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"a nonsense"
Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 9:45 am
by metal56
Hi
Do you use the expression "It's a nonsense!", or similar?
Is "nonsense" only uncountable in your variant of English?
Is "nonsense" a noun or an adjective in the above?
How do you see it?
Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 10:01 am
by lolwhites
I see nothing unusual about a nonsense, especially in the expression make a nonsense of sth. I wouldn't expect to hear *two/three nonsenses so I wouldn't go as far as to say it can be countable in my English.
Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 11:41 am
by Lorikeet
That's nonsense!
I don't think I can use "a" with it.
Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 1:12 pm
by lolwhites
*That's a nonsense would be out in my English. However, the phrase
make a nonsense of is pretty common. Do the following seem odd to you?
"Pain, sickness, cruelty, above all death itself, seem to make a nonsense of life."
http://homepages.which.net/~radical.fai ... ateway.htm
"It would make a nonsense of the law to compensate a career criminal like Fearon and would set a terrible precedent"
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/talking_point/2988830.stm
"Both Sarah and I are determined not to make a nonsense of it again" - Prince Andrew on his relationship with Sarah Ferguson.
Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 8:56 am
by Lorikeet
Those sound okay, although I think I'd never use them.
With lorikeet
Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 11:16 am
by revel
Hey!
I'm with Lorikeet, though I understand the "a nonsense" usage in the examples offered. I'd still say, myself, "That's nonsense" or maybe simply a bludgening "Nonsense!"
Just yesterday saw P Ustinov in "Evil under the sun" and off the top of my head I recall different characters using these other "nonsense" words: "balderdash", "poppycock" and "twaddle". I'd consider these three as non-count nouns, while nonsense seems more an adjective to me, though in lol's examples it is clearly being used as a noun.
peace,
revel.
Re: With lorikeet
Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:09 pm
by Lorikeet
revel wrote:Hey!
I'm with Lorikeet, though I understand the "a nonsense" usage in the examples offered. I'd still say, myself, "That's nonsense" or maybe simply a bludgening "Nonsense!"
Just yesterday saw P Ustinov in "Evil under the sun" and off the top of my head I recall different characters using these other "nonsense" words: "balderdash", "poppycock" and "twaddle". I'd consider these three as non-count nouns, while nonsense seems more an adjective to me, though in lol's examples it is clearly being used as a noun.
peace,
revel.
What makes you feel that "balderdash," "poppycock" and "twaddle" are non-count nouns, while "nonsense" seems more like an adjective?
Not very strong examples....
Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 6:40 am
by revel
Hey!
Well, the following are not very strong examples as I don't think anyone would try such use, but here is my reason.
That's nonsense. Those are nonsense words. (That's big. That's a big house.)
That's poppycock. That's a poppycock idea. (That's a table. That's a table lamp.)
I guess those examples are really very weak after all. Perhaps it is because I can imagine using "nonsense" in the "before the noun" position as an adjective, while the other three don't sound at all right in that position but seem to be nomers for the words or ideas that are being classified as "balderdash". On the other hand, maybe those words don't represent a mass, but again, a quality, like "stupid" or "silly" but those are really adjectives, though the cute victorian child might say to the boy she likes "Don't be a silly (boy, that is)".
Mr D¡ck says nonsense is a noun. Nonsensical is an adjective. Twaddle, balderdash are offered as synonyms, twaddle being both noun and verb, while balderdash is a noun (with the obsolete meaning of a muddled mixture of liquors). I wonder what Steven Jones would say, he's much better at these grammatical things than I am.
peace,
revel.
Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 6:56 pm
by metal56
lolwhites wrote:*That's a nonsense would be out in my English. However, the phrase make a nonsense of is pretty common. Do the following seem odd to you?
...
No, those don't seem odd at all.
Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 9:54 pm
by Tara B
I have to concur with the Americans. I have only ever heard "nonsense" used as a noncount noun or an adjective.
"A nonsense" hurts my ears
. . . but I learn something new every time I visit this forum.
Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 7:15 am
by metal56
Tara B wrote:I have to concur with the Americans. I have only ever heard "nonsense" used as a noncount noun or an adjective.
"A nonsense" hurts my ears
. . . but I learn something new every time I visit this forum.
Learning about one's own language is a good thing and accepting other variants shows an educated mind.