Dave's ESL Cafe's Student Discussion Forums

[klafterreith]

I am usef to getting up early.
I am used to rising up early. Is `rising up�completely wrong or
acceptable ?



There is no point in having 10 mobiles. Is `It is no point...�completely
It is no point in having ten mobiles. wrong or acceptable?


Please tell me.

[zorro (4)]

Getting up early is correct.

*Rising up is completely wrong unfortunately

You should say;

There is no point in having ten mobiles.

You seem to be confused in knowing when to use 'it' or 'there'.

Imagine a blind man in a room. He is not touching anything. He wants to know generally what is in the room. His friend is describing the room to him and says;
A book is on the table.
This doesn't sound correct in English (although the grammar is correct) and we would normally say;
There is a book on the table.
Now, the blind man is walking around and feeling things with his hands. He feels the book, but he doesn't know what it is, so he asks;
What's this?
His friend answers, more specifically;
It's a book.

So, if we put this idea onto your sentences, we can see that the use of 'there' (it's called existential there if you're interested) is for more general ideas.

And the use of it (this would be a dummy subject if you're interested) is for more specific ideas.

This is my take on the difference between using there and it, but I would love to hear any other teachers' ideas regarding this. Or students.

I hope this helps.

[dragn]

Zorro is right about I am used to rising up early, but it may be worth noting that if you remove the preposition up and just say I am used to rising early, you've got a sentence that is at least marginally acceptable. For example, we do say that someone is an early riser. That is, they like to get up early.

As for the difference between using it and there, that's a big, wet slippery one. Here are a few thoughts that I hope are helpful.

The dummy subject it (some books call it the empty subject) is typically used in sentences that say something about...

...weather: It's sunny and warm today.

...temperature: It's ten degrees below zero.

...distance: It's twenty miles to the Mexican border.

...time: It's three o'clock.

...current/background conditions: It's awful! I think I've lost my passport!

The dummy subject it is also used in sentences that have a THAT-clause as the true subject (other types of clauses are possible, but I think you'll get the idea). If a sentence has a THAT-clause as the subject, the result can sound quite awkward.

Ex. That he lost all his money playing blackjack is unfortunate.

Ouch. Starting the sentence with the dummy subject it allows us to move the THAT-clause to the end of the sentence where it can receive the attention it usually deserves:

Ex. It's unfortunate that he lost all his money playing blackjack.

Which reminds me...one way to fix the sentence It is no point in having ten mobiles and still use the dummy subject it would be to instead use the adjective pointless:

Ex. It's pointless to have ten mobiles.

When you say There is no point in having ten mobiles, Zorro is right again: this is the existential there. It's used to express the basic notion that something exists somewhere.

In the (correct) sentence There is no point in having ten mobiles, you're just saying that no useful purpose exists that would justify having ten mobiles.

I hope this is helpful in some way.

dragn