Job Discussion Forums

[Vigawla]

Hey, so I'm starting to get a little sick of the experience in China and there's nothing holding me back here. I've been preparing myself for the move to Vietnam.
I'm of Vietnamese background so when I was starting out my classes in every semester, there was a bit of backlash from the parents because I wasn't what they expected (a blonde haired, blue eyed foreign beauty). But a few weeks in, the kids had no problems and the parents warmed to me.

Now, I can only guess that with my face and my fluency in Vietnamese (English is my second language) I would have a better time finding a job and feeling more comfortable. I'm looking to teach adults, so with a familiar face and the ability to speak in Vietnamese (outside of class and for purposes of translation), I think I would have an edge over foreigners who can't speak Vietnamese. But that's only an assumption. I could probably negotiate much, much better with Vietnamese staff as well. No mix ups in translation or conversational barriers.

Does anyone have any feedback or experience in this?

[mark_in_saigon]

this question has been discussed many times. The search function seems to be working again, so I suggest you do a search on it and you will find all the angles covered over and over. The answers can be a bit offensive. You have the VN discrimination against their own people, for one thing. Then you have the question of if anyone who speaks English as a second language should really be teaching English at all. Certainly they do, but in a lot of scenarios, they are discounted. We have lots of native VN who also speak both languages, also English as a second language. They tend not to get the higher pay, or the equivalent jobs. They may be a better fit for the school administrative jobs though, especially if they have some western business training. Personally, if I were VK, even if English was my first language, that would likely be my strategy, as parents prefer the Anglo look. Parents make a superficial judgement, they do not have the position or the ability to choose a teacher based on skills, they just have a voice at the table.

Honestly, one does not have to be highly qualified to teach English here. We have lots of foreigners who teach based more on their appearance than their skills or abilities. They do look foreign though, and that is a qualification here. I have seen some very attractive young Europeans teaching English lately, I can barely understand them, but they sure look good.

I would reflect on my motivations and strategies. Being able to negotiate in VN may be great for motorbike repair, but for getting a job you are just reminding them you are more comfortable in your native language than English. Negotiating in English can be like a fake out game, proving to them how advanced your English is (the job IS teaching English, not VN). One of the big problems with the native teachers is they are not confident in English, so they teach in VN, and I do not think you want to hint to the hiring managers that you may also prefer to work in your native language.

Almost certainly you can get work here. But like all of us, you will have some very distasteful experiences, and some parts of the daily life may often be unpleasant. In your case, you may find that to be more common than what the Anglo teachers face. Sometimes ignorance is bliss. Finally, it should be stated (and you will find this in your readings) the VK have a very bad reputation here. The nouveau riche syndrome seems to be pretty common among them, so regardless of how you carry yourself personally, that may be one more battle you find yourself fighting. If you are going to work here, it may be good to have a thick skin.

[yogurtpooh]

I don't think all VKs have a bad reputation here. It really depends on who is interviewing you and how good you really are. Some people have told me to lie about whether or not I know Vietnamese. Instead, I've been honest and I've been rewarded for it. Perhaps I'm just lucky. It's a real touchy touchy subject. Perhaps once they hear my Vietnamese and notice how crappy it is they naturally trust my English more. You will be at a disadvantage, but it's definitely possible to get work, but don't go in there touting your Vietnamese abilities. Only bring that up if they ask you and I'm sure they will. If English really is your second language, maybe you should consider doing something else if you expect similar wages as a native speaker. The better your Vietnamese is, the lower your wages will be. It's that simple. If you were white, it would be the exact opposite.

Unqualified VKs who come back here from a few years abroad who feel entitled and over pompous about their English abilities are the ones who give guys like me a bad name. I've met a few of them here and have heard many horror stories. You'll find work, but don't be too picky about your wages and don't be too picky about what district you'll be living in.

Good luck.

[Vigawla]

Yeah English is my second language but I should've specified. I was raised in a Vietnamese household but had a strong grasp as any small child would, growing up with one language, on both English and Vietnamese. My English is not a worry for me. I might as well have been raised in an English only speaking family.
Having said this, I would never state this in an interview.

[Riding One]

[yogurtpooh]

Ever since coming here, I've interviewed at three places- including an international school and one of the major franchise schools, and they all have asked me if I knew Vietnamese and to speak a little Vietnamese. Being honest in my case helped because perhaps I was just lucky. I felt they all hired me because I am able to at least understand Vietnamese. Students here tend to never admit they don't know something. They always nod their head yes when you ask them if they understand. Some students can not even formulate a question in English so all they do is struggle. This is where the white person isn't as good as the qualified VK, but there are actually local TAs who handle this problem well enough. Of course it's not efficient, but it's what this country is all about- inefficiency. By the way, salary was equal if not more than the next white person to start out.

I know a few other real legit VKs who manage to find work just fine. Some were offered less money of course, others actually got real sweet gigs.

Come here and try it for yourself.

[Dekadan]

Just chipping in my two cents. I have an English teacher friend who's VK. He's never expressed to me any problems. He's quite ambitious and hard-working, with the goal towards moving into management at some point and definitely making inroads towards it. Seems like a good idea to me if that appeals to you!

[Vigawla]

Just a little update. I've recently been told by a school nearby Ho Chi Minh city that (after I sent my resume and passport/degrees scans) I'm originally NOT AUSTRALIAN (even though they acknowledge that my passport says I'm Australian), so they can't pay me as a foreigner, but only at a rate of 1 and a half times that of a Vietnamese teacher. They also acknowledge my TEFL experience and great references/recommendations.
They said it'll be 150,000 VND (I assume for an hour) and that that's all they can do. After a three month probation period, my salary will be 'considered'.
I sent a reply email saying that I was born in Australia and I grew up there my whole life.
My American Caucasian friend who referred me to the school was offered 25 million dong for 80 hours a month. Roughly 312,000VND an hour. Just as a comparison, I've been teaching ESL for a year, he's been teaching for 5 weeks. (Although he is an extremely good teacher/communicator).
That's a punch in the gut.

[Dekadan]

Tell them to pound sand and move on. There are better places out there and that's their loss of a teacher, one that has a rarer skill set of speaking English and Vietnamese. I believe the mill schools would treat you better than that. Don't let this set-back be too hard on you! Good luck finding a more appreciative school.

[Oh My God]