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stinkytofu
Joined: 23 Feb 2012 Posts: 104
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Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:47 am Post subject: Horizon Recruitment Question |
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I've been offered a job by Horizon Recruitment. They have asked me to sign the school contract and send it to them to accept the job. I was just wondering if this is standard procedure so they can be paid by the school or are they trying to scam me? |
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Brian Hugh
Joined: 07 Jan 2012 Posts: 140 Location: China
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Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 6:17 am Post subject: |
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It probably means the school will pay them and the recruiting agency will pay you. It seems to be the new way of doing business here. Before the school would pay the recruiter one months salary after you passed a trial period of one month. |
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GeminiTiger
Joined: 15 Oct 2004 Posts: 999 Location: China, 2005--Present
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Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 9:38 am Post subject: |
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recruiters link a school and teacher.
they send contracts to teachers.
if the teacher likes it they sign it and send it back.
the recruiter gets paid something.
you get a job.
standard procedure.
your not being offered a job by horizon, your being matched to a job they are recruiting for. |
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rogerwilco
Joined: 10 Jun 2010 Posts: 1549
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Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 3:00 pm Post subject: |
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Recruiters link a school and a teacher, and typically take an amount equal to a month of your salary as a commission.
Agencies act as a middleman between you and the school, and may keep an amount equal to your salary every month for the duration of the contract.
Agencies are supposed to provide more services to you and the school than a recruiter, but I have yet to see much evidence of that. |
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7969

Joined: 26 Mar 2003 Posts: 5782 Location: Coastal Guangdong
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Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 3:02 pm Post subject: |
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rogerwilco wrote: |
Agencies act as a middleman between you and the school, and may keep an amount equal to your salary every month for the duration of the contract. |
Rogerwilco, how does this work? Who is paying what to who each month? |
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rogerwilco
Joined: 10 Jun 2010 Posts: 1549
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Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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7969 wrote: |
rogerwilco wrote: |
Agencies act as a middleman between you and the school, and may keep an amount equal to your salary every month for the duration of the contract. |
Rogerwilco, how does this work? Who is paying what to who each month? |
The school pays the agency, and then the agency pays you.
The school may pay the agency monthly, but I have only heard of schools that pay everything upfront.
My understanding is that agencies try to keep half, or more, of everything paid to them by the school.
I am not sure if Horizon is an agency or a recruiter.
I have tried getting a job through them in the past, but everything kept getting delayed, so I just gave up on them. |
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Miles Smiles

Joined: 07 Jun 2010 Posts: 1294 Location: Heebee Jeebee
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Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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Horizon is asking you to sign the contract to make sure that you agree to it, and the signature shows that you are willing to commit. That's all there is to it. No scam.
Re: payment to recruiters: I've spoken to about eight or ten recruiters about how they are paid. Each one has said that they are paid when the FT signs the contract at the school.
Many schools send out employment announcements to job boards such as Teach China, abroadchina.org, and ESLJobs.com.These websites require the recruiters to subscribe to their service in order to see your resume or your inquiry. Ten recruiters may see your resume before one contacts you. |
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Brian Hugh
Joined: 07 Jan 2012 Posts: 140 Location: China
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Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2012 1:14 am Post subject: |
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I can't mention names and even if I did the company I mentioned has been sold and has a new name. Everytime I have dealt with these multiple organization and associations of recruiters I have lost. When you have three people or organizations getting a piece of you, who is reponsible when something goes wrong? And besides these people there is your immediate supervisor at the school. Schools in China are run like armies, you can not see the person on top you must only talk with your immediate supervisor and then they will talk with their leader.
The imfamous recruiter that I dealt with was paying me after the school paid them. I was put in touch with this recruiter through a recruiter I had dealt with before. At the end of the contract I was told I was being laid off. I read about the scam on Dave's. They weren't going to pay me. But were willing to give me a second chance at another school. I went to the local police and reported a robery. I stayed there untill the school showed up. I got my final salary and left.
So there is an association of recruiters. |
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GeminiTiger
Joined: 15 Oct 2004 Posts: 999 Location: China, 2005--Present
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Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2012 2:16 am Post subject: |
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Just to be clear for newbies -- Do not sign a contract with an agency. Only sign contracts that list schools as the employer. That is unless you enjoy being academically whored out and abused as such.
Horizon though, I believe is a recruiter. The contract details should be directly with the school, just being middle-manned by Horizon. |
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Songbird
Joined: 09 Jan 2005 Posts: 630 Location: State of Chaos, Panic & Disorder...
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Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2012 4:19 am Post subject: |
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Brian, name and shame them! We could possibly piece together who they were/ are! |
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Brian Hugh
Joined: 07 Jan 2012 Posts: 140 Location: China
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Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2012 5:37 am Post subject: |
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Songbird computers and cell phones are tracking devices. I don't need the hastle. I have family here and one day I want to get them out of here. They have been names but like your students, they change their names. They have connections and I don't. My advice to newbies is do your research. My only solution is to sign contracts that require employers to pay you after every class. |
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Miles Smiles

Joined: 07 Jun 2010 Posts: 1294 Location: Heebee Jeebee
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Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2012 5:39 am Post subject: |
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Quote: |
Horizon though, I believe is a recruiter. The contract details should be directly with the school, just being middle-manned by Horizon. |
Correct. They (generally) have exclusive "rights" to recruit for certain schools for a specific amount of time before it is turned over to other recruiters.
My experience with Horizon was pretty good. Though they did not place me in the end, they did put me in touch with FAO's at some pretty good schools. Questions were addressed promptly.
If a recruiter is involved in the pay loop, something is wrong. Once you arrive in China, you should have no more dealings with the recruiter unless she checks up on you to address issues or to find summer work for you. |
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FarawayNow
Joined: 28 Apr 2012 Posts: 17
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Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2012 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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So what is the difference between an agency and a recruiter? They don't tell you in their ads. Most ads "look" like they are actually the school. After you send your info - then you get an email and it all changes. I seldom have found a school or university actually advertising. |
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GeminiTiger
Joined: 15 Oct 2004 Posts: 999 Location: China, 2005--Present
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Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2012 12:13 am Post subject: |
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FarawayNow wrote: |
So what is the difference between an agency and a recruiter? They don't tell you in their ads. Most ads "look" like they are actually the school. After you send your info - then you get an email and it all changes. I seldom have found a school or university actually advertising. |
Ok one more time..
Recruiters don't sign contracts. They ask you to sign contracts with schools that they are trying to match you with. On the contract it will say "party a" is such and such school. Recruiters get paid a good sum of RMB to get a foreign teacher for a school but their involvement ends when the teacher is hooked up to a school.
Agencies sign contracts with teachers. They are like pimps that operate in places like BJ, SH or SZ. They often have teachers working on tourist visas (illegal) and in "temporary" housing. One day a teacher will teach at a middle school the next day the will be shipped off to a private school. Avoid them by not signing a contract that doesn't list "Party A" as a particular school. Ok so I am a bit biased against agencies but this is how they work. I don't know of any legitimate Chinese agencies.
Recruiters are "OK" people. Buisiness people who make the job of finding a new job fairly easy. Some recruiters ARE/WILL trying to get you to sign with TERRIBLE schools to get their FAT finders fee so it's up to you to make sure the school and contract is acceptable.
Last edited by GeminiTiger on Sat Jul 28, 2012 12:19 am; edited 1 time in total |
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7969

Joined: 26 Mar 2003 Posts: 5782 Location: Coastal Guangdong
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Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2012 12:16 am Post subject: |
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FarawayNow wrote: |
So what is the difference between an agency and a recruiter? |
Here's my view. I worked for an agent once back in 2003, and we had a contract with her and she sponsored our visas. She had six teachers working for her and she found work for us - as much of it as we wanted and needed. One school today, another school tomorrow. We worked at different places each day and sometimes at more than one location per day. Sometimes the classes were held at the small school which acted as her HQ. Some jobs lasted for a couple of months or less, some were ongoing. If we didn't like one place we'd tell her and she might switch in another teacher. As for the pay the agent negotiated an hourly rate with the client (who paid the agent who in turn paid us each month) and the agent kept 15-20% while you got the rest. I remember one client whose daughter I taught in their home twice/week. She asked me how much I was paid per hour and I told her. This woman suggested we cut out the agent which I assumed to mean she and I would both benefit a little. We feigned a way to end the contract with the agent, and I not so covertly returned to teach the kid on my own. As it turned out the woman only wanted to pay me what the agent was already paying me and she was the only one that was benefiting from cutting out the middleman. I said F&^% that and just ended the relationship and never went back. In the end there was no shortage of work and you could make a lot of money this way, but you worked hard and were always on the move, and when typhoon season came driving around the county on a motorbike and trying to make it to class on time was not fun. The agent herself was a bit duplicitous but she always paid on time and she always had work for you so it was OK for some things but not everything.
On the other hand, agencies and recruiters typically find teachers to work at one school only and the school pays a one time finder's fee to the recruiter for getting a teacher into a school (and this is who your contract is with). Good recruiters and agencies follow up to ensure things are working out, bad ones won't. For some any kind of follow-up isn't their concern and once they find you a job you're on your own - this is fine as long as they never promised to "take care of you." I've never used a recruiter because I've never felt the need although it's hard to avoid them in some places (Korea job board is over-run with them). Sometimes I think the terms "agent" and "agency" are interchangeable, as the post above mine shows and which I didn't see until I made this post.
FarawayNow wrote: |
They don't tell you in their ads. Most ads "look" like they are actually the school. After you send your info - then you get an email and it all changes. I seldom have found a school or university actually advertising. |
I just looked at some ads in the China job section on this site. Some of the ways to help identify if it's a recruiter or agency you're dealing with: advertising many jobs at once, advertising for all of China but not a specific school or city, advertising for China jobs but the phone number is in the US, land line phone numbers (some people still use them surprisingly) with 4 digit Chinese area codes that don't match the city the job is in, anything with "recruitment" or "consultant" or other such words in the company title, any ad that doesn't explicitly identify the city, school, and a way to contact them, completely different ads with the same contact info for different jobs, ones that offer a car in every garage . . . . I think these are the most common ways to ID recruiters and agencies. |
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