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dduck
Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 109 Location: Scotland/Mexico
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Posted: Fri Feb 07, 2003 5:11 am Post subject: Re: The Real World. |
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Diana wrote: |
It would be nice to live in a ... world where children are taught tolerance and that one should learn to listen and compromise. |
Diana, I have edited your words very slightly. I think much of what you say is negative, you focus on the bad, the evil of the world and I think it's dragging you down. I think if you take the time to look inside yourself you'll see that what I say is true.
As you say I'm idealistic, I focus on the good (however, I don't deny the bad) and in doing so I try to give hope to others. Hope that tomorrow, at least, won't be as hard as today.
I think you should listen to your own words, above, and consider what you can do to make them a reality.
Peace and Love,
Iain _________________
Teachers open the door, but you must enter by yourself.
--Chinese Proverb |
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Hala
Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 20
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Posted: Fri Feb 07, 2003 6:28 am Post subject: |
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" I would be true, for there are those who trust me;
I would be pure, for there are those who care;
I would be stong, for there is much to suffer;
I would be brave, for there is much to dare."
_Howard Arnold Walter
Diana look at the bright side, look at the pepole who want peace. They take their children to the street asking for peace.
Diana , love reduce love. Violence reduce violence. |
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Diana
Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 494 Location: Guam, USA
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Posted: Fri Feb 07, 2003 11:06 am Post subject: Re: The Real World. |
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dduck wrote: |
Diana wrote: |
It would be nice to live in a ... world where children are taught tolerance and that one should learn to listen and compromise. |
Diana, I have edited your words very slightly. I think much of what you say is negative, you focus on the bad, the evil of the world and I think it's dragging you down. I think if you take the time to look inside yourself you'll see that what I say is true.
As you say I'm idealistic, I focus on the good (however, I don't deny the bad) and in doing so I try to give hope to others. Hope that tomorrow, at least, won't be as hard as today.
I think you should listen to your own words, above, and consider what you can do to make them a reality.
Peace and Love,
Iain |
I do look at the bright side of things, Dduck. If you look at my posts in culture, I do say things like "Happy Chinese New Year" to everyone. Does this sound like I am a negative person? And if you have known me as Wing and Pugachev V. have for quite some time, you would have known that I also have a sense of humor (even when I didn't have any electricity). I have also gone into "Learning English" sometimes to help people with their English. But this is "Current News" Dduck. What do you expect in Current News? Jeez. In "Current News," we usually talk about negative things such as terrorism, weapons of mass destruction, war, the situation in North Korea etc. In Current News, I discuss politics and history and there is nothing good I have to say about politics. What do you expect in Politics? Of course, the things I say are negative mainly because the topic of discussion is on terrorism. I have always condemn terrorism. I never condoned it. Do you see anything good in terrorism? If so, please enlighten me.
Hala, of all people, you should know that I have always debated on history and politics. But I also look at the good side of things. Don't you remember, it was me who told Pugachev V. that a majority of muslims are not terrorists and that a majority of Palestinians and Israelis want peace? You know that I've always condemned terrorism from my previous posts. But you also know that I am not like Pugachev V. who discriminates against your religion. Don't you remember? I even argued with Pugachev V. about that. Don't you even remember that it was me who told Pugachev V. and Moneytalks to be tolerant? What does that tell you about me? I am a person who basically looks at facts. I am a realist except when it comes to God. A vast majority of people are good, but the few who are terrorists are the ones I don't see any good in them. And it's these few I mostly discussed about in Current News. Hala, from my previous posts, you should have already known that I see a majority of muslims as good people, but the few who are terrorists are the ones I condemned. I am very disappointed in you, Hala. How dare you tell me about ending violence! When all along, I never even show support of terrorism. I say bad things about the terrorists, Hala, because they are the ones supporting violence! You should have already known that I have never in any of my posts supported the killing of innocent people!
I don't support war in Iraq because I've always believe that we should try to solves things peacefully. I also don't support Saddam because he is a ruthless dictator and gassed his own people using chemcals. And I also don't support Osama Bin Laden and the Al-Queda organization because they are a terrorist group who have killed innocent people. AND YOU DARE TELL ME TO REDUCE THE VIOLENCE! I am reducing the violence by not supporting these things!
As for you Dduck, I am making this a better world by condemning terrorism. I don't make excuses for these atrocities that were committed on humankind because there are no excuses or any justification for the killing of innocents. By condemning it, I hope that people around the world (expecially the terrorists themselves) will see that such atrocities should not be practiced.
The only reason I enjoy going into Current News is because I enjoy discussing the front page of the newspapers. But that doesn't mean that I don't see the good side of things. When I say that I wish I could live in a world where EVERYONE teaches tolerance, I meant that as a figure of speech because I know that there are SOME who teach hate. If I really wanted to live in a world where EVERYONE teaches tolerance, I would be living in HEAVEN. |
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wing
Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 193
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Posted: Fri Feb 07, 2003 5:04 pm Post subject: Re: the Real World |
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I agree with you, Diana.
Since the the 1993 signing of the Oslo Accords, Palestinian terrorists still killed Israeli people. The peaceful pact does not bring peace to both parties, but haven't the Palestinians agree to end the violence, prevent hostile propaganda and such to honor their commitments?
Too bad that "bomb-them-with-love" method has no effect on them. They have not taken the chance of a life time to suspend the hatred and revenge of ages. Althought Israel maintains tremendous power but are of little importance in day-to-day terrorism. The episode has already told us that Arafat is a documented liar. Treaties and agreements are not worth a pound in his and most Palestinian eyes.
"Let's talk about love" is really easier said than done. We have never ever lived in a world that they have had for a long long time. We don't know how many sacrifices of lives can earn how long the time is in peace. If I were an Israeli resident, I personally had no guts to wait for them to kill me, and before that try to peach the importance of love.
No one has said there is no hope, Iain. Diana just said "What else is there left to do?" I don't think you try to listen to her but quite misunderstand what she meant to say and build an assumption on it. Good listener should be mutual. Palestinians seem not to be like good listeners. On the other hand, Israel only knows there is no way to treat the underdogs as human beings.
Hala, no one here wants war as long as you remember. And I assure you that no one would like to look the world that is purple. What Diana said is just a matter of fact so far as I am concerned. I am not swimming in my own purple fishbowl. Up to now who have ever opposed to practise such an idealistic approach?
Diana, I wanted to write to you about this earlier than this moment. Sorry that I was not in the mood.
Regards
Last edited by wing on Sat Feb 08, 2003 5:02 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Hala
Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 20
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Posted: Sat Feb 08, 2003 9:05 am Post subject: |
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Dear Diana
First of all, I didn't say you reduce violence. When I said violence reduce violence, I mean that, The war against Iraq it will reduce more terrorisms.
And I know you are tolerance and that what I like about you. And if you remember I told you that before" I like you".I have nothing against you Diana.
Dear Wing
Let's go to this way: If you are Palestinian, so already Israel occupied your home, and refuged your people, and killed so many members of your family, and you can't go to your school because Israel army closed,and you leader steal your money, and now you are with no hope ,no love, no food, no home. And if you think that kind of propaganda. You can read about this in Jewish side who are against occupation:www.jewsagainsttheoccupation.org
so, you are lucky and me because we are not Israeli resident, not Paletinian too. |
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wing
Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 193
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Posted: Sat Feb 08, 2003 4:56 pm Post subject: |
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Dear Hala,
I hope you to know that I didn't mean what you tell me is hostile propaganda. I disagree Israel reacts harshly to them. Maybe, could you tell me if Israel injected Palestinians with the AIDS virus, poisoned Palestinian food products and threatened to destroy the Al-Aksa mosque? Probably it is a mere propaganda as an incitement to violence against Israel. Probably not.
Again, if I were a Palestinian resident and could not avoid the fate just as you said, I would know why.
"As a Palestinian police officer, I will not hesitate to give my gun to anyone who approaches me and tells me he is going to commit an attack against the army or the settlers. I will even kiss the gun before and after the operation."
- a P.L.O. recruit from Ramallah for the Palestinian police (Iton Yerushalayim, 10 December 1993) |
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Diana
Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 494 Location: Guam, USA
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Posted: Sat Feb 08, 2003 7:22 pm Post subject: |
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Hala wrote: |
Dear Diana
First of all, I didn't say you reduce violence. When I said violence reduce violence, I mean that, The war against Iraq it will reduce more terrorisms.
And I know you are tolerance and that what I like about you. And if you remember I told you that before" I like you".I have nothing against you Diana.
. |
Hello Hala,
I keep hoping that we don't go to war, but I just received an e-mail from my brother and a friend who is also in the military. My friend is now being deployed to the Persian Gulf, and my brother is coming into the Pacific region due to North Korea. This is all bad news that I'm receiving, and it's making me sad. I don't know if you know, Hala, but Ken in Australia has passed away. He had a major stroke. Wing, Pugachev V, and I are very sad upon learning this. Wing is going away for a while. I hope she is okay and comes back soon. I haven't heard from Pugachev V. I hope he is okay too.
In regards to terrorism, the terrorists are madmen, Hala. They don't make any sense. I think they need to be placed in a mental hospital. Even when President Clinton tried to establish peace between Israel and the Palestinians, Bin Laden and his Al-Queda organization still killed Americans. The Oslo Peace Process occurred in 1993, and in the same year, Bin Laden bombed the World Trade Center using a truck. As the peace process was underway, Bin Laden bombed 2 U.S. embassies in Africa and the U.S.S. Cole. And here we were in the midst of establishing the greatest peace process between Israel and the Palestinians, and we get bombed. It wasn't until September 2000 when the peace process fell. A year after that the World Trade Center was destroyed using planes.
It is not easy to get Israel and the Palestinians to establish peace, but that doesn't mean it isn't impossible. As shown in history, Egypt and Jordan has established a peace treaty with Israel; therefore, this shows that it is possible for the Palestinians to establish peace with Israel. The Palestinians can learn from Egypt's example. As Wing said, bombing them with love is not going to help. These two can't love each other because in the first place they can't even trust each other. |
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someone
Joined: 26 Jan 2003 Posts: 19 Location: 01
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Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2003 11:50 am Post subject: |
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hi all ... i had read your messeges ,, before u read my post remember
we are here to discuss not to bother anyone ,,
if America became friendly towards the Arab nations and listened to the disquiet concerning the Israeli - Palestine issue most Arabs would welcome it and the general antipathy they currently have towards the US would dissapate
dduck
u are realistic .. u are completely right ..
i agree with u ,, i agree with u ,,
Diana ..
1- i think that u got awrong image about muslims ..
2- ANYONE dont have to love americanas or any other country but in the same time he can be kind to other when they are kind with him ..
3- before the painful events of the 11Sep. there was another painful one ..
and
how sad that when the unarmed father saw his innecot son killed between his arms without any excuse ???....
and there are more and more in pastanian ...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
thanx all
someone |
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Diana
Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 494 Location: Guam, USA
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Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2003 12:16 pm Post subject: |
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someone wrote: |
hi all ... i had read your messeges ,, before u read my post remember
we are here to discuss not to bother anyone ,,
if America became friendly towards the Arab nations and listened to the disquiet concerning the Israeli - Palestine issue most Arabs would welcome it and the general antipathy they currently have towards the US would dissapate
dduck
u are realistic .. u are completely right ..
i agree with u ,, i agree with u ,,
Diana ..
1- i think that u got awrong image about muslims ..
2- ANYONE dont have to love americanas or any other country but in the same time he can be kind to other when they are kind with him ..
3- before the painful events of the 11Sep. there was another painful one ..
and
how sad that when the unarmed father saw his innecot son killed between his arms without any excuse ???....
and there are more and more in pastanian ...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
thanx all
someone |
You say I got the wrong image of Muslims, someone? I just told Hala that not all muslims are terrorists. Only a few of them are. So tell me, someone what exactly is the wrong image I got about that???? Are you telling me that ALL muslims are terrorists, someone??????? Is that your image of muslims???? I think you better look at your image if you think that all muslims are terrorists.
And even as we tried to help, (as others have done), they still hate us. America is already damned if we do help and damned if we don't help. As I said, President Clinton's "hands-on" policy with Israel and the Palestinians didn't work. They hate us. Bush's "hands-off" policy doesn't work either. They still hate us. If we get involved, they accuse us of interfering. If we don't get involve, they accuse us of being indifferent.
If you had really been reading my posts,you would have known that Osama Bin Laden really doesn't care about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. If he did, then why bomb the U.S. embassies in Africa and the U.S.S. cole at a time when Israel and the Palestinians developed the Oslo Accords, which turned out to be a HISTORIC EPISODE. So, as pointed out, they really didn't care about the Palestinians cause at all. The bombings of the U.S. embassies and the Cole DURING THE OSLO PEACE PROCESS IS EVIDENCE THAT THEY DIDN'T CARE ABOUT ISRAEL OR THE PALESTINIANS. Open your eyes! Or better yet, Use your brain!!!! If you're trying to help them and they still bomb you, what does that tell you??? DUH!!!!
I opt that we leave Israel and the Palestinians alone to try to solve their own problems.
Last edited by Diana on Sun Feb 09, 2003 10:44 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Diana
Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 494 Location: Guam, USA
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Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2003 6:02 pm Post subject: In Addition. |
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By the way, I would also like to add that evidence has been found that Osama Bin Laden and his Al-Queda gang actually made plans to kill the Pope. Okay, can anyone tell me why Al-Queda terrorists would want to kill the Pope???????? Let me guess! He wasn't kind enough. Does that sound correct????
Terrorists are criminals. That's all they are. And you want me to sympathize with criminals and be kind to them?? As far as I'm concern, criminals should be brought to justice when they commit a crime. I'll be kind to other people, but not terrorists.
I condemned the actions of the terrorists. I don't care if they are muslims, Jews, or Christians terrorists. I also condemned the action of Timothy McVeigh. I have no sympathy for any terrorists. My sympathies lies with the innocent victims.
What I find appalling is people who actually think it was okay and justified for 19 Al-Queda terrorists to get aboard airplanes and kill 3000 innocent people. By supporting these terrorists, you are telling the 3000 victims that they do deserve to die. My sympathies are also with the victims in the Bali and Kenya attacks. |
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dduck
Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 109 Location: Scotland/Mexico
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Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2003 7:22 am Post subject: |
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Diana wrote: |
You say I got the wrong image of Muslims, someone? I just told Hala that not all muslims are terrorists. Only a few of them are. So tell me, someone what exactly is the wrong image I got about that???? Are you telling me that ALL muslims are terrorists, someone??????? Is that your image of muslims???? I think you better look at your image if you think that all muslims are terrorists. |
I don't believe someone is claiming all muslims are terrorists. It looks to me he reacting against your negative view of the Israeli - Arab conflict. You say "America is already damned if we do help and damned if we don't help." My original point is that there is hope, there is always: despair is the death of the soul. It seems to me that someone wants peace and believe's it is achievable.
Quote: |
Open your eyes! Or better yet, Use your brain!!!! If you're trying to help them and they still bomb you, what does that tell you??? DUH!!!! |
You should remember that you're talking to real human beings with feelings. Insulting comments don't help you get your point across.
Iain _________________
Teachers open the door, but you must enter by yourself.
--Chinese Proverb |
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Diana
Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 494 Location: Guam, USA
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Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2003 12:28 pm Post subject: Hope for Israel and Palestine. |
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Dduck, if you read my comments to Chris in "To Dduck on Solutions," you will see that I do see hope with Israel and the Palestinians. Remember, I read the Oslo Process. A majority of Palestinians and Israelis want peace, and it can be achieved. If you read the discussions between Chris and me, we were looking at how it can be achieved.
Previously, I said that the terrorists are filled with hate. You're response was that if America were to listen to the Arab Israeli conflict, then the Arab world would like us. Dduck, I already told you that during Clinton's Presidency, the Oslo Accords was developed. It was a historic moment for both Israel and the Palestinians when the Oslo Accords was signed. At that time, the U.S. and the Arab world saw this hope that peace could actually exist between Israel and the Palestinians. Yet during this hopeful episode for peace, Bin Laden and his Al-Queda gang bombed 2 U.S. embassies in Africa and the U.S.S. Cole. So, what does this tell you about Al-Queda?
Osama Bin Laden and Al-Queda have their own agenda, which has nothing to do with the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. These terrorists are filled with so much hate - hate enough to destroy themselves and everyone around them, and this is the vilest form of hate I've ever seen in my entire life. This kind of hatred actually blinds people that it's difficult for them to see the truth or any kind of warmth and kindness. As an example: One of these 19 terrorists who lived in the United States saw a man watering flowers in the park. The terrorist took this as a sign that all Americans are materialistic people - simply because this one man was watering flowers. Instead of thinking that some Americans care about Mother Earth or their environment, he took it as proof that Americans are godless, materialistic people. So, what does this tell you about Al-Queda?
These are people who actually made plans to kill the Pope!! And what in the world did the Pope do that got them riled up? I've asked this question to Pugachev V. and Chris ever since I found out that Al-Queda planned to kill the Pope. Pugachev V's answer was because the Pope could probably rile up the Catholic community against Islam. Personally, I think it's because they see the Pope as the leader of infidels.
Okay, I will try to keep insulting remarks out. I can't promise you that, but I will try. If you think that was insulting, you should have seen what I wrote to Brainbox a few months ago. I had to censor my comments by using *****.
Last edited by Diana on Mon Feb 10, 2003 1:20 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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someone
Joined: 26 Jan 2003 Posts: 19 Location: 01
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Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2003 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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hi one again Diana
..
I opt that we leave Israel and the Palestinians alone to try to solve their own problems
I condemned the actions of the terrorists. I don't care if they are muslims, Jews, or Christians terrorists.
i beg your pardon Diana.. i really wonder how do u condemne all terrorists and in the same time , when we talk about the jwes terrorism you opt to leave them solve their problem ..u prefare to escape their terrible terrisom ....
when the jews killed the innecot people and made more than 3millions homeless u prefere to leave them alon but when 300 people killed u sympathize and feel sad ..
and after all that u say
I condemned the actions of the terrorists. I don't care if they are muslims, Jews, or Christians terrorists.
really u wonder me ...
anyway Diana, it still your opinion and I respect it .
THANX VERY MUCH DIANA
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
dduck
thanx so much ….your post encouraged me to write another post
 |
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Diana
Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 494 Location: Guam, USA
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Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2003 3:02 pm Post subject: Damned If We Do, and Damned If We Don't. |
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someone wrote: |
i beg your pardon Diana.. i really wonder how do u condemne all terrorists and in the same time , when we talk about the jwes terrorism you opt to leave them solve their problem ..u prefare to escape their terrible terrisom ....
when the jews killed the innecot people and made more than 3millions homeless u prefere to leave them alon but when 300 people killed u sympathize and feel sad ..
and after all that u say
I condemned the actions of the terrorists. I don't care if they are muslims, Jews, or Christians terrorists.
really u wonder me ...
anyway Diana, it still your opinion and I respect it .
THANX VERY MUCH DIANA
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
dduck
thanx so much ….your post encouraged me to write another post
 |
You see, this is what I mean when I say that America is damned if we do and damned if we don't help. The United States got extremely involved in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict during Clinton's presidency, and we get accused for interfering.
Now, Someone thinks we should get involved. Well, George Bush decided to leave Israel and the Palestinians alone to see if they could solve their own problems. This was Bush's "hands-off" policy (which was the opposite of Clinton). And now Someone thinks that I'm being indifferent or don't care about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.
You see, this is exactly what I mean when I say that America is damned if we do help and damned if we don't help. We tried to help in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict during Clinton's presidency and they hate us and accused us for interfering. When we don't get involved in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict during Bush's administration, they still hate us and accuse us for being indifferent and uncaring!
Thanks for proving my point, Someone.
It also proves that you haven't been reading my posts carefully. If you had, you would have known that the United States (like many other countries) did try to help in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict during Clinton's Presidency. I opt that we leave Israel and the Palestinians to solve their own problems and let's see if that would help because obviously, the efforts of the U.S. Great Britain, Norway, the Arab League, Egypt, Jordon, and even the UN failed. So, let's give Israel and the Palestinians a chance and see if they can actually solve it on their own.
Someone why is it that people like you always look to the United States for help? What's wrong? You don't have the brains to solve your own problem? |
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someone
Joined: 26 Jan 2003 Posts: 19 Location: 01
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Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2003 7:24 pm Post subject: |
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u r welcome Diana ,,
But unfortunately u did not answer me yet ,,
u just after 11SEP realized the terrorism ,, u did not know that there is aterriable one in palstain which started before many years ,, more than 50 years ago ....
and u still so sympathize with the people who died in 11SEP and u didnot mention to the awesome terrorsim by jwes .. the and the victims became more than 3millions of innecot people ,,and moer and more of homeless children ,, just read about the impact of the jwes terrorsim that happen in palastian and u will know the ruslt of the helpe that u r still talking about it >>>>
by the way , will u explain more about the helpe ,,,
which kind of helpe was it and how could it allow only one side to be armed .. ,,and what about itz achievment during 50 years
THESE QUESTIONS NEED BIG QUESTION MARK  |
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