Neither of them is weak. vs Neither of them are weak.

Ilunga · Post by **Ilunga** » Tue Nov 16, 2004 7:33 am

I know which of these two are grammatically correct (is), but I regularly use the second option (are). Would you regard this as acceptable usage? It seems much more natural to me.

Andrew Patterson · Post by **Andrew Patterson** » Tue Nov 16, 2004 8:56 am

They are both grammatically correct. You can either regard "them" as two individuals focusing on "neither", or you can regard "them" as a group, focusing on "them".

Ilunga · Post by **Ilunga** » Tue Nov 16, 2004 10:57 am

Thank you Andrew, I was teaching neither recently and came across this point, I told my students that both were acceptable but then couldn't back this up with an example from any of my grammar books, so withdrew my claim until I couild give them some evidence...was a little worried I had been wrong all these years.

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Tue Nov 16, 2004 4:03 pm

Ilunga wrote:Thank you Andrew, I was teaching neither recently and came across this point, I told my students that both were acceptable but then couldn't back this up with an example from any of my grammar books, so withdrew my claim until I couild give them some evidence...was a little worried I had been wrong all these years.

Take a look at articles dealing with notional concord.

For now:

1.3 What is meant by notional concord (as opposed to grammatical concord)?

concord determined by the sg/pl idea of the noun,
not by whether it is sg or pl grammatically

What type of nouns typically occur with notional concord? Give an example.

group nouns: My group / family / team are doing fine

(other cases, OK) A lot / large number (of people) were arrested

Bed and breakfast costs £40

Good luck!

Andrew Patterson · Post by **Andrew Patterson** » Tue Nov 16, 2004 7:50 pm

Bottom line Metal, would you say that notional concord is more important than grammatical concord. I'm used to discussing this with regard to teams and committees, etc, but "Bed and Breakfast" costs..." jumped out at me there, but you are right - since it is indeed viewed as a single entity, "costs" is more common than "cost". I wouldn't say "cost" is wrong there, though, just less common.

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Tue Nov 16, 2004 10:09 pm

Andrew Patterson wrote:Bottom line Metal, would you say that notional concord is more important than grammatical concord. I'm used to discussing this with regard to teams and committees, etc, but "Bed and Breakfast" costs..." jumped out at me there, but you are right - since it is indeed viewed as a single entity, "costs" is more common than "cost". I wouldn't say "cost" is wrong there, though, just less common.

If "cost" was needed, bed would have a separate price to breakfast.

I wouldn't say that notional concord is more important than grammatical concord, or v.v. .