Job Discussion Forums

je_harrington1 · Joined: 20 Jan 2012 Posts: 2

Hi all, long-time lurker, first post, don't kill me.

One thing I've been wondering: how big of a handicap would it be in the job market for me (28 year old mixed race guy with a BA, TEFL cert soon) as far as racism goes? I've gone through the forums many times, and I've seen a few of the "I'm black/Asian, how bad will it be for me?" threads, but I never saw anything regarding my situation. I realize it may just be a "white person/non-white person" dynamic going on, but I've also seen people say that there's a stigma attached specifically to people who "look as though they're one of the many African immigrants around," in the case of black people, and the "we don't want another Asian teaching English to our Asian kids" dynamic at play when it comes to racism against Asians. I've also seen posters say it really just depends on the people you run into, which of course it does, but I'm just wondering: what's the handicap here, generally speaking, in my case, a brown person, as it were?

Thanks,

Jason

Non Sequitur · Joined: 23 May 2010 Posts: 4724 Location: China

Your writing style suggests native speaker so assuming that's correct I don't see a problem.
Make sure you provide a lifestyle photo in your documentation as well as a mugshot. The lifestyle photo should place you in an identifiably US or other approved source country setting.
Don't expect to get picked up by a top Shanghai college first time up. Let scarcity assist and go for provincial capital/2nd tier cities and include vocational colleges in your scoping.
Actually the work/salaries are not that much different outside the big international cities and I find the students much better.
We're coming up to the main hiring season for the state sector schools so if your TEFL has a classroom component, overall I feel your chances are good.

danasoverseasemail · Joined: 08 Jan 2012 Posts: 86

It is only racism when the culture you expect to integrate into considers it wrong to practice as a daily way of life. Since, such behavior is the norm, in many cases in China, it's entirely wrong and inappropriate to apply the term or the morals of your home location to China.

Just because you consider yourself, or are, a minority in your own location (assuming this is the case), or a non-white race, doesn't mean every other country follows or accepts your beliefs - another prime example is your expectation and requirement to follow, and be subject to, the laws of the country you enter; such as China in this case.

Therefore, it's unacceptable to apply your own wants to another country.

That being said, I have worked with Caucasians, Mexicans, other Hispanics, blacks in general, Nigerians, Indians, Pakistanis, and a host of others. It's entire up to you where you live and work in China and you are likely to find a place that will take you.

That being said #2, why waste time asking people here their/our opinion regarding your question and write e-mails to employers, including your resume, and a clear, full-sized photo, demonstrating your racial appearance. Be sure to include your race on your resume. Don't, again, apply your western ideas here by thinking they have no right to ask this information. You should simply include it is - as well as marital status and so on.

You'll either get offers or you won't and you'll have saved the middle-steps of asking here and getting what are only OPINIONS.

Non Sequitur · Joined: 23 May 2010 Posts: 4724 Location: China

shadowrider · Joined: 05 Feb 2012 Posts: 208

You ask here as people are here and have first hand information. Recruiters and schools will not be up-front about this. It goes well beyond having the right passport.

dean_a_jones · Joined: 03 Jul 2009 Posts: 1151 Location: Wuhan, China

The first response is a good one in terms of the information you need. Ignore the 'don't apply your standards here' stuff, it is inane.

I have worked with non-Caucasian native speaking teachers, as have many others. Some schools will be put off, but as stated, if you have a good attitude, are persistent and (even better) good experience (not sure if you do) then you will be able to find something.

Miles Smiles · Joined: 07 Jun 2010 Posts: 1294 Location: Heebee Jeebee

bharrell · Joined: 25 Oct 2008 Posts: 102

It depends on the city, school and students. I think you would stand a better chance in a larger, more progressive East Coast city: Beijing, Shenzhen, Guangzhou, etc. China has bumpkins just like America. There are fewer of them in big cities, particularly where foreigners are a common sight. I am sure if everything else is in order, you will find a place that could care less about you being less than lily white.

kev7161 · Joined: 06 Feb 2004 Posts: 5880 Location: Suzhou, China

Lobster · Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 9:17 am Post subject:

je_harrington1 · Joined: 20 Jan 2012 Posts: 2

Thanks for all the responses, everyone, greatly appreciated. Yes, I'm from the U.S.

(And I remember dealing with trolls back in the AOL days. Was hoping online forums had rid themselves of them by now. DDT must not have worked. They're like bedbugs, good God.)

See you around.

-Jason

naturegirl321 · Joined: 04 May 2003 Posts: 9041 Location: home sweet home

Yep, there is. I look Hispanic and have a Hispanic name, but am NOT Hispanic. (European: Romanian is dominate, married a Peruvian, changed my name: big mistake).

My parents are so American they're like MacDonald's. The only Spanish they know is: no hablar espanol. My dad knows dos cervezas por favor.

I have been asked at interviews.

How did you learn English?
Is English your first language?
But you look Spanish, so how can you speak English?
Where were you born?
What langauge did you speak at home?

And other similar questions. It was worse when I lived in a Spanish speaking country. I had one phone interview, where the (Chinese) interviewer kept insisting that there was no way I could be a native speaker.

Truth be told in China, people like Filapinos get paid less. I've seen blond haired, blue eyed peopel who barely speak English get paid more becuase they "look" like English speakers.

I put where I was born on my CV as well as "native English speaker" and I have where I went to uni (US). If you have a passport from an English speaking country and were born and raised there. And can PROVE it, then you still will get employers who will try to offer you less. Bottom line: they're not worth working for. Keep applying until you find a good one.

naturegirl321 · Joined: 04 May 2003 Posts: 9041 Location: home sweet home

[quote="kev7161"]

Non Sequitur · Joined: 23 May 2010 Posts: 4724 Location: China

Possibly UK includes Irish Republic in this context.
The remainder S/be OK although I did have one Afrikaaner friend knocked back.
As to the flamer who has appeared on this thread I suspect it is a reincarnation of another person who has been MODed off.

The Great Wall of Whiner · Joined: 29 Jan 2003 Posts: 4946 Location: Blabbing

There is absolutely nothing you can do about racism in China. Racism is in fact not illegal in China, and there is no laws about it. In China, you could put a sign on your restaurant or bar saying "No black people" or "No Muslims" or "No Russians" with no consequences (except maybe loss of revenue).

Same for schools. They hire whomever they want. If they believe that a white-faced, young-looking, tall, slender, blonde-haired, blue-eyed pretty female with no education nor experience will attract more students than a 30-something, overweight, short, balding guy with a very dark complexion who holds multiple PhDs in English and education and has 15 years experience teaching, guess who they want to hire?

If some dinky little backwater college is unable to find a foreign teacher because the conditions are that bad, you will certainly be able to find work there. This means a low salary, longer hours, and possibly even being sold out to private schools in the evening.

You may find better pastures in other, more modern nations.