Rosy future in Asia?

[woodcutter]

Did anyone else read this in the Guardian? Does this refect reality? Should people be coming to Asia looking for "career pathways" and "sound academic management" in their interviews? It seems to me that most Asian countries seem to still have the attitude of kicking out the oldies because they aren't so popular. Are there more great jobs out there these days? Flights, accommodation and bonuses have long been promised, but that doesn't always equal a good job.


Is Vietnam the new Spain?

Nearly half of new Tefl trainees hope to teach in Asia, a new survey finds. Jenny Johnson, head of Tefl at Cactus Worldwide, looks at what's on offer

Wednesday July 25, 2007
EducationGuardian.co.uk

It might finally be the case that fledgling Teflers are veering off the beaten track to Spain for a taste of English teaching further afield. Further east, to be precise.
In a survey by Cactus Tefl, about 45% of respondents about to embark on a Tefl course cited countries in Asia as being their main region of interest.

Schools in Asia that have previously found it difficult to meet the demand for English with a steady supply of native-speaking, qualified teachers have been offering enticements for new teachers. Many now match the Jet scheme "standard" of providing flights, accommodation, and bonuses.

And the move seems to be paying off.

Private English teaching establishments in China, Vietnam and Thailand are expanding rapidly.

ILA Vietnam is currently on the lookout for some 150 qualified teachers of English. The company's director, Tony Williams, estimates this figure will double within the year.

Williams says that new teachers now look beyond pay and conditions when making a decision about where to apply. "Newly-qualified teachers are armed with all the right questions these days," he says. "Career pathways and evidence of solid academic management is as important as a decent rate of pay and working hours."

In Thailand, another large school group, ECC, offers reimbursement of 50% of a teacher's Celta course fees in return for a year's teaching in one of their schools.

Other schools also offer to pay for the return flight home provided the teacher stays on for predetermined contract duration - typically one year.

The need to tie teachers in may raise an eyebrow amongst the more sceptical teachers and lead them to ask, "Why wouldn't I want to stay a year anyway?" It may be that the requirement has something to do with contract conditions, course durations, and the regime in a school. But also, the wide cultural and climatic variance from life back home could lead would-be Teflers to consider Tefl in Asia as no more than a six-month job option.

The safest option when making a decision is to opt for a school that conducts its interviews in the United Kingdom, with a day's proper orientation that includes presentations, interviews, a chance to chat to existing teachers, and plenty of opportunities to ask questions, without fear that this could scupper your chances of employment.

[fluffyhamster]

Many jobs in Asia have to offer at least the return airfare, otherwise no teacher would be able to ever leave/escape; as for offering high(er) academic standards, yes, ideally the school should be meeting the teacher at least halfway. The real question however is, assuming that the school and teacher see eye to eye over method and materials, is the teacher then actually capable of doing at least their half? Quite often yes, but will the employer credit it?

[woodcutter]

If I was director of ILA Vietnam, a school which obviously does not require experienced teachers, and is unlikely to pay much money, I would look first and foremost for people likely to complete their contract. Over high expectations are one of the main reasons that people break down/run away/move jobs etc. If you are really running a great school, O.K. I think though, that some people just have to pretend that they are running or working for Harvard simply for their own self-esteem. It is frustrating to deal with such people.

[blackmagicABC]

I run a school in Taiwan and I can gaurantee you that the most annoying thing for me is the absolute lack of teacher commitment. There are teachers here who consider themselves experts because they have been doing the wrong thing for years and now they consider themselves experts. At what?

[woodcutter]

I agree that some people spend a long time in ESL/EFL without progressing too much, and teaching in ways that seem odd to the rest of us. On the other hand, people who rise to the position of DOS do not necessarily have all the answers about teaching either, though many behave as if they do. People who stick around for years have at least shown commitment by doing that. In order to favour enthusiastic career minded go-getters with new CELTA certificates over such possibly jaded people who ask suspicious questions regarding work/conditions then you would need to offer reasonable conditions, a school following western philosophy and a good nose for who can stick at it long enough to enjoy a glorious "career".

No one should play the expert, not the boss, not the teacher. This job isn't usually much about being an expert, though it helps. The boss should explain the particular ethos/situation of the school and expect the teacher to bear that in mind. Anyway, I wish bosses would do so, but they generally just assume that anyone sane and competent would approach teaching just exactly as they would themselves in any case. Not many people, teachers or bosses, seem to notice that a particular context is very important.

(I don't really understand your point Blackmagic, because self-annointed experts are at least usually reasonably committed).

[blackmagicABC]

I don't disagree with what you said Woodcutter. Actually I agree completely. People who stay in a job for a few years are bound to become very good at it. The problem is that in Taiwan (I am not sure about other countries) there are many teachers who purely teach because they are from a "native speaking country". They correct according to what they know which means you may get a guy who tells students it is OK to write "would of" instead of "would have or would 've, because that is how it is done in America. 3 years teaching experience.
Many of them would stay in a job for a few months and then move on to the next either because they got fired or because they couldn't deliver. My point was if you are a qualified TESOL or CELTA teacher, come here. It is rosy. You get paid well enough and there are many schools, like mine who would love to have you. The future is indeed rosy here in Asia.
I am much happier here than I was back home. My wife is a local and if you can adjust to the living conditions here and you are as good as you claim to be, you will have a great time. If you are not that good then be honest, Ihave a teacher that has never taught that I am teaching from scratch. They have jsut started a TESOL as well and that is what I am looking for. Commitment to work and learn. I spend 1 hour a day studying or looking for better methods which is why I decided to join this forum. So far it has been well worth it.

[woodcutter]

Well, we nearly all have a few holes in our knowledge, 3 years experience or otherwise.

I hope the future in Asia is rosy. Anyone else read www.atimes.com though? It's a great online journal and a good way to stay informed about Asian affairs, but there are a large number of doomsayers these days. (generally predicting global troubles rather than Asian ones, I must admit)

[fluffyhamster]

Anyone who's been teaching for three years (especially following a CELTA or TEFL certificate of some kind) really should know enough about the structure of verb phrases to realize that 'would of' is wrong. It might of course be relevant to at some point mention that such and such a percentage of native speakers make this ERROR in informal writing, but it should never be held out as being acceptable. There is nothing prescriptivist about this, and even if the majority of people started using the form, it would not make it any more correct/less incorrect.

[blackmagicABC]

Anyone who's been teaching for three years (especially following a CELTA or TEFL certificate of some kind) really should know enough about the structure of verb phrases to realize that 'would of' is wrong. It might of course be relevant to at some point mention that such and such a percentage of native speakers make this ERROR in informal writing, but it should never be held out as being acceptable. There is nothing prescriptivist about this, and even if the majority of people started using the form, it would not make it any more correct/less incorrect.

I agree, and it that lies my problem with many teachers who teach here purely because they are native speakers of the language. It doesn't matter if they failed or dropped out of high school. Yes, they can't get a working visa but then there are so many degrees availble online (I mean the type where you buy the certificate not the type where you actually do the work) that many people get away with it. It's a joke.

[woodcutter]

I'm not saying that people shouldn't know. I'm just saying that you'll see a few bloopers pretty much anywhere. Anyone who posts on Dave's should know that. "Would of" is a common mistake, but as I argued elsewhere, and as Fluffy argues here, the fact that it doesn't fit in with easily stated prescriptive rules and patterns makes it a particularly non-viable alternative. There is a limt though, if it becomes common enough, you will have to regard it as viable.
There are plenty of people making very bizarre mistakes out there, I don't know if you need to pick on a teacher for making a common one, and one that you could even argue about.

Anyway, 3 years? Pah. Woodcutter has nearly 9 years, 2 MAs (app.ling and chinese studies) TESOL, experience in China, and he speaks Chinese. However he can't fix up a job in Taiwan, because he has a Korean wife and son, one of his MAs was online, and, can you credit this, he can't/won't ride a stupid scooter.

[blackmagicABC]

Anyway, 3 years? Pah. Woodcutter has nearly 9 years, 2 MAs (app.ling and chinese studies) TESOL, experience in China, and he speaks Chinese. However he can't fix up a job in Taiwan, because he has a Korean wife and son, one of his MAs was online, and, can you credit this, he can't/won't ride a stupid scooter.

LOL. And then they tell us in the election campaigns that they have English education high up on the agenda and they are going to attract excellent foreign teachers with their policies.
I think I am going to smile about what you said for the whole day.

[woodcutter]

Speaking (to myself, maybe) of the www.atimes.com Mr.Chomsky sometimes features, and did the other day.

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/JB28Ak02.html

Whether it's language or politics, I somehow can never become a disciple. I don't basically disbelieve what he says here, though he is sometimes a bit over-zealous about his unusual sources. Of course most (western) people don't realize that the west does this kind of thing, and they should. But Chomsky always seems to operate within a paradigm in which if there was no U.S the world would be ruled like a happy rainbow from Oslo.