A chip in porridge

lolwhites · Post by **lolwhites** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 7:48 pm

According to the Guardian columnist Smallweed, the 19th century phrase "a chip in porridge" is taught in China as a typical English expression:

'Karl Sabbagh, a good friend of this column, asks if I have ever come across the expression "a chip in porridge" as used by Henry Mayhew in London Labour and the London Poor: "The pills meet with a ready sale, and they're like chip in porridge, neither good nor harm." It is being taught, he tells me, to generations of Chinese, Japanese and Koreans, since it has somehow got into their dictionaries of English usage. And it has clearly caught on. A website devoted to a Chinese singer called Anita, Sabbagh adds, says: "Be Mine (Disc 1, Track #1) belongs to the genre of acid of the new school and Anita's performance is very dashy and pretty. However, the part which is rapped in Cantonese by another apprentice of Anita's, Peng Jing Ci, is a chip in porridge." And a Chinese horoscope prediction from 2003, alleges: "This year will be a delightful year for the tigers. You can get more help and assistance from the superiors, especially when you are in trouble. So try to make friends with others as possible as you can, and don't quarrel with peoples on a chip in porridge. Though it is a lucky year for the tigers, you shall still keep eyes on your possessions, which may get lost, and your family as well." And according to the original Notes and Queries in 1850: "Sir Charles Napier, in his recent general order, informs the Bengal army that 'The reviews which the Commander-in-Chief makes of the troops are not to be taken as so many "chips in porridge."' "How did this phrase enter the language? I have no idea. Next time I meet one, I shall ask a Korean.'

http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story ... 54,00.html

Interestingly, the phrase is in the OED online, though the reference is 1880. A bit worrying that it's being taught as contemporary though.

Andrew Patterson · Post by **Andrew Patterson** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 9:23 pm

Just feel like playing Devil's advocate here, native speakers (it seems) can revive archaic language (as apparantly happened with "I reckon" for "it is my opinion that..."), but Second language speakers can't. Anyone for bringing back "thou" and "thee", or how about giving "gay" back it's original meaning. What do you think?

fluffyhamster · Post by **fluffyhamster** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 10:05 pm

'Gay' can still be given its original meaning...if you're that way inclined. Like Paul Johnson.

Andrew Patterson · Post by **Andrew Patterson** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 7:56 am

Forgive my ignorance, but who is Paul Johnson?

Stephen Jones · Post by **Stephen Jones** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:22 am

Indian English is full of these strange kind of uses. In the subcontinent criminals don't jump bail, rascals are absconding. I'm off to work now but when I get back I'll log on to some Sri Lankan Engish newspaoers to find some choice examples from todays editions.

A reputed Tamil academic once described the English of the Sinhala elite as being a combination parade ground obsecenities and the minor public school archaisms. The two traditions seamlessly fused one day when the son of a leading Colombo professional introduced his father to his tutor at university with the words "This pater bugger".

lolwhites · Post by **lolwhites** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:06 am

Nice anecdotes, Stephen

Surely, though, there's a distinction between the English of former colonies where, through various historical accidents like the one you describe, odd phrases enter the local dialect, and the textbook English being taught in far Eastern countries which were never part of the British Empire.

No doubt in a couple of years students from Japan or China will be telling me "My book/teacher said that a chip in porridge is an everyday expression..."

By the way, has anyone else googled chip in porridge? The first three pages to come up are Chinese.

fluffyhamster · Post by **fluffyhamster** » Thu Mar 31, 2005 6:02 pm

Andy, PJ is a historian (some might say a mediocre one at that). He wrote something in a newspaper or magazine once (probably the Daily Mail, or Mail on Sunday - my family sometimes buys it) about 'Give us back our words!', and 'gay' was the main word he chose to rant about.

revel · Post by **revel** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 12:08 pm

Hey all!

This reminds me of the Japanese Businessman (Insurance Salesman) who insisted on using "ain't" because in his dictionary it was listed as the correct contraction for "am not". At least he only used it in the first person singular present, religiously following the rules. (He did show me the entry, and though the part in Japanese was gobledygook, the word "ain´t" was clearly included!)

peace,
revel.

Andrew Patterson · Post by **Andrew Patterson** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 5:31 pm

Old song lyrics seem to be doing the rounds here at the moment so how about one by Gershwin (sung by Paul Robson), which, as Samuel L Jackson said, "Kinda fits the occasion."

It ain't necessarily so.

Maybe it made him sound more streetwise, (but I doubt it) I don't know.

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A chip in porridge

A chip in porridge

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