|
Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Students and Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
jar
Joined: 31 Jan 2005
Posts: 39
Location: UK
|
 Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 6:41 pm Post subject: Why would a company hire from overseas? |
 |
|
When surely there are a lot of candidates within Japan they could hire?
Sorry if this question seems kind of odd. Basically, I'm in the UK and looking for jobs in Japan at the minute. A few dispatch companies and private kindergartens have shown interest, and I'm at the stage of maybe having a few phone interviews.
It's made me think though, why would a company go to the trouble of having to sponsor a visa etc when there are probably countless people within japan looking for jobs?
What are the benefits to a company hiring from overseas? Fresh and genki and raring to go as opposed to burnt out? Or should it be a warning sign to me that they can't find anyone within Japan to fill the post?
Sorry, odd question. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ecocks
Joined: 06 Nov 2007
Posts: 899
Location: Gdansk, Poland
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 7:20 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| The ESL marketplace is a fascinating study in the whole concept of Supply and Demand with a healthy side order of how government policies (work visas and regulation) affect the labor market. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Mr_Monkey
Joined: 11 Mar 2009
Posts: 661
Location: Kyuuuuuushuuuuuuu
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 7:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ecocks wrote: |
| The ESL marketplace is a fascinating study in the whole concept of Supply and Demand with a healthy side order of how government policies (work visas and regulation) affect the labor market. |
Werd.
There is a great deal of competition in the market for entry-level positions. Why a company would bother to hire from outside at all is an interesting question.
I would suggest that there is a certain level of marketing involved, but also that there is a certain level of demand for new teachers as current staff improve their skills and find better jobs (which often stipulate "APPLICANT MUST CURRENTLY RESIDE IN JAPAN" in the ads) or leave the country for other positions, either in EFL or outwith.
Nevertheless, it's still a fundamentally weird place to teach. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ecocks
Joined: 06 Nov 2007
Posts: 899
Location: Gdansk, Poland
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 7:45 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Really, they all are aren't they? Europe, the ME, Korea, Thailand...all have scams, contract disputes, wildly varying qualifications and diverse government involvement in the foreign labor market.
Look around at the other sections and you'll see the same comments on almost every board here. There's government intervention (to greater or lesser degrees) everywhere, "contract" issues between school DoS/Mgrs/Owners and foreigners, language issues, odd materials, mandates, yada, yada, yada...everywhere I look.
That said, it's all part of the structure of one big game that everyone plays in participating in the foreign TESL world. Whether you are looking for adventure, money, love, anonymity, hiding from the authorities or desperately trying to survive, there's a bit of challenge and opportunity for everyone. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Pitarou
Joined: 16 Nov 2009
Posts: 1116
Location: Narita, Japan
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:21 pm Post subject: Re: Why would a company hire from overseas? |
|
|
| jar wrote: |
why would a company go to the trouble of having to sponsor a visa etc when there are probably countless people within japan looking for jobs?
What are the benefits to a company hiring from overseas? |
Employers that go to the trouble of recruiting from further afield can get better qualified staff for less money.
My first employer in Japan was an eikaiwa chain called Shane. When they recruited me from the UK, their minimum requirements were: a college degree, a CELTA (a kind of English teaching certificate), and native level English.
My local Board of Education only recruit locally. They advertise their ALT positions through their own local newsletter, in Japanese. They pay better than Shane, have better working conditions, and their only job requirement is the ability to read aloud a passage of English. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
It's Scary!
Joined: 17 Apr 2011
Posts: 823
|
| Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:40 am Post subject: |
|
|
| It's a Shame to go to work for Shane! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
|
| Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:47 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| Employers that go to the trouble of recruiting from further afield can get better qualified staff for less money. |
I would like to ask how you figure this, Pitarou. Employers who recruit abroad and have staff abroad (or send them) for recruiting will need to spend money on that.
So, there's more money than having local staff take care of hiring.
Also, how do you figure people who are recruited from abroad will necessarily be paid less, if that was your meaning? And, they certainly won't necessarily be "better qualified". Not in Japan anyway! If anything, the abroad candidates will be less qualified, IMO.
To answer jar's question, here's my view. Employers that have the money will recruit from overseas partly because they want the fresh blood, yes. That means people who don't necessarily have strong J language skills. This is good for the company in some respects, because the teacher won't be able to hear what the staff says about them, and because they will be forced to use only English in the classroom. On the former point, it's case by case, but if the employer is not operating 100% on the up and up, they may not want foreign staff to know what is going on.
Also, even with some measure of J language ability, a fresh-blood foreign teacher is unlikely to know what goes on in J business practices, unlike someone who has been around the block. So, various contractual matters can be blown by them: not paying for certain hours, not paying for health insurance, whether penalties can be imposed, etc. I'm not saying all employers who recruit from abroad are unscrupulous, just that these are some reasons.
Also, a newbie will expect to be led around on the job more than a veteran, so they may not try teaching their own way compared to a veteran who would rather teach differently based on their experience. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Pitarou
Joined: 16 Nov 2009
Posts: 1116
Location: Narita, Japan
|
| Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 4:40 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Glenski wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Employers that go to the trouble of recruiting from further afield can get better qualified staff for less money. |
I would like to ask how you figure this, Pitarou. Employers who recruit abroad and have staff abroad (or send them) for recruiting will need to spend money on that. |
I meant they are paid less.
| Glenski wrote: |
| Also, how do you figure people who are recruited from abroad will necessarily be paid less, if that was your meaning? And, they certainly won't necessarily be "better qualified". Not in Japan anyway! If anything, the abroad candidates will be less qualified, IMO. |
"Better qualified" is in the eyes of the employer. Some employers (e.g. Shane) would prefer a CELTA-qualified, native-English-speaking, college graduate over a Filipina housewife.
As to how I figured all this out ... well ... if we had a few hours and a whiteboard, I could give you an elementary course in Microeconomics, but neither of us have the time or the inclination. I'll just leave you with two broad observations:
1. All things being equal, when buyers have access to a larger and more varied (Paradox of Choice notwithstanding) pool of suppliers, they can drive a harder bargain.
2. If the price is right, buyers are willing to buy access to the better deals available in the larger pool.
Now, for "buyer" read "English teaching school". For "supplier" read "English teacher". For "deeper and more varied pool" read "the global market, as opposed to the Japanese market". For "buy access" read "go to the trouble and expense of recruiting from overseas".
Your nitpicks seem to rest on the inhomogeneity of buyers and sellers. Rest assured that, although this complicates the analysis, the overall conclusions remain the same.
If I felt so inclined, I could go on to discuss the necessary & sufficient conditions for the above statements to be true, and whether said conditions prevail in the market for English teachers in Japan. But I don't. So you'll just have to trust me on this. Or maybe go away and spend three years of your life studying Economics, before concluding that what they teach is either blindingly obvious (well ... not to you), untestable, or just plain wrong. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
OneJoelFifty
Joined: 06 Oct 2009
Posts: 463
|
| Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 6:47 am Post subject: |
|
|
I'd speculate that in addition to what Pitarou said (works out cheaper) and Glenski said (new teachers are easier to take advantage of), the entry level jobs are just a better fit for both the 'teachers' from abroad and the companies.
New teachers are less likely to be confident in their surroundings (and therefore actively look for new jobs during the first year), and will be more reliant on the companies. They'll be fresh-faced and enthusiastic. The companies (particularly dispatch) aren't offering much in the way of career development and expect a steady stream of new starters every year as the veterans take the experience they've gained and find better-paying jobs. |
|
| Back to top |
|
| |
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
