Job Discussion Forums

[skarp]

I'm arriving soon to a suburb of Tokyo.

Looking to get a job teaching adults. I think the 'big 4' are not for me as I have too much experience and don't like the "Dilbert" atmosphere I imagine is prevalent.

So I'm looking for a smaller place with a really good attitude.

I don't have that much money, though rent should not be a problem at first.


I read on FAQ elsewhere that it may take 11 or more weeks to get a paycheque - given the delay in getting a visa processed and all that jazz.

What are other peoples experiences? Especially if they are experienced (not in Japan) and qualified (Dip TESOL or DELTA).

Comments please.

I suppose I just have to try it and find out as I have no real choice.

Skarp

[lajzar]

It takes anything from 4-12 weeks to process the visa. No reputable employer (even teh big 4 are reputale in this sense) will let you start work without a valid visa.

In the worst case scenario, the policy is to pay you on the last day of the following work month. So that could result in an 8 week wait from starting work to first pay. And if you arrive a couple of weeks before you officially start, that can make it 11 weeks from arrival to first pay.

[BenJ]

this isn't being sensationalised - it takes a long time to get your first paycheque. Believe it.

[skarp]

Worth knowing - I'll be right up against it then....


Is it usual to get a loan in advance from the employer?

Adding up my hoard I think I'll be running short long before they cough up.


Skarp

[PAULH]

[JimDunlop2]

I've mentioned this somewhere else on the forum, but here's the general story (regardless of whether you are in Tokyo or anywhere else in Japan for that matter).

Let's assume you find work and get hired starting the 1st of the month (logical, and common). Payday is frequently on the last day of the month that ends in '5', i.e. the 25th. You won't get paid that day, as you will not have worked a full month yet and you get paid for work you've done already -- not for work you are going to do. Hence, your first payday is the 25th of the NEXT month.

Now, if you aren't coming to Japan with a job already lined up (or even if you are) it's normal to arrive at least 1 week (or more) prior to work -- jetlag & whatnot... (Aussies have it easier in that regard). So, doing the math: 1 week + 4 weeks (1st month) + 3 or 4 weeks (2nd month) = approx. 8-9 weeks for your 1st paycheque MINIMUM.

I agree with PAULH in that some schools will lend you money if you need it (or offer a pay advance) but that also hurts the pocketbook and you will find that it takes that much longer to get on your feet here.

Good luck!

JD

[PAULH]

[shmooj]

the answer to the OP's question may well be eternity if he doesn't make it through Seoul immigration on leaving this country...

Skarp may be short for "scarper"...

http://www.abc.net.au/classic/breakfast/stories/s1093193.htm

[skarp]

Skarp is short for Skarp-Hedin. A character from Icelandic literature.

........But it is a little apt, given my running away.


I am in fact resigned to holding out a little longer. Work is actually OK - I find it very easy and have a good bunch of colleagues and managment that just steers clear of us.

I have personal reasons to go - and a serious housing situation - which is the school's fault.

I may be able to get something done about that, and so make life more tolerable while I save up a little more money.

..............And try to line up a job beforehand.

Emotionally - I just want to be gone. I'm wasting time here. Waiting can be the hardest thing.

BTW - Delay in paying is in some ways us loaning the school money - employees always have to work some time in arrears as far as pay is concerned - and up to 8 weeks seems excessive and was far worse than I thought.

UK pay is usually on the last day of the month - for the month just worked. Or every 2 weeks in less professional jobs.


Thanks to board members for this vital piece of intelligence - I would've been in deep doodoo.

Skarp

[Mike L.]

[cafebleu]

Hi Scarp, I`m a fellow Brit and I used to be paid every fortnight in my old teaching job in the UK. I actually agree in theory with the idea that delayed payment in Japan is actually a case of we, the employees, allowing the employer access for a considerable length of time to the money we have worked for.

However, principles such as this have no meaning in Japan. I strongly advise you to wait and save, save, save in Korea. Sometimes it is hard to be patient, especially working in countries such as Korea and Japan where any number of problems exist for foreigners - institutionalised, legal, social, etc. Yet ....... you might come to Japan and find your situation worse because money problems automatically cause other problems to increase in significance.

The stress of not having enough money in Japan is increased by such realities as owners of houses/apartments, real estate agents, etc, having powers that can only be described as Dickensian - maybe that is too nice.

If you do not work at a big company eikaiwa you will usually have to find your own accommodation and when you are just starting in Japan the cost of what we Brits call `rental bond ` which is `key money` in Japan can ruin financially a newcomer. Think too, of the pathetic standard of most rental accommodation in Japan and again, those lovely owners/rental agents who lie and lie and do anything to get out of making repairs etc that they are supposed to do.

If you want to go to Nova, you may not like their arrangments either and if you have some co-workers you want to escape from in your free time, you may not be able to if you are living in the same apartment. And do you really want to be stuck paying back Nova or whoever for a loan?

Have patience, save money in Korea. It is much easier to save money in Korea because of the lower prices there. I also advise you to go to Tokyo if you do not want to work for a chain school or maybe even if you do. I live in Kyushu which has a great lifestyle and nice people but the jobs are drying up dramatically here. Even Nova et al are not hiring the way they did 3 years ago.

The trend in Kyushu is part-time employment, but the conditions and pay are a joke. There are some remarkably arrogant employers here - eg `We are looking for an experienced teacher with teaching English as a second language qualifications as well as a four year degree. Payment is 2,000 yen per hour.`

Or take the case of a friend of mine who called a language teaching college in Fukuoka some months back. The part time job was 90 minutes a week (yes, that`ll pay the rent and bills here!) and payment was 3,500 yen INCLUDING transportation. So if you don`t live near enough to walk, you actually pay your own travel fee. You could conceivably end up with a 1,500 yen wage per class.

Fukuoka is fast becoming the capital city of English school conmen and women. Tokyo has many more options, and the part time work there will usually give more than a paltry one hour a week. As for paying your own fee - Fukuoka seems to be the sucker capital in that respect. Go to Tokyo. It is more expensive but Kyushu has too many rip-off merchants.

[shmooj]

[BlueSky]

Cafebleu

I am living in Fukuoka at the moment and last week I phoned up about a job teaching at a pre-school. The lady asked me a bunch of questions and when I asked her how much she paid per hour she quizzed me on my experience. I have had over two years experience teaching children in Japan, she proceeded to tell me that WITH experience the pay would be 1500 yen per hour INCLUDING transport. Needless to say I laughed in her face. I would like to know who actually takes these jobs.

As a reply to the original post - it is possible to find jobs that pay on the last day of the month for that month. However, I would guess that these jobs are in smaller schools that are located in areas other than Tokyo. My first job in Japan paid by that system so I only had to wait 7 weeks before my first pay packet.

[easyasabc]

Just for the record on this "how long does it take to be paid" issue .........

I've worked for 4 different employers here and I've never had to wait longer than four weeks for pay.

All of them have paid monthly (either on the 15th or 25th) and all of them have had the policy that if you have not worked a full month by the time the first pay date rolls around then you just get whatever you are owed from that previous month. For example, if the salary is 250,000 for a month and you've only worked 2 weeks before the first pay day, they give your 2 weeks of pay which will be about 125,000. Then your first full pay check of 250,000 will be 4 weeks or so later on the next pay day.

I noticed someone else said that

[cafebleu]

Blue Sky - your story is a very familiar one. I don`t work full time but I have made a living for myself working at one school 2 days a week, another 2 days a week, others a few hours a week. What is the common denominator here is that I get paid 3,500 minimum - 6,000 and my transport is paid.

I have no trouble with those kind of part time jobs and their employers. Like you I have problems with the employers who want to pay low rates yet expect highly qualified professionals to teach for them! Keep doing what you are doing - don`t be suckered into accepted the low rates.

I told somebody who wanted to employ me (very politely) that their rate was not acceptable for a qualified person. They had previously explained that they could not get decent teachers. I said at the interview after hearing their pay rate, `Sorry but I don`t want the job. Your pay is why you can`t get decent teachers. You also have to offer more than 60 minutes of work a week.`

Serious teachers must boycott these jobs and when the Japanese employers here (and a few foreigners who play the same tricks) keep getting unqualified, unsuitable and unmotivated teachers then they might take a lot at what they are offering and what they want - and realise they are the source of their own problems in finding good teachers.