Site Search:
 
Dave's ESL Cafe's Student Discussion Forums Forum Index Dave's ESL Cafe's Student Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Students and Teachers from Around the World!"
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

About a grammar problem: mustn�t

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Dave's ESL Cafe's Student Discussion Forums Forum Index -> Help Center
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Hong-Hsien, Ke



Joined: 04 Dec 2008
Posts: 4
Location: Taiwan

PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 7:39 am    Post subject: About a grammar problem: mustn�t Reply with quote

Dear tutors:
Recently, I have studied about English grammar. One example in the grammar book, Understanding and using English grammar (Azar), confuses me. It is an exercise for the modals. Here it is.

A: Mrs. Wilson got a traffic ticket. She didn't stop at a stop sign.
B: That's surprising. Usually she's very cautious driver and obeys all the traffic laws. She �must not have seen" the sign.

The meaning of "mustn�t� is equal to the prohibition. Here, the answer in the book is She �must not have seen" the sign. I feel so confused. How we explain that?

Best wishes,
Yu-fen Lu
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
rice07



Joined: 26 Oct 2007
Posts: 385

PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 5:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi

Cited a grammar book handy as saying:

In American English, must not is often used when something is not logically impossible, but when there is strong evidence for believing that it is not the case. Compare:

He only left the office five minutes ago. He can't be home yet. (It's logically impossible that he's home.)

She's not answering the doorbell. She must not be at home. (It's not logically impossible that she's home, but it seems pretty certain that she isn't.)

The restaurant can't be open-- the door's locked.

That restaurant must not be any good-- it's always empty.

In British English, can't is normal for both meanings (though some people use must not for the 'seems pretty certain' meaning). Compare:

She walked past without saying 'Hello'. She must not have seen you.(AmE; some British speakers.)

She walked past without saying 'Hello'. She can't have seen you. (most British speakers.)

Note that the contracted form mustn't is rare in AmE.

So, according to your example sentence--She �must not have seen" the sign, it means '她不太可能有看到那個號誌(or 她應該沒有看到那個號誌)' for Chinese(Mandarin).

Hope that helps.

rice


Last edited by rice07 on Thu Nov 05, 2009 7:16 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Hong-Hsien, Ke



Joined: 04 Dec 2008
Posts: 4
Location: Taiwan

PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 6:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see. Thanks a lot!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
CP



Joined: 12 Jun 2006
Posts: 2875
Location: California

PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 8:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also, I think the grammar book means to say that, in the U.S. at least, if we use "mustn't" at all (and it is pretty rare), we use it to mean "shouldn't" or "had better not", meaning if you do there will be consequences.

You mustn't take your neighbor's bike without permission = You should never take your neighbor's bike without permission; that is wrong.

You could say "She mustn't have seen the stop sign," but usually you would say "must not" rather than "mustn't" to convey the meaning "I doubt that she saw the stop sign."
_________________
You live a new life for every new language you speak. -Czech proverb
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Dave's ESL Cafe's Student Discussion Forums Forum Index -> Help Center All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Dave's ESL Cafe is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Banner Advertising | Bookstore / Alta Books | FAQs | Articles | Interview with Dave
Copyright © 2018 Dave's ESL Cafe | All Rights Reserved | Contact Dave's ESL Cafe | Site Map

Teachers College, Columbia University: Train to Teach English Here or Abroad
SIT
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group