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Miles Smiles
Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1294
Location: Heebee Jeebee
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 Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 12:10 pm Post subject: |
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An entrepreneur-turned-racecar driver is now an expert on education?
Someone is surely grasping at straws. |
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slapntickle
Joined: 07 Sep 2010
Posts: 270
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| Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 1:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Miles Smiles wrote: |
An entrepreneur-turned-racecar driver is now an expert on education?
Someone is surely grasping at straws. |
You forgot to mention that he's a millionaire.
Why do people go to university at the end of the day? Isn't it to graduate and get a good job and make a decent living? Unfortunately for many graduates today, they leave university jobless and drowning in debt. Many are now starting to ask if it's all worth it?
Mr Simon Dolan's advice is both timely and relevant. His is obviously a bright fellow. OK, he might not hold a Ph.d in English Literature, but he does hold a degree from the University of Life. He has business and financial skills, but not the academic skills that some hold so dear. Whatever the case may be, by many people's standards, especially the Chinese, he is a success because he has lots of money. And at the end of the day, that's what it's all about, right? |
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Miles Smiles
Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1294
Location: Heebee Jeebee
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| Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Grasp, grasp, grasp... |
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Miles Smiles
Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1294
Location: Heebee Jeebee
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| Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:46 pm Post subject: |
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| slapntickle wrote: |
...You forgot to mention that he's a millionaire...
..Whatever the case may be, by many people's standards, especially the Chinese, he is a success because he has lots of money. And at the end of the day, that's what it's all about, right?... |
At the end of the day for a young, naive Chinese person, that's what it's all about.
Thank you for tipping your hand. |
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dean_a_jones
Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 1151
Location: Wuhan, China
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| Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:58 pm Post subject: |
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| slapntickle wrote: |
| Why do people go to university at the end of the day? Isn't it to graduate and get a good job and make a decent living?...he is a success because he has lots of money. And at the end of the day, that's what it's all about, right? |
It is interesting that your argument is encompassed by these two points. |
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slapntickle
Joined: 07 Sep 2010
Posts: 270
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| Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 8:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Miles Smiles wrote: |
| slapntickle wrote: |
...You forgot to mention that he's a millionaire...
..Whatever the case may be, by many people's standards, especially the Chinese, he is a success because he has lots of money. And at the end of the day, that's what it's all about, right?... |
At the end of the day for a young, naive Chinese person, that's what it's all about.
Thank you for tipping your hand. |
No, not just a young Chinese person, but most people with the exception of monks who have given up the material world.
Are you really advocating in this day and age that a university education is gonna make you rich? As mentioned before, students that don't have the moneyed families will never hit the financial big-time. Quite the opposite in fact. If students actually finish their degrees, they face debt, falling salaries and unemployment. For some, the only way out of this dead end is prostitution and suicide. The following article is a stark reminder of this:
http://ezinearticles.com/?Colleges-and-Student-Loan-Payback:-Suicide-and-Prostitution-Are-Not-Alternatives&id=6843157 |
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Miles Smiles
Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1294
Location: Heebee Jeebee
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| Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 9:05 pm Post subject: |
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| slapntickle wrote: |
If students actually finish their degrees, they face debt, falling salaries and unemployment. For some, the only way out of this dead end is prostitution and suicide. |
Are we talking about Chinese students or western students here? In the U.S. prostitution is REALLY illegal. The terministic screens through which we are being shown support for the argument are Chinese, and it's quite apparent. Resorting to sensationalist anecdotes doesn't really support the original argument. |
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slapntickle
Joined: 07 Sep 2010
Posts: 270
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| Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 11:19 pm Post subject: |
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| Miles Smiles wrote: |
| slapntickle wrote: |
If students actually finish their degrees, they face debt, falling salaries and unemployment. For some, the only way out of this dead end is prostitution and suicide. |
Are we talking about Chinese students or western students here? In the U.S. prostitution is REALLY illegal. The terministic screens through which we are being shown support for the argument are Chinese, and it's quite apparent. Resorting to sensationalist anecdotes doesn't really support the original argument. |
We're talking about Western and Chinese students because both are subject to similar pressures when it comes to getting a job after graduation, whether it be in the US or in China. If their hard-earnt and expensive degrees won't get them a job, then they'll direct their anger outwards(civil disobedience) or inwards(suicide). In countries like Spain, where there has been an economic meltdown, young jobless graduates are the ones that are fire-bombing the banks and throwing stones at the police. The issue isn't really what nationality you are, but rather that you are human and need a job to earn money to survive. If you've invested heavily in something, you want a return, you want a job! No wonder disgruntled American law students who face 6-figure debt loads are opting to sue their alma maters for inflating the value of their degrees:
http://management.fortune.cnn.com/2011/08/31/law-grads-take-their-job-frustrations-to-court/
These students are definitely due a refund because they were sold defective goods. |
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wangdaning
Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 3154
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| Posted: Fri Mar 30, 2012 12:21 am Post subject: |
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| slapntickle wrote: |
Why do people go to university at the end of the day? Isn't it to graduate and get a good job and make a decent living? Unfortunately for many graduates today, they leave university jobless and drowning in debt. Many are now starting to ask if it's all worth it?
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This is exactly what has ruined universities for people who want to learn for learning's sake. I went to university simply to study things. This was the point behind university, for people with inquisitive minds to have a place to gather and share ideas.
The standards are dropping and university is really a crap shoot. Has nothing to do with what country the students come from, it is about the government trying to shuffle everyone through to get a degree. |
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GHammer
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Posts: 37
Location: Guangdong, China
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| Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 9:29 pm Post subject: |
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This thread interests me because I teach Chinese students looking to go to college overseas. Thanks for the information and advice.
--G |
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Lobster
Joined: 20 Jun 2006
Posts: 2040
Location: Somewhere under the Sea
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| Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 4:09 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| Why do people go to university at the end of the day? |
I'd personally think they go in the morning. A person's reasons for attending a uni are related to their individual expectations and perhaps their cultural background. A few reasons may be:
Future employment prospects
The desire to become a more "well-rounded" person
Interest in a specific subject
To find a spouse
Parental expectations
A weak economy
No desire to enter the workforce
To develop a general knowledge base
Etc.
If preparation for employment was the only driving factor, there would be few students studying things like anthropology, literature or philosophy. A university isn't a vocational college.
RED |
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slapntickle
Joined: 07 Sep 2010
Posts: 270
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| Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Lobster wrote: |
| If preparation for employment was the only driving factor, there would be few students studying things like anthropology, literature or philosophy. A university isn't a vocational college. |
But things like Anthropology, literature and philosophy are loosing their appeal because they are seen as 'unprofitable'. I for one am very sad to see the humanities and social sciences being destroyed, but it's gonna happen as funds get tighter and universities find themselves having to cull those departments that don't make money. Stories like the one below about Keele University having to close down its Philosophy Department to "save �6.5 million in staff costs over two years" are par for course these days:
http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/story.asp?storycode=415539 |
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Miles Smiles
Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1294
Location: Heebee Jeebee
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| Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:47 pm Post subject: |
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| In the U.S., enrollment in community colleges is increasing. Does that mean the end of the university system? |
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zootown
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 310
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| Posted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 2:25 am Post subject: |
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In Australia people who have a trade are making big money and there is a huge demand for them.
My plumber friend pulls in $2000-$3000 a week half of that is cash in hand and he he is home by 3.30pm.
His friends who went to uni don't even come close to that and work long hours with lots of stress.
I know trades people who have retired at forty and gone back to uni just for the enjoyment of learning. |
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Miles Smiles
Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 1294
Location: Heebee Jeebee
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| Posted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:21 am Post subject: |
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I see that the referenced article bears advertisements for Nanyang Technological University and Hong Kong Baptist University. Very interesting.
To Slapntickl: does the rise in enrollment in community colleges and junior colleges spell the end of the American University system? |
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