| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
J Sensei
Joined: 03 Apr 2004
Posts: 8
Location: A Cultural Wasteland between NY and LA
|
 Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2004 11:05 pm Post subject: Quitting before you ever began? |
 |
|
I was hired by Nova on 1 February with a departure date of 23 June...
and lots has happened in the time between "being hired" and the actual departure date. Now other companies are making me offers I can't refuse. Can they press charges, legally or financially if I decide not to go? The bottom line is, if I decide NOT to get on that plane, do I owe them anything, like paying for visa and/or other administrative costs?
thanks |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Iwantmyrightsnow
Joined: 12 Feb 2004
Posts: 202
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 3:02 am Post subject: |
|
|
Pretty sure they would just give you a bit of a brow-beating. To sue you would take to much trouble trouble and they would have next to no chance of proving damages.
Saying that though, try and give them as much notice as possible if you are backing out. I know there are reasins but people quitting etc without the proper notice just companies more antagonistic towards teachers in general. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Gordon
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 5309
Location: Japan
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 3:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
Can they do anything legally to you now? No
Can they talk to immigration to prevent you from getting a work visa with another company? Maybe, but not likely unless you have really ticked them off. They will ask for a reason, and don't say "another job". They may want to exact some revenge. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ranmawoman
Joined: 06 May 2004
Posts: 64
Location: San Francisco, CA
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 4:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
I'm in the process of applying to a NOVA position. According to NOVA San Francisco, there have not been a lot of resignations. In fact, they've stopped hiring for now and have a whole slew of backups just in case people resign or back out.
Thus as many people have said, they'll probably be a bit peeved at ya, but *sorry* I think you may be dispensable. They don't want to waste a crap load of money suing you as well... but you may most likely not be hired there again... I'm guessing. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Iwantmyrightsnow
Joined: 12 Feb 2004
Posts: 202
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 11:18 am Post subject: |
|
|
| ranmawoman wrote: |
I'm in the process of applying to a NOVA position. According to NOVA San Francisco, there have not been a lot of resignations. In fact, they've stopped hiring for now and have a whole slew of backups just in case people resign or back out.
. |
That is laughable. They're bull-shitting. In a court case under cross examination not so long ago, I heard Anders L. (one of the big wigs) give a annual turn over rate of perhaps 70% and an average length of stay as 7 months. (the figures could be slighly out). I don't think it would have changed that much.
Take a lot of things the recruiters say with a grain of salt. Did they mention that the company is legally required to enroll you in a combined pension/plan that they pay half of? Nope. they maybe mentioned it in passing then tried to sell you on the JMA plan. It is illegal and Nova is breaking the law by not enrolling everyone. Bet they didn't mention that. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ranmawoman
Joined: 06 May 2004
Posts: 64
Location: San Francisco, CA
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 5:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
[quote="Iwantmyrightsnow"]
Take a lot of things the recruiters say with a grain of salt. Did they mention that the company is legally required to enroll you in a combined pension/plan that they pay half of? Nope. they maybe mentioned it in passing then tried to sell you on the JMA plan. It is illegal and Nova is breaking the law by not enrolling everyone. Bet they didn't mention that.[/quote]
I gotta pick your brain.. What's the pension/plan thing? Thanks! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
melirae
Joined: 26 Feb 2004
Posts: 145
Location: Korea
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 9:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Iwantmyrightsnow wrote: |
| ranmawoman wrote: |
I'm in the process of applying to a NOVA position. According to NOVA San Francisco, there have not been a lot of resignations. In fact, they've stopped hiring for now and have a whole slew of backups just in case people resign or back out.
. |
That is laughable. They're bull-*beep*. In a court case under cross examination not so long ago, I heard Anders L. (one of the big wigs) give a annual turn over rate of perhaps 70% and an average length of stay as 7 months. (the figures could be slighly out). I don't think it would have changed that much. |
Actually, it's not that laughable. I was hired in April to go over in August and I just got a call pushing my departure back to September due to the fact there weren't enough positions open where I was to be sent in August. The hold on hiring could be due to a decrease in enrollment rather than or coupled with a decline in resignations, but regardless, NOVA SF was probably telling ranmawoman the truth about not hiring right now if they don't even have spots for people they have already hired to teach.
Also Iwantmyrightsnow, I would enjoy a link backing up the 70% turnover rate comment. It's not that I think you're lying, but it would be nice to see a reference rather than heresay.
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 10:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Melirae
I have heard a similar comment by the folks at Osaka general Union, but they did not say the school was NOVA. just " one of the largest chain schools". Seeing as NOVA is the biggest kid on the block, I wouldnt be surprised. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Iwantmyrightsnow
Joined: 12 Feb 2004
Posts: 202
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 10:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
[quote="melirae"]
| Iwantmyrightsnow wrote: |
Also Iwantmyrightsnow, I would enjoy a link backing up the 70% turnover rate comment. It's not that I think you're lying, but it would be nice to see a reference rather than heresay.[/color]
|
I doubt I can get a copy of the court transcript for you but I will see what I can find. Might take a while. But I don'T think the figure is so far from the truth.
Shakai Hoken
The company is legally required to enroll you in a combined pension/health plan called Shakai Hoken. It is quite expensive with payments being paid 50/50 by the company and yourself. Your part would be somewhere between 25-35,000yen per month. This sounds quite expensive compared to JMA and it is BUT it does have some advantages.
-When you leave the country you are able to claim back the pension portion. If you have paid into it for 3 years you can get 2.4 times your average monthly salary. This is roughly 6-700,000yen. That is a major part of what you paid in total and makes it equivalent of JMA in cost.
-It covers pre-existing conditions. Something that JMA and most other plans don't.
-JMA etc pays 100% of claims (with a few exceptions such as accidents involving alcohol etc I think). This could be a benefit but problem is you need to pay most costs up front and wait for reimbursement. I was in a similar plan to JMA, was in an small accident (not life threatening), the hospital refused to admit me for 7 hours until my employer came down and signed a guarantee they would get paid, even though my insurance company had called them. This is often the case for government hospitals. I had to pay my bill of 700,000yen when I left the hospital and had to wait for more than a month for reimbursement.
-With shakai hoken you pay 30% of costs. This has a maximum per month. There are also tax breaks if you spend over a certain a mount in a year.
-JMA et al usually don't cover dental except in the case of some kind of emergencies I think (??) Shakai Hoken covers dental with some limitations but much better than JMA.
-JMA stops payment after 6 months. Let's say you were in an accident and couldn't be repatriated (most plans don't cover this). After 6 months you would be stuck with the bill. There is also usually a maximum amount that you can claim also, after that you pay everything. It happens even when the illness isn't so serious but just ongoing.
Shakai hoken is a large amount of cash per month and some people will say it isn'T worth it but that is up to you to decide (at the moment). Thing is Nova is legally required to enroll you in it and they don't tell you that.
On some other boards you might hear people talk about National Health Insurance (Koukumin Hoken). It is something different meant for self-employed and those working at companies that were they are not eligible for Shakai Hoken (less than 5 employees, working under 30 hours). |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 11:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
iwantmyrightsnow,
I think that a lot of eikaiwas get around co-paying for teachers' health insurance by listing only their classroom hours as the hours they are employed. Since those are often 25-30 hours per week, it is below the number required to be listed as a FT employee, and there's your loophole. It sucks, because being on the job for other responsibilities is often a big part of the job, and in the case of lesson planning, it is a necessary one, in my opinion. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
king kakipi
Joined: 16 Feb 2004
Posts: 353
Location: Australia
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 11:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Don`t know about the turnover rates, but up until the middle of May (ie the month after April) 2004, Nova were advertising for staff in The Japan Times (and the ad said that positions were available for an `immediate` start `from April 2004`.....maybe the Nova classes are held in `Tardises`(ie Dr Who time machines..........)). I also saw a Nova ad recently on an EFL Job site. I would guess they are looking for staff quite actively, as they are paying to advertise, but probably hoping to recruit locally and save themselves some paperwork. I think these big companies are a law unto themselves, and often the left hand doesn`t know what the right hand is doing. Another example:- another Big 4 (GEOS, I think) says on its website that it DOESN`T recruit in Japan, yet it advertises jobs in The Japan Times.........I guess most people that buy the Japan Times are in Japan, no....?! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Iwantmyrightsnow
Joined: 12 Feb 2004
Posts: 202
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2004 7:14 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Glenski wrote: |
iwantmyrightsnow,
I think that a lot of eikaiwas get around co-paying for teachers' health insurance by listing only their classroom hours as the hours they are employed. Since those are often 25-30 hours per week, it is below the number required to be listed as a FT employee, and there's your loophole. It sucks, because being on the job for other responsibilities is often a big part of the job, and in the case of lesson planning, it is a necessary one, in my opinion. |
You're right Glenski, that is how they get around it but Nova can't do that because the contract clearly states eachers work more than 30 hours per week.
Recently heard though that some government offices don't think a 29-5 hour contract relieves the company of their duty to enroll you in Shakai Hoken. If someone really wanted it or UI it can be had if you push the right buttons. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
joncharles
Joined: 09 Apr 2004
Posts: 132
Location: Beijing
|
| Posted: Sat Jun 19, 2004 9:52 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I am inclined to go with Iwantmyrightsnow about the NOVA turnover rate. Our AAM at the time (when I was there) told us that the average stay for a teacher at NOVA was about 7 months. Actually, it is much less than that, if you leave out teachers who have stayed for two or more years. One possible reason Nova would set someone back a month is maybe they are hiring so many people in August they did not have enough training time, so they put it back a month so they can get the August groups through. BTW, I still have a few friends in NOVA and there has been a huge string of resignations recently. Just at my old school six of the 13 teachers have sent in resignations. Part of it is many other schools are raiding the big guys for teachers.. When I was at Nova we lost about half of our departing teachers to other schools who were seeking teachers in Japan with visa.
Last edited by joncharles on Sun Jun 20, 2004 9:53 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BenJ
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 209
Location: Nagoya
|
| Posted: Sun Jun 20, 2004 12:36 am Post subject: |
|
|
| I can almost imagine the SWAT boys bursting through windows, firing off tear gas and carrying off helpless teachers to work in better schools... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
