Dave's ESL Cafe's Student Discussion Forums

[Hala]

After the tragic disaster for the shuttle, so many American can see that, American technolgy's limits in the face of great unfressen forces.
Today American ask themselves that, what kind of people are we? What kind of heart we have? We cry for the seven brave adventures lost in accident, and we are plotting to exterminatse thousandsof men, women, and children For what?? We want Saddam head, or Iraq oil??And how much American and England have confidence in their technology to send it to burn the sons and daughters of Baghdad??
" Truly. inthis, is a message of remembrance to men of understanding."

[Diana]

[pugachevV]

Whenever you are exploring new frontiers you face danger. The seven astronauts knew and accepted the risk.
It has nothing to do with Baghdad or the Middle East except there was an Israeli on board. He was no less brave than anyone else.
Apparently there was great joy in Baghdad at this tragedy and through much of the Arab world.
So be it. It is their right to rejoice if they wish.
It tells you a lot about the Arabs and their "great religion", though.

[wing]

[Hala]

Yes Diana, there is difference if Iraq children killed by Saddam, or US.If America invade Iraq the enemies of the USA will increase and probability of futur act of terrorism against the USA and it allies.
And many US soliders would be killed , and this war would violate the teaching of Jesus.Beside, the majority of the public in America, Britain, France, Germany, Spain, Russia against this war , and no reason for this war.
Pugachev V
I am Arabic and Moslem and I feel sorry for those astronauts.

[Diana]

[dduck]

[dduck]

[Diana]

[dduck]

[Diana]

What makes you think that the United States can't be destroyed? What makes you think that Americans are invincible? Recently, Al-Queda terrorists were captured in London and Spain with the chemical weapon resin. In Afghanistan, American soldiers have uncovered Al-Queda plans to make a nuclear weapon. You don't think that a chemical, biological or even a nuclear attack by Al-Queda on the United States will not devastate them? Why do you think Al-Queda is looking at chemical and other deadly weapons?

The 911 attacks happened because there are people out there with enough hate to not only kill themselves but also fellow muslims in the process. If you listen carefully to Bin Laden's speech, he says that America (the infidels) should die and he calls on every muslim to kill Americans where ever they are. Of course, Al-Queda wants Americans to leave Saudi Arabia because (as Bin Laden pointed out), the infidels is corrupting the sacred city of Mohammed. As for the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, Bin Laden really doesn't care about that. He only mentions that conflict later as the U.S. and Great Britain started dropping bombs in Afghanistan. Before that, no mention of Israeli-Palestinian conflict was ever said. It's all about his civil war with Saudi Arabia.

As for the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, many people have tried to resolve this conflict, Iain. Even now, Egypt is trying to help. Of all countries in the Middle East, Egypt and Jordan have established peace with Israel, and Egypt is currently trying to get these two to establish peace. I agree with you that looking back at the past and blaming him or her for this or that doesn't help anyone. But as I said before, the Oslo Accords was a positive step toward peace for Israel and the Palestinians. It is a workable solution. However, you need leaders who are willing to negiotate effectively. You should know as well as I do that in every compromise both sides must give up something for the sake of peace. In every compromise, one side cannot have 100% of what they want. So, in view of this, what do you suggest Iain? Give Arafat 100% of what he wants?

There is one cure for hate and that is love.

I wish the world was that simple, Iain, but the truth is - it is not. How do you get the Ku Klux Klan and other White Supremists to stop hating African Americans? How do get the terrorists to see that Americans are actually like everyone else in the world who only want to raise their children and give them a good education and a good life. A child born and raised to hate will grow to hate. Do you really think you can get Bin Laden to love Americans? This is a person who would rather die than to be touched by an American.

[dduck]

[Diana]

Iain, everything you say is idealistic. It would be nice to live in an idealistic world where children are taught tolerance and that one should learn to listen and compromise.

However, in the real world that we are living in, children are being taught to hate Blacks, Americans, infidels, etc. Not every child will encounter that warmth and love you speak of especially when surrounded by parents and people who are filled with prejudice. Just look at how difficult it is to convince a White Supremist that Blacks are human beings. In the real world, there are people who are greedy, prejudice, etc. In the real world, there are criminals and even sick people who enjoy molesting little children. And yes, there are people who simply cannot compromise. And there are people who will not listen. That's the real world, and that's why we have problems.

I am not trying to provoke disagreements. I am simply stating my own opinions on how I see things. And I usually back my opinions with reason and some facts. You ask me if I can imagine if Al-Queda has the resources of the former Soviets. At this point in time, I don't think that Al-Queda has nuclear weapons. They can easily get a hold of chemical weapons as already shown in the arrests of those Al-Queda terrorists in London and Spain. We also know from what was found in the caves of Afghanistan that they had plans of trying to obtain nuclear weapons. I also know that Al-Queda is a group of people unlike any we've encountered in the history of mankind. We are talking about a group of people who have so much hate in them that they are willing to destroy themselves and anyone around them. We are talking about a group of people who have absolutely no morals and values that they actually thought of plans to obtain nuclear weapons to kill millions. We are talking a group of people who are religious fanatics who actually thinks that the only person they have to please is God. This is the real world.

[Hala]

If a child is taught that bad people should be hated, they are likely to continue hating when faced with hate, but not so likely to hate when faced with warmth and kindness. Wouldn't you agree?

Iain
I do, I agree with you
Hala

[Diana]