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Jerry Chen
Joined: 26 Jan 2006
Posts: 115
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 Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2011 5:27 am Post subject: Need help from native speakers of English |
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Hello,
Please help me with the sentence:
Even though he (1) had fallen down (2) fell down in the middle of the race, he still reached the finish line first.
I think both are acceptable. What's your opinion?
Thanks for responding to my question! |
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Lorikeet
Joined: 08 Oct 2005
Posts: 1877
Location: San Francisco
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| Posted: Thu Oct 13, 2011 1:12 pm Post subject: Re: Need help from native speakers of English |
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| Jerry Chen wrote: |
Hello,
Please help me with the sentence:
Even though he (1) had fallen down (2) fell down in the middle of the race, he still reached the finish line first.
I think both are acceptable. What's your opinion?
Thanks for responding to my question! |
I think you will hear both of those sentences. I personally prefer the first (had fallen down) because it emphasizes the fact that the falling down occurred before still reaching the finish line. However, it is becoming more and more common in American English to neglect the past perfect tense. If I were taking a test, however, I would choose the first. |
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2006
Joined: 27 Nov 2006
Posts: 610
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| Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 12:33 pm Post subject: Re: Need help from native speakers of English |
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| Lorikeet wrote: |
| Jerry Chen wrote: |
Hello,
Please help me with the sentence:
Even though he (1) had fallen down (2) fell down in the middle of the race, he still reached the finish line first.
I think both are acceptable. What's your opinion?
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If I were taking a test, however, I would choose the first. |
If it is on a test, it would be a bad test question.
But I know that bad test questions are not rare on ESL tests.
At least one reason simple past is becoming more common is that no matter which tense one chooses, it is clear that the fall happened before the finish.
So past perfect is clearly not the only correct choice. In fact, one could make the argument that using unnecessarily complicated tenses is a flaw not a virtue.
But both tenses are correct.
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contra10
Joined: 11 Oct 2011
Posts: 13
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| Posted: Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:15 am Post subject: Re: Need help from native speakers of English |
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| Jerry Chen wrote: |
Hello,
Please help me with the sentence:
Even though he (1) had fallen down (2) fell down in the middle of the race, he still reached the finish line first.
I think both are acceptable. What's your opinion?
Thanks for responding to my question! |
I prefer to using the second one, although both can still work.
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Personal Developement for Students Around the World http://www.studenthubble.com/ |
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lotus
Joined: 25 Jan 2004
Posts: 862
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| Posted: Mon Oct 17, 2011 5:49 pm Post subject: |
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Good discussion.
"Even though..." is subjunctive; therefore you can use either past perfect or simple past or even present.
Even though it was my birthday, I still worked.
Even though it had been my birthday, I still worked.
Even though it is my birthday, I still worked.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subjunctive
--lotus
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War does not make one great --Yoda |
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Lorikeet
Joined: 08 Oct 2005
Posts: 1877
Location: San Francisco
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| Posted: Mon Oct 17, 2011 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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| lotus wrote: |
Good discussion.
"Even though..." is subjunctive; therefore you can use either past perfect or simple past or even present.
Even though it was my birthday, I still worked.
Even though it had been my birthday, I still worked.
Even though it is my birthday, I still worked.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subjunctive
--lotus |
However, I think the last sentence, "Even though it is my birthday, I still worked." would only be appropriate if you worked during the day and were speaking at night, when it was still your birthday. If it was a day the previous week, for example, I don't think it would be correct. |
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lotus
Joined: 25 Jan 2004
Posts: 862
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| Posted: Mon Oct 17, 2011 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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Exactly -- that would be the condition in which you can use that subjunctive sentence. Based on the supposition that today is in fact his birthday, he still took the time to go to work.
It does not work with the original sentence, because as 2006 pointed out, the fall happens before the finish. Therefore, he can't possibly say that he finished the race based on the supposition that he presently falls.
--lotus
_________________
War does not make one great --Yoda |
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