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The Four Hour Body
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12ax7



Joined: 07 Nov 2009

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

"The scientific consensus is that any weight loss reported by individuals on an "hCG diet" may be attributed entirely to the fact that such diets prescribe calorie intake of between 500 and 1,000 calories per day, substantially below recommended levels for an adult, to the point that this may risk health effects associated with malnutrition. For comparison, hCG diets typically recommend calorie intake approximately half that of the inmates at Auschwitz, where inmates engaged in heavy labor received 1,700 calories per day and those on light work 1,300."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_chorionic_gonadotropin#.22HCG_Diet.22[/u]
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Captain Corea



Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

W



T


F



That is seriously messed up.
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D.D.



Joined: 29 May 2008

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 6:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

12ax7 wrote:
"The scientific consensus is that any weight loss reported by individuals on an "hCG diet" may be attributed entirely to the fact that such diets prescribe calorie intake of between 500 and 1,000 calories per day, substantially below recommended levels for an adult, to the point that this may risk health effects associated with malnutrition. For comparison, hCG diets typically recommend calorie intake approximately half that of the inmates at Auschwitz, where inmates engaged in heavy labor received 1,700 calories per day and those on light work 1,300."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_chorionic_gonadotropin#.22HCG_Diet.22[/u]


I love when people use quotes that start with " the scientific....." which acts like there is some honest scientific community out there that does research to assist humans. There is no one science or point of view that is correct and just because wiki takes the conservative angle on almost every topic doesn't make it correct.

As I said before you can debate this until the cows come home and there will be one side saying that I tried it and it worked and the other side saying that there is no scientific evidence.

So captain Korea I would be interested in fiding out your side effects because you have real world experience with this rather than idiots that quote second hand knowledge.

Wake the frig up people the scientific community for the most part publishes info to support the selling of products and many of these products are not good for us.

Many people are becoming obese and it is not just because they are into instant gratification or lazy it's partly because the food supply has been tainted with products that the body can't properly digest and stores as fat.

In talking to 100's of people who used hcg their experience was that the diet did exactly what it said in that the body was able to take out the remaining calories from fat stores and few experienced hunger. Many reported the weight came off in a uniform manner ie. no sagging fat in areas that people who lose rapid weight get from other methods.


I am not in favour of hcg but I am in favour of methods that help people to combat the fat they have built up. I heard the other day that 67% of Australians are now heading towards being obese.

Maybe the headlines should read that " there is scientific evidence that the food supply contains lot's of gmo products plus corn products that are poisoning people and slowly killing them by making them fat......

and that the scientific community is really doing nothing to stop this, but heh they will sell you drugs to cover over the side effects so you can go right on eating their food without noticing .

The hcg diet works but it might have some negative side effects. Does the 20-30 extra pounds have more of a negative effect? who knows?


Problem with the 4 hour body diet is he proposes a " pig out day" which doesn't take into account the effects of eating stuff like sugars, gmo products ect, which I feel have a worse effect on ones health than a month of hcg. He also states that he drinks two glasses of red wine a day which in my experience is very harmful to the body but insensitive people can't feel that and use it as an excuse to cover over a mild form of a drinking problem.

Sensitive people can feel that two glasses of wine a day is not good for them.

I am not attached to either side of the argument on things like hcg. If I had my way we would make unhealthy foods more difficult for the public to obtain and would stop pretending that advertising and a unhealthy food supply is not killing many amongst us.

Instead of discussing the hcg diet we should have threads on why everyone is getting obese and what we can do about it. Blaming the people does little good as most people don't have the level of awareness to make healthy choices. We should look to the corporations that know they are pumping people full of sh.. Why sodas and other products are still on the market is amazing. Have fun in Korea watching the younger generation expand under the marketing of dunkin donuts and every other unhealthy place on most corners.
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12ax7



Joined: 07 Nov 2009

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 6:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

D.D. wrote:

I love when people use quotes that start with " the scientific....." which acts like there is some honest scientific community out there that does research to assist humans. There is no one science or point of view that is correct and just because wiki takes the conservative angle on almost every topic doesn't make it correct.


Right, because a starvation diet doesn't make people lose weight on its own.

D.D. wrote:

As I said before you can debate this until the cows come home and there will be one side saying that I tried it and it worked and the other side saying that there is no scientific evidence.


Scientific research has shown that there is no evidence that it works, and so its over-the-counter sale has been banned in the US. What more proof do you want?

D.D. wrote:

So captain Korea I would be interested in fiding out your side effects because you have real world experience with this rather than idiots that quote second hand knowledge.


It's not second-hand knowledge. This idiot happens to have a degree in biochemistry. Yes, I know a thing or two about metabolic pathways and human physiology.

If you want to lose weight, consult a doctor or a nutritionist, not the internet. It's the healthy and wise choice. Don't get fooled by stories about how this pill or that pill or this diet or that diet will make your fat disappear magically. If you're lucky, you'll have only wasted your time and money. If you're unlucky, you could become sick or worse.


Last edited by 12ax7 on Wed Jan 09, 2013 7:06 am; edited 3 times in total
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silkhighway



Joined: 24 Oct 2010
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 6:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

D.D. wrote:


Many people are becoming obese and it is not just because they are into instant gratification or lazy it's partly because the food supply has been tainted with products that the body can't properly digest and stores as fat.



It's not rocket science why people are becoming obese. We, as in North Americans, live very sedentary lifestyles and eat too many calories in a society where convenience and temptation surrounds us everywhere. I don't know why people want to make it more complicated than that, because it's hard enough problem to tackle as it is.

Quote:



I am not in favour of hcg but I am in favour of methods that help people to combat the fat they have built up. I heard the other day that 67% of Australians are now heading towards being obese.



I'm in huge favour of proven methods to combat fat they have built up to, and there are only two. Eat less calories than they expend, or in more extreme cases, get surgery to shrink their stomachs.

As for throwing around national statistics, there are lots of things we can debate about the government doing such as stricter food labelling, stricter advertising laws, etc., but this has nothing to do with how an individual should choose to diet.


Quote:

The hcg diet works but it might have some negative side effects. Does the 20-30 extra pounds have more of a negative effect? who knows?


You are asking the wrong questions. You should be asking, will I be a healthier person? And the answer is NO, because you have not changed your lifestyle. And saying that you are motivated to change your lifestyle because you now have dropped the weight is like saying you will be motivated to exercise because you spent 4 grand on a piece of equipment.

I hope the best for you, but if I was running Vegas odds, I'd go long that you're going to gain the weight back and make it even harder to lose the next round you try. I'd cite credible scientific organizations that support this, but you obviously want to believe what you want to believe.


Quote:

He also states that he drinks two glasses of red wine a day which in my experience is very harmful to the body but insensitive people can't feel that and use it as an excuse to cover over a mild form of a drinking problem.

Sensitive people can feel that two glasses of wine a day is not good for them.


I recently read something about a guy who lost several hundred pounds, (I can't remember where though) over a couple years. How did he do it? Even though he could only go a couple hundred metres at first, he bicycles everywhere, and he eats a very strict diet of the same meals every day which include a glass of wine with dinner. Notice it's all present tense, not past tense, because he understands he's going to have to do this the rest of his life.


Quote:

Instead of discussing the hcg diet we should have threads on why everyone is getting obese and what we can do about it. Blaming the people does little good as most people don't have the level of awareness to make healthy choices. We should look to the corporations that know they are pumping people full of sh.. Why sodas and other products are still on the market is amazing. Have fun in Korea watching the younger generation expand under the marketing of dunkin donuts and every other unhealthy place on most corners.


Junk food is not going anywhere. Convenience food is not going anywhere. We're not going to magically redefine our cities so that people walk and bicycle everywhere. We're not going to go back in time and have your elementary school give you PE class at least an hour a day.

Sure, we can help improve things for future generations, but as an individual, you have to learn to live within the society we got, not what you want.
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D.D.



Joined: 29 May 2008

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

12ax7 wrote:
D.D. wrote:

I love when people use quotes that start with " the scientific....." which acts like there is some honest scientific community out there that does research to assist humans. There is no one science or point of view that is correct and just because wiki takes the conservative angle on almost every topic doesn't make it correct.


Right, because a starvation diet doesn't make people lose weight on its own.

D.D. wrote:

As I said before you can debate this until the cows come home and there will be one side saying that I tried it and it worked and the other side saying that there is no scientific evidence.


Scientific research has shown that there is no evidence that it works, and so its over-the-counter sale has been banned in the US. What more proof do you want?

D.D. wrote:

So captain Korea I would be interested in fiding out your side effects because you have real world experience with this rather than idiots that quote second hand knowledge.


It's not second-hand knowledge. This idiot happens to have a degree in biochemistry. Yes, I know a thing or two about metabolic pathways and human physiology.

If you want to lose weight, consult a doctor or a nutritionist, not the internet. It's the healthy and wise choice. Don't get fooled by stories about how this pill or that pill or this diet or that diet will make your fat disappear magically. If you're lucky, you'll have only wasted your time and money. If you're unlucky, you could become sick or worse.


Text books are second hand knowledge. Just because you made it through a BSc doesnt mean that you understand how the body works. It actually means you understand the basics and unless you went to work in doing honest research with a PHd you are not even close to a real understanding of the body . Read some Candace Pert or Bruce Lipton
if you want some second hand knowledge from true researchers not supporting the status quo. Congratulations on your biology degree you sir have the abilty to read stuff and regurgitate it back onto a paper. The more you didnt question stuff the higher your mark would have been. Do you really thing someone with a bachelors gets taught how thing really work. For that you need to understand much more complex ideas than basic sciences.
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12ax7



Joined: 07 Nov 2009

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

D.D. wrote:

Text books are second hand knowledge. Just because you made it through a BSc doesnt mean that you understand how the body works. It actually means you understand the basics and unless you went to work in doing honest research with a PHd you are not even close to a real understanding of the body . Read some Candace Pert or Bruce Lipton
if you want some second hand knowledge from true researchers not supporting the status quo. Congratulations on your biology degree you sir have the abilty to read stuff and regurgitate it back onto a paper. The more you didnt question stuff the higher your mark would have been. Do you really thing someone with a bachelors gets taught how thing really work. For that you need to understand much more complex ideas than basic sciences.


Rolling Eyes

You sure like to make assumptions.

Fine, take all the quack medicine you like. It's your health and life you're putting in peril, not mine.
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D.D.



Joined: 29 May 2008

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

12ax7 wrote:
D.D. wrote:

Text books are second hand knowledge. Just because you made it through a BSc doesnt mean that you understand how the body works. It actually means you understand the basics and unless you went to work in doing honest research with a PHd you are not even close to a real understanding of the body . Read some Candace Pert or Bruce Lipton
if you want some second hand knowledge from true researchers not supporting the status quo. Congratulations on your biology degree you sir have the abilty to read stuff and regurgitate it back onto a paper. The more you didnt question stuff the higher your mark would have been. Do you really thing someone with a bachelors gets taught how thing really work. For that you need to understand much more complex ideas than basic sciences.


Rolling Eyes

You sure like to make assumptions.

Fine, take all the quack medicine you like. It's your health and life you're putting in peril, not mine.


Every science geek pulls out the word "quack" to explain everything that exists outside his limited understanding. When you use the word quack it shows that you are not very open minded and instead of exploring new territories you give them labels. Again I am not for or against things like HcG but I am just in the area of interested in exploration and discovery. Remember we as a species learn through trial and error. Just because something is beyond your understanding doesn't make it wrong.

A true scientist keeps an open mind and keeps learning for life. I guess you thing FDA approved medicines are good for you because they were approved by the people you call scientists.

I hope travel expands your mind and that you get a chance to use that Science degree.
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Jyang486



Joined: 25 Nov 2011

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

D.D. wrote:
Jyang486 wrote:
D.D. wrote:
The hcg diet is the most interesting diet currently out there and gets amazing results and after it is complete a thing like a slow carb diet can help to lose a few more pounds.

This guy is an amateur trying to act like an expert. Following his suggestions probably won't not lead to long lasting improvements in quality of life.


So you believe the HCG diet helps improve quality of life? You must be bat sh* crazy to believe a diet that requires the user to spend hundreds on hormone drops or injections and consume a maximum of 500 calories a day as a means to a long lasting improvement in quality of life. Dropping 20 lbs in a month is not a justifiable end to destroy your body/wallet.


I don't know if you have been obese before but it is not exactly easy to workout once you get to that point. People find after 1 round of hcg that they can start working out again without the pain they had before.

They are also really motivated to not go back to eating crappy foods.


Yes, I have been obese before. Before I started dieting, lifting, and exercising through sports like basketball, I was a fat 85 kg @ 172 centimeters, who 2 repped 90 lbs on the bench. Took months of changing my diet and exercising to get the weight off, but it was well worth it. I learned all about different dieting and lifting strategies, and thanks to the weight loss and strength gain all the studying has done, I am still studying and learning today. If you are going to put yourself through hell, you will want to know exactly what you are doing to minimize the time you spend in hell.

If I went for the quick fat loss route, I wouldn't necessarily stop eating crappy foods. Sure some would be really motivated to not get fat again, but others would see how quick it was to lose the weight to put on for years, and would not make any substantial changes to their life, slowly becoming fat again. People really need to stop looking for instant gratification methods to fat loss, and put in the work. I'm not looking at this in the way of "this is an idea that goes against all traditional methods so it has to be wrong," but rather "this is a method that is torturous and terrible for the body, and there are no long term changes, just short term quick weight loss." 500 calories a day for a period of time would do what to prevent the person from binging nonstop when that person finishes a cycle? That person's been 1500 - 2000 calories under maintenance for a long period of time, I don't have scientific proof or evidence, but I find it incredibly difficult to believe that any one would be able to transition from that to a good healthy diet.
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12ax7



Joined: 07 Nov 2009

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

D.D. wrote:
12ax7 wrote:
D.D. wrote:

Text books are second hand knowledge. Just because you made it through a BSc doesnt mean that you understand how the body works. It actually means you understand the basics and unless you went to work in doing honest research with a PHd you are not even close to a real understanding of the body . Read some Candace Pert or Bruce Lipton
if you want some second hand knowledge from true researchers not supporting the status quo. Congratulations on your biology degree you sir have the abilty to read stuff and regurgitate it back onto a paper. The more you didnt question stuff the higher your mark would have been. Do you really thing someone with a bachelors gets taught how thing really work. For that you need to understand much more complex ideas than basic sciences.


Rolling Eyes

You sure like to make assumptions.

Fine, take all the quack medicine you like. It's your health and life you're putting in peril, not mine.


Every science geek pulls out the word "quack" to explain everything that exists outside his limited understanding. When you use the word quack it shows that you are not very open minded and instead of exploring new territories you give them labels. Again I am not for or against things like HcG but I am just in the area of interested in exploration and discovery. Remember we as a species learn through trial and error. Just because something is beyond your understanding doesn't make it wrong.

A true scientist keeps an open mind and keeps learning for life. I guess you thing FDA approved medicines are good for you because they were approved by the people you call scientists.

I hope travel expands your mind and that you get a chance to use that Science degree.


Oh, make no mistake. I understand perfectly what's going on. Not only are you recommending treating obesity/metabolic syndrome with anorexia, you're crediting the resulting weight loss to a hormone which has been shown in research to be ineffective as a weight-loss drug.
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fermentation



Joined: 22 Jun 2009

PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

silkhighway wrote:
D.D. wrote:


Many people are becoming obese and it is not just because they are into instant gratification or lazy it's partly because the food supply has been tainted with products that the body can't properly digest and stores as fat.



It's not rocket science why people are becoming obese. We, as in North Americans, live very sedentary lifestyles and eat too many calories in a society where convenience and temptation surrounds us everywhere. I don't know why people want to make it more complicated than that, because it's hard enough problem to tackle as it is.


He's not entirely wrong in that a lot of food products have been "tainted" with all sorts of additives and chemicals (mainly HFCS). The obesity epidemic in the US exploded during the 80s so it has more to do with than simply laziness. However, it is extremely easy to avoid such additives by you know, eating actual food. I don't have to worry about processed sugars if I'm baking chicken and steaming broccoli.
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silkhighway



Joined: 24 Oct 2010
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

fermentation wrote:
silkhighway wrote:
D.D. wrote:


Many people are becoming obese and it is not just because they are into instant gratification or lazy it's partly because the food supply has been tainted with products that the body can't properly digest and stores as fat.



It's not rocket science why people are becoming obese. We, as in North Americans, live very sedentary lifestyles and eat too many calories in a society where convenience and temptation surrounds us everywhere. I don't know why people want to make it more complicated than that, because it's hard enough problem to tackle as it is.


He's not entirely wrong in that a lot of food products have been "tainted" with all sorts of additives and chemicals (mainly HFCS). The obesity epidemic in the US exploded during the 80s so it has more to do with than simply laziness. However, it is extremely easy to avoid such additives by you know, eating actual food. I don't have to worry about processed sugars if I'm baking chicken and steaming broccoli.


You're right. At one time it was unheard of that a boatload of sugar would be added to your yogurt or bread, but since HFCS is so cheap to make, it's added to everything. HFCS is the tip of the iceberg, our food system has all kinds of issues and I'm not going to defend it.

Still, if you're fat it's not because you're eating HFCS, it's because you're eating too many calories. The fact that HFCS is in everything doesn't help, but that's why it's so important to read labels, and eat mostly minimally or unprocessed foods.
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PRagic



Joined: 24 Feb 2006

PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Try the 5 minute plank routine. Looks easy but it's a biatch...

http://physicalliving.com/the-5-minute-plank-for-core-strength-stability-and-rock-hard-abs/

And it's FREE!
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