Teacher Discussion Forums

All the four below convey the same idea: You need to meet the qualification of "your score=550 or your score>550."

Apart from preferences, do you think that they are all interchangeable, or each one is just the other's variant?

(1) You must achieve a score of 550 or [more/greater] on the TOEFL.
(2) You must achieve a score of 550 or [above/higher/better] on the TOEFL.
(3) You must achieve a score of at least 550 on the TOEFL.
(4) You must achieve a score of [no/not] less than 550 on the TOEFL.

Thank you in advance
Seiichi MYOGA

I'd appreciate it if you could also give your opinion on this.

If native speakers of English utter (5), do you think he/she means 550 is included?

(5) Students must attain a score of more than 550 on the TOEFL.

At least, it seems that they usually interpret "more than a week" in (6) as meaning 7 days or longer.

(6) If you are absent for more than a week, you must produce a doctor's certificate.

Since the Japanese language lacks the simple expression denoting the idea of "more than" (but has the phrase for "less than"),
on an everyday basis, they usually resort as a substitute to something that stands for the idea of "... or [more/above]." And they learn (or are warned) that unlike the Japanese "substitute," the English "more than X" never includes X itself.

I wonder if English-speaking people do not use "more than X" in a lax way that allows X to be inclusive.

There are some subtle differences, but as far as the basic information goes, 1-4 seem to say the same thing. 549 is not acceptable. 550 is. More than 550 is possible.

"More than 550" does not include 550. But there is a sort of strangeness to this. 550 shouldn't really be printed if it isn't acceptable. People wouldn't expect the acceptable range to start on an odd number like 551. So the requirements would generally be written in a different way, to match to people's expectation that round figures be used.

Sometimes this does happen when there is a range of effects: 100-150 first group, 151-200 second group, 201-250 third group. Or maybe more likely 100-149, 150-199, 200-249, etc. Last one in the list would go back to a round number I suppose. I'd say people are likely to overlook the fine distinction and have to be reminded of it.

I would say "more than a week" means MORE than a week. In some cases I might feel the need to clarify with my boss, just to make sure, but I would usually think that this means I can be sick all week, but if I don't come in on the next Monday I have to have something from the doctor. Especially with a work week. Being sick seven work days exactly doesn't really make for a natural time frame. One work week makes the most sense to me. So you actually only get 5 days for free. Of course, in the case of vacation days and sick leave, etc. the count would be in exact days to take away the ambiguity. And there would be rules to cover how many hours counts as a day for the case of half days or something.

Dear Zaneth,

I appreciate your help and comments.

Let's change "a" week to "one" week. And what is your judgment?

(6) ...and how many and what proportion of those were (a) absent on self-certification or without authorisation, (b) on sick leave of less than a week, (c) on sick leave of more than one week and less than one month, (d) on sick leave of more than one month and (e) on leave as a result of injuries sustained while on duty
http://www.parliament.the-stationery-of ... 416w11.htm

The chart attached says that (b) refers to 1-6 days, (c) refers to 7 to 27 days (Note that it is February 2002, so we have 28 days in it.)

In other words, "more than one week" and "more than one month" include 7 days and 28 days respectively.

This website is the UK Parliament. So I'm beginning to wonder if the usage is specific to British English.

Seiichi MYOGA

Well, for sick leave, as I said, they probably figure in exact days, as they are paying. And in your example it is clarified. I think there is some ambiguity possible, and as I said, each organization would have it defined, written down somewhere so you could ask your boss or look it up. I was thinking mostly in terms of how long you could just disappear from work for no documented reason. Of course, if they're paying they'll be more picky.

Saying "one" week maybe gives it a more precise feeling, but I don't think it would resolve your original question, or change anything. I tend to think of 'one' and 'a' as being the same thing.