed over to this novel faculty.�
He likens the mind�s subterranean moral machinery to an elephant, and conscious moral reasoning to a small rider on the elephant�s back. Psychologists and philosophers have long taken a far too narrow view of morality, he believes, because they have focused on the rider and largely ignored the elephant.
Dr. Haidt developed a better sense of the elephant after visiting India at the suggestion of an anthropologist, Richard Shweder. In Bhubaneswar, in the Indian state of Orissa, Dr. Haidt saw that people recognized a much wider moral domain than the issues of harm and justice that are central to Western morality. Indians were concerned with integrating the community through rituals and committed to concepts of religious purity as a way to restrain behavior.
On his return from India, Dr. Haidt combed the literature of anthropology and psychology for ideas about morality throughout the world. He identified five components of morality that were common to most cultures. Some concerned the protection of individuals, others the ties that bind a group together.
Of the moral systems that protect individuals, one is concerned with preventing harm to the person and the other with reciprocity and fairness. Less familiar are the three systems that promote behaviors developed for strengthening the group. These are loyalty to the in-group, respect for authority and hierarchy, and a sense of purity or sanctity.
The five moral systems, in Dr. Haidt�s view, are innate psychological mechanisms that predispose children to absorb certain virtues. Because these virtues are learned, morality may vary widely from culture to culture, while maintaining its central role of restraining selfishness. In Western societies, the focus is on protecting individuals by insisting that everyone be treated fairly. Creativity is high, but society is less orderly. In many other societies, selfishness is suppressed �through practices, rituals and stories that help a person play a cooperative role in a larger social entity,� Dr. Haidt said. |
http://www.nytimes.com |
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Masta_Don
Joined: 17 Aug 2006
Location: Hyehwa-dong, Seoul
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| Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 12:36 am Post subject: |
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Seems to be society is a choice based on cost/benefit analysis. People will always want more than their neighbor but realize that attacking/stealing from them will leave them open for others to do the same (tic for tac). Not only that but open and trusting relationships will promote communication (gossip) which is another safety feature, to prevent frauds from suckering you.
What I mean is that I don't see the link between these 'five morals system' and genetics. How did group living arise? I don't know, but I do know it was around before humans. Survival of the individual isn't what's important, but survival of the gene. So if a group of individuals carrying the same gene live together, protection in the name of the gene is more important than any one member. If a few die so that the society can live and pass on the gene, the gene wins.
That's why a compulsion to help others gets weaker as the other becomes more distantly related (see: kin selection, group selection, Greenbeard and altruism). |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 12:46 am Post subject: |
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4444
Last edited by thepeel on Thu Sep 27, 2007 10:59 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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flakfizer
Joined: 12 Nov 2004
Location: scaling the Cliffs of Insanity with a frayed rope.
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| Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 1:35 am Post subject: |
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| If it is, then humans have an amazing way of going against there own instincts...over and over and over. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 3:53 am Post subject: |
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| flakfizer wrote: |
| If it is, then humans have an amazing way of going against there own instincts...over and over and over. |
That's what makes us human, no? No matter what moral system, be it religious/god given or based on genetic survival, humans will route around it. |
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igotthisguitar
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)
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| Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 4:06 am Post subject: |
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| Generosity is the 1st step on the path to wisdom. |
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flakfizer
Joined: 12 Nov 2004
Location: scaling the Cliffs of Insanity with a frayed rope.
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| Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 4:10 am Post subject: |
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| igotthisguitar wrote: |
| Generosity is the 1st step on the path to wisdom. |
That statement is not very wise. And that's being generous.
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 4:29 am Post subject: |
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Lions are social; tigers aren't. Geese flock; eagles don't. Chimps are; orangutans aren't. Humans are.
All animals have certain behaviors wired in, depending on the species.
Chances are, there are lions, geese and chimps who have been wangtta-ed--we just don't know about them. |
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keane
Joined: 09 Jul 2007
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| Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 4:51 am Post subject: |
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| BJWD wrote: |
| Extreme liberals, Dr. Haidt argues, attach almost no importance to the moral systems that protect the group. Because conservatives do give some weight to individual protections, |
What rock has he been living under, and how much coolaide is included in his diet? Conservatives interested individual protections?
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...they often have a better understanding of liberal views than liberals do of conservative attitudes, in his view.
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This is fully laughable. I hope to Gaia he's using these terms in some way I'm missing, or he's been spending too much time in an ivory tower and not enough in the real workd.
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| Dr. Haidt, who describes himself as a moderate liberal, says that societies need people with both types of personality. �A liberal morality will encourage much greater creativity but will weaken social structure and deplete social capital,� he said. �I am really glad we have New York and San Francisco � most of our creativity comes out of cities like these. But a nation that was just New York and San Francisco could not survive very long. Conservatives give more to charity and tend to be more supportive of essential institutions like the military and law enforcement.� |
I agree with his basic premise, but have yet to meet a mature liberal who thought no military, and certainly no police, were a good idea. Most do believe in limiting them, I'd say, though.
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| Lots of this conservative/liberal stuff lately. But the "extreme liberals" (which I assume to be leftists) being fully unattached to moral systems that protect their own group is quite interesting. |
I think his take is wrong. Liberals aren't running around in attack dog packs like cons, so he thinks they have no connection. I disagree. It is a very loose confederation, but to say none is incorrect. |
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Pligganease
Joined: 14 Sep 2004
Location: The deep south...
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| Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 4:56 am Post subject: |
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| keane wrote: |
| Liberals aren't running around in attack dog packs... |
Thanks, I needed a good laugh!  |
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