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Perilla



Joined: 09 Jul 2010
Posts: 792
Location: Hong Kong

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2012 3:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

oxi wrote:
The downside is that everyone is saying prices will fall this year. Hope not, but I'll most likely hang on to it for a few years anyway.


I hope prices fall through the floor - and let's face it, they are too high at present after two years of surging increases. Myself and the wife (no kids) are on a combined income of 120K a month and we have a reasonable stash of savings, yet we can't afford to buy a 700 sq ft flat where we live. This is ridiculous.
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oxi



Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 347
Location: elsewhere

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2012 3:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perilla wrote:
I hope prices fall through the floor - and let's face it, they are too high at present after two years of surging increases. Myself and the wife (no kids) are on a combined income of 120K a month and we have a reasonable stash of savings, yet we can't afford to buy a 700 sq ft flat where we live. This is ridiculous.


Where you living in HK?

I agree - it's ridiculous. For my 300sq.ft, I could have a 3 bed detached in my UK home town. Such dreams.... The reality is I wouldn't get a decent job there though.

FYI - I bought at 1.95M, paid 30% and got a 30 year mortgage..
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Joshua2006



Joined: 04 Jan 2010
Posts: 342

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2012 3:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perilla wrote:


I hope prices fall through the floor - and let's face it, they are too high at present after two years of surging increases.

Hell, I don't.
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Perilla



Joined: 09 Jul 2010
Posts: 792
Location: Hong Kong

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2012 4:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

oxi wrote:
Perilla wrote:
I hope prices fall through the floor - and let's face it, they are too high at present after two years of surging increases. Myself and the wife (no kids) are on a combined income of 120K a month and we have a reasonable stash of savings, yet we can't afford to buy a 700 sq ft flat where we live. This is ridiculous.


Where you living in HK?

I agree - it's ridiculous. For my 300sq.ft, I could have a 3 bed detached in my UK home town. Such dreams.... The reality is I wouldn't get a decent job there though.

FYI - I bought at 1.95M, paid 30% and got a 30 year mortgage..


We've lived on Lamma over 10 years. We should have bought years ago ... but we didn't. We actually did start trying to find somewhere to buy a couple of years ago, but unfortunately about the same time the island suddenly became a popular destination for well-heeled Mid-levels gweilos and mailanders. Their arrival, combined with the HK property bubble which hit at about the same time, has caused property prices to increase by about 30-40% in the space of two years.

It's impossible to get a mortgage for more than 70% of the property's value on Lamma, so that means, for the sort of flat we want, we'd have to find between HKD1 and 1.5 million up front. This we can just about manage, but it would mean using all our accessible savings, which we're not happy to do unless it's somewhere we really, really like, and such places are very hard to come by - and overpriced.

I can understand owners not wanting to see prices go backwards but if you think about it the current situation is unrealistic (and unhealthy) for most Hongkongers and unless prices come down there may eventually be serious social unrest, which is good for nobody, especially expats.

We would also like to move to Europe, but the way things are there's no chance.
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therock



Joined: 31 Jul 2005
Posts: 1266
Location: China

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:06 am    Post subject: Re: reply Reply with quote

Joshua2006 wrote:
therock wrote:
Dude Love Japan wrote:
I'm even thinking of getting a mortage and buying a place.


You will be paying it off for the rest of your life then. Twisted Evil

I don't think you will be eligible for a mortage until you have PR and that's not going to happen for at least 7 years. Sad


Not true.

I got a mortgage within a year of landing in HK, not on PR, and with a 15% deposit paid. And I am glad I did looking at the fact that the monthly payment, including the monthly building maintenance that I now pay and the quarterly government rent I have to pay, is now less than monthly rent I would be paying on the same house.....I bought the one I was renting and the rent is now considerably higher for a like size house in my building.


So what happens if your visa expires and at that particular time you are jobless? I hardly doubt immigration are going to issue you with another work visa based on having a mortage in HK.
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oxi



Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 347
Location: elsewhere

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:33 am    Post subject: Re: reply Reply with quote

therock wrote:

So what happens if your visa expires and at that particular time you are jobless? I hardly doubt immigration are going to issue you with another work visa based on having a mortage in HK.


wait and...

1 get another job
or
2 sell it
or
3 rent it out

2 and 3 can be done long distance through agents if necessary
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Joshua2006



Joined: 04 Jan 2010
Posts: 342

PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2012 12:22 am    Post subject: Re: reply Reply with quote

therock wrote:


So what happens if your visa expires and at that particular time you are jobless? I hardly doubt immigration are going to issue you with another work visa based on having a mortage in HK.

Well, isn't that the case wherever you go and buy a house outside of your home country without a PR card?

If, and I hope it doesn't happen, that situation does occur, then even if we sold the house when my visa and life expired in HK, then I still would have saved a shedload of money on rent as I would be getting the full amount of what I paid, and hopefully a chunk of change more too......stands to reason no?
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Smoog



Joined: 11 Jan 2005
Posts: 137
Location: Hong Kong

PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2012 2:18 pm    Post subject: Re: reply Reply with quote

[quote="Dude Love Japan" I think I could support myself, wife and two daughter even on 20k if we live somewhere inexpensive since I'm debt-free with savings, I could subsidize my income with other work and my wife would be allowed to work (even though she'd probably choose not to). I'm even thinking of getting a mortgage and buying a place.[/quote]
I think you would really struggle to support a family of 4 on $20k these days. Rent would easily eat up 1/2 that amount - and that would be living in a shoebox. You could move out to an outlying island for cheaper rents but then the cost of travel would cover a big chunk of the housing cost savings, and you'd be spending up to 3 hours a day traveling which can wear you down.

To give you an idea of rental costs: the NET scheme Special Allowance is based on the average rental cost per square metre over HK island, Kowloon & NT *70 (70 sq m being deemed the appropriate size apartment for a Western family - that's about 750 sq ft). The SA is ~$16800: Thus even a 500 sq ft apartment averages around $11k these days. The SA is based on 2010 figures, so even this is low by 2012 standards.

Food prices have risen quite a bit over the past couple of years also.
Add in travel and any education-related expenses and you can see $20k won't last long.
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Perilla



Joined: 09 Jul 2010
Posts: 792
Location: Hong Kong

PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2012 6:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Living on 20K per month while supporting a wife and two kids would be a stretch but it's doable. (Some local families manage on far less, though I confess I can't imagine how.) On the outlying islands (eg. Lamma or Lantau) it's still possible to find a nice 700 sq ft flat for 6 to 8K per month. Ferry costs for an adult who travels to HK for work each day come to about $800 on Lamma. How much your travel costs rise to would depend on whether your wife and kids also need to leave the island each day or not (there is a primary school on Lamma and some foreign kids do use it). So long as you cook most of your own meals and don't do anything too fancy, you could live reasonably well. Problems would arise though if/when you want to send your kids to a good school, etc., but perhaps you might have had a pay rise by then ...

Anyways, I know plenty of gweilos who get by perfectly well on salaries of less than 20K, though admittedly most of them are single.
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prufrockwakes



Joined: 24 Oct 2008
Posts: 41

PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:54 pm    Post subject: head start sucks Reply with quote

unorganized, waste your time.
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