Dave's ESL Cafe's Student Discussion Forums

[Piyo Liu]

Dear teachers:

I'd like to know if it's proper to say these two terms: meat diet, which means the person eats meat in his/her diet, and vegetarian diet. When we use the terms, should we say, "She eats a vegetarian diet" or "She eats vegerarian diet"? Would you kindly provide some examples using these two terms?
Besides, I heard from some friends that in some European countries, people will have seafood in a "vegetarian diet" because they don't consider "seafood" as "meat". Is it true? Thanks for your help.

Best wishes,
Piyo Liu

[Anuradha Chepur]

'meat diet' sounds crude. 'non-vegetarian diet' is better.

Also preferably, "She has a vegetarian diet."

Yes, seafood is NOT considered non-vegetarian in some cultures.

[hitori2k6]

Piyo Liu,

However, I'd like to add something to this...

Just because a person DOES include meat in their diet, it is incorrect
to say "non-vegetarian".

Saying "non-vegetarian" actually excludes vegetables and means
you don't eat vegetables.

Also, it isn't true of just Europeans. Many Americans who are
"vegetarians" will eat fish.

In most cases (except "vegans") meat really refers to beef,
chicken and pork.

But if you want to just rely on idiomatic speaking, you'd either
say you're a vegetarian or you wouldn't say anything.
That is the safest way way to proceed.

In all my years of speaking English (I'm a native English speaker),
I've NEVER heard anyone refer to themselves as a "meat eater"
or a non-vegetarian. These would be considered peculiar terms
among most native English speakers.

[Piyo Liu]

Thanks to both teachers' replies. Your explanations help clarify a lot of my doubts. Apparently, the expression of "I'm a vegetarian" means different things to people from different cultures.

Please tell me how I can make the following sentence sound more natural, not peculiar, to a native speaker of English:
"Many vegetarians believe that a vegerarian diet is healthier than a diet of meat."

Thanks a lot for your kind help.

Piyo

[hitori2k6]

Piyo,

Hi again. I think the best way to phrase your statement would be
"Most vegetarians believe that a vegetarian diet is healthier".

You don't need to include "~~than a diet of meat" because you're
already indicating that the statement is expressing vegetarians'
and what they believe. So it would be understood.

And because this sentence says "healthier" it suggests a
comparison against some other type of diet (meat). So again,
the setence would be understood.

I hope this helps. Take care.

[Piyo Liu]

Dear Teacher:

Thanks again for your prompt reply. It helped a lot!! Until next time!

Best wishes,
Piyo

[Anuradha Chepur]

In the West, including meat in one's diet is a default phenomenon and you do not need a specific word to describe 'meat-eaters'. On the other hand sticking to vegan food and excluding meat in one's diet is uncommon, and needs a specific word.

In this electronic age, English is not just the prerogative of native speakers. Though not in the native variety, but in other varieties of English, and in ESL contexts we do find the word 'non-vegan'. In India, where English is the language of business, administration, law, education, etc, it is indispensable to have a specific word for meat-eaters, because there are many who eat meat, and also many who do not eat meat. In restaurants, we have separate sections for vegetarians and non-vegetarians. The terms are indispensable on menu-cards and other food-contexts.

But with the advent of vegan-philosophies, and propagation of vegetarianism the world over, including USA, the words 'non-vegan' or 'non-vegetarian' are slowly catching up. To quote one example, Erin Pavlina, who lives in Los Angeles uses these terms in her book titled, 'Raising vegan children in a non-vegan world: a complete guide for parents'. The world should also find it listing in dictionaries in a matter of time.[/url]

[hitori2k6]

But anytime you say "non-~~~" it means "not" or "excluding", "absent of"

i.e. nonsense, non-sequitor, non-verbal, non-compliant, non-abrasive,
non-entity, non-vegan, non-vegetarian, etc, etc.

Quoted from Merriam-Webster's dictionary:

Etymology: Middle English, from Middle French, from Latin non not, from Old Latin noenum, from ne- not + oinom
1 : not : other than : reverse of : absence of
2 : of little or no consequence : unimportant : worthless <nonissues> <nonsystem>