Teacher Discussion Forums

Hi all,

A friend suggested that I should consult this website.

I am a bit confused where to put "at present".

For example: is it

a. The firm at present is among the best...?

or

b. The firm is at present among the best...?


I know that this phrase is commonly put at the beginning of a sentence, but can also be put in the middle.

I remember that adverb of frequency is usually put after the auxiliary (be)...(please correct me if I am wrong). But...everybody I asked always prefer the option a....

So..I'm confused. Would be glad if anyone can help me...

Thanks for reading.

vero

Vero,

As a native English speaker, both are statements sound correct. But I wonder if grammatically they are correct? This I cannot help you with! Also do the sentences have slightly differently meanings/connotations?

Guys we need more help here! I think I raised more questions than were answered!

~ Jennifer

The position of an advertial is troublesome matter to ESL students.


An adverbial is a modifier.
The modifee of an adverbial might be a verb phrase, adjective, or another adverbial

So basiclly adverbials can go anywhere the speaker want to modify.

The speaker can put an adverb any places where he or she want to focus.

Thanks for the your replies. Jen, Joon.

I am using Marcella Frank, Modern English which gives the description where to put the adverb. Yes, Joon it is quite a tricky exercise for the EFL students to put adverb.

Would appreciate more comments from you all.

vero

Thanks for the your replies. Jennifer, Joon.

I am using Marcella Frank, Modern English which gives the description where to put the adverb. Yes, Joon it is quite a tricky exercise for the EFL students to put adverb.

Would appreciate more comments from you all.

vero

I do think b) is MORE correct:
"The firm is at present one of the best..."

a) can often be heard though. I would say it is an ungrammatical usage that's becoming standard. Shall we call it a "colloquialism"?
In present perfect structures, the two verbs usually bracket any adverbial.

I think Joon has a point. Phrases like this can be pretty mobile. You could probably say that placing the adverbial between the auxiliary and the verb is the "unmarked" form, giving a simple statement of time; but if you put the "at present" before the auxiliary it becomes a little more emphatic, and could, perhaps, suggest that the firm's condition will not necessarily continue this way.
Placing "at present" at the head of the sentence may have a similar effect; or it may be used to contrast the present situation with a past situation that you have just been discussing..

When speaking it, of course, you would make the intention clearer with pausing and intonation. I don't think you could rule out any of these usages as 'un-English', that is, 'ungrammatical'.

Cheers
Norm.

Agree with you Norm,

And with this discussion, it seems to me you've all shown that English is a far more "fluid" language than is often assumed both by students and teachers. (Or should it be: by both students and teachers.)Vero's original post shows that he expected there to be one 'correct' placement of the adverbial, all others being ungrammatical. It's true that adverbial placement is among the most fluid of grammatical features, but there are other examples of features where what is grammatical is up for legitimate debate. Roger here pointed out that, since English is an organic, living language, certain aspects of it are in flux--in the process of changing from one standard to another.

Point is, we are reminded once again that a certain flexibility to our approach may be appropriate, and may often be appreciated. Let's also remember that if we put 10 knowledgeable and experienced English teachers in a room and tossed in a grammatical question, the likely result would be 10 at least somewhat different answers (and maybe a huge explosion).

Cheers to everyone. Vero, hope you got some help from all of these responses.

Larry Latham