Job Discussion Forums

[KarinaB]

Hello everyone,
Forgive me, if I'm asking questions that have already been answered in one of the forum discussions- I just simply haven't found the answers. I'd appreciate some feedback and/or a link to appropriate part where I could find some clarifications...
So here we go...I've got a BA in English Philology, a few years of experience of teaching English in Poland (mostly 16+ and adults) and also experience of teaching English in Refugee Council in the UK. I also have CELTA Pass A (course completed in the UK). When I search websites and/or different job adverts, it seems that the only 'sin' I've got is the 'wrong passport'- I'm not a 'native speaker'. Do I stand any chance of finding a good teaching job abroad? If yes, where? Is there anything else I could do to improve my chances? I must say that sometimes I do feel disheartened when I browse job adverts, but I would like to believe that there are some teaching opportunities for a non-native speaker...
I'm quite flexible re where to go and teach, however my first choice would be Asia (ideally where I could also go rock climbing ). Can anyone suggest where I could turn to, look for jobs/agencies/schools that would actually accept a non-native speaker please?
Many thanks for your help and suggestions

[Shroob]

You can always come to China. You said you'd like Asia. Plenty of non-native speakers that have questionable English working here (not that I'm implying your English is poor).

[tttompatz]

About the only place in Asia that specifically rules out non-native speakers is Korea.

For a lot of the rest of Asia, if you are Caucasian, have a decent accent, have a degree, a TEFL cert and a TOEIC - 600+ / IELTS band 5.5+ then you can get a job as an English teacher.

From your personal description just about the only thing you are missing is an IELTS/TOEIC score (an immigration requirement in places like Thailand).

Pick a country, get a tourist visa, get on a plane, land and get a job.
(The exceptions to the above would be China (job/visa in advance and Korea-not possible)

Check the specific country forums for particulars on "when to go job hunting" and the required "start-up-funds".

Also, be aware that basing your choices on the basis of "salary" alone is not a great idea. Look at comparable SAVINGS instead.
eg:
In China - 7000 rmb lets you save about �400 /month
In Thailand - 35000 thb lets you save about �400 /month
In Taiwan 50000 twd lets you save about �400 /month
etc...

Even as an unproven, non-native speaker you should be able to get a position in most of Asia that will allow you live comfortably and to save �400 /month and if you are any good then you should easily be able to work into a position that will allow you bump that up to over �600 before very long.

.

[coledavis]

Yes, I would agree about China. I know quite a few Russians who teach foreign languages out there.

[KarinaB]

Thanks for your posts, guys! No offence taken -I'd say my English is not too shabby
tttompaz, you've mentioned IELTS/TOEIC. Which one would you recommend? Does it matter? Which IELTS test should I take-Academic or General? To be honest I would have never thought I'd be required to take additional tests, but if it needs to be done then so be it!
Thanks for advice about salary too. Yeah, I'd rather look at what I can save- I'm a mortgage slave
I've heard about Korea not wanting to employ non-native speakers, which is a shame as apparently rock climbing there is pretty good But hey ho, can't have everything!

Feeling a bit more positive now, thanks Any advice is always appreciated!

[coledavis]

I suspect that anybody with an A grade CELTA is unlikely to have many linguistic shortcomings!

A couple of points word about IELTS and TOEFL. The former is British English, the latter US; however, I don't think it matters much. More to the point is that both of these are temporary qualifications, designed for university entry. While the score is useful, it might be more sensible to take the Cambridge Proficiency examination, as Cambridge qualifications have no 'expiry date'. (If I'm out of date or inaccurate, colleagues, please say so.)

[tttompatz]

IELTS or TOEIC (not TOEFL) is an immigration requirement in Thailand for everyone who is not holding a passport from one of: UK, USA, Canada, Australia or New Zealand who wants legal work (visa and work permit) as a teacher.

http://www.ksp.or.th/Khurusapha/en/khurusapha_NewsPopup.php?newid=35
4. Verification of a passing score on the Test of TOEIC (except those who come from 5 countries: The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, The United States of America, Commonwealth of Australia, New Zealand and Canada) or passing score on the other foreign language proficiency test.

I agree that is is a non issue for anyone who can pass a CELTA but still a hoop to jump through. Under the ASEAN frameworks you may soon find it a requirement in all 10 of the ASEAN countries.

OP: TOEIC is the easier of the two - listening and reading only and the cost in Thailand is 1500 thb (about 30 quid).

If you want to do the IELTS (broader use than the TOEIC if later required for other things) then the general test is adequate. One issue is that the cost is substantially higher than the TOEIC.

The other Cambridge tests (CAE / CPE / etc.) are not widely acknowledged or accepted by anyone (and in particular by immigration services) in Asia.

.

[coledavis]

[KarinaB]

Thank you very much for your posts, guys It's good to know that I don't really need to take on CPE at the moment! Gonna do some more research again and decide where to make a move then. Will shout if more help needed- really appreciate your support

[artemisia]

[tttompatz]

[Tudor]

[KarinaB]

[Tudor]

Ah, I see, so maybe the Cambridge exams are only of value in certain countries.

Although I see where you're coming from as regards having a CELTA, immigration departments have to draw a line somewhere, and I don't think asking for a certain IELTS score is unreasonable, as it is an internationally recognised means of testing English competence, whatever shortcomings it may have as a test. If they accepted a CELTA certificate would they also have to accept the Trinity one? What about someone who did a generic four-week course in Peru five years ago at a now-defunct language school - should they be let in as well? Should a decent CPE score be equivalent to a decent IELTS one etc etc. Where would it end? In my limited experience, many immigration departments want to deter people from coming to their countries to work, not encourage them.

Having said that, I also don't think it would be unreasonable for ALL potential teachers to have to take an IELTS or TOEFL test - simply having a passport from an anglophone country doesn't necessarily mean someone has a native-speaking level of English. But, as you say Karina, none of us have much choice but to jump through the hoops that are put in front of us; some just have more hoops than others!

[KarinaB]

I also noticed that universities in the UK (at least the ones I've checked!) ask for CPE as an entry requirement (but they also accept IELTS etc.).
Yep, I need to brush up on my hoop jumping skills