Job Discussion Forums

[RustyShackleford]

Hi all,

I've been lurking here for the past couple of weeks but figure I should ask for some information more specific to my circumstances to get the whipping by all the forum regulars.

I am currently on the JET Program and decided that, rather than deal with the hassles of deposits and moving in country, I'd move to Vietnam, save a little cash and embark on a complete change of lifestyle in Saigon at the end of July.

On two prior trips to Ho Chi Minh City, I have made a small base of friends who all seem to be trustworthy, if not particularly well-connected, people. They have all assured me that a guy with five years of experience teaching ESL in Japan with a BA and a TEFL cert (Albeit one obtained online via ITTT, a firm that nonetheless seems to have gotten this forum's overall blessing) should have no problem finding work.

I'm considering applying for VUS since this seems to be the least headache-inducing of all options, but going to be bringing something like 20 resumes to pass around to various schools in case that doesn't pan out. In the meantime, I will be staying a hostel until I can find some cheap housing near wherever I wind up working.

Am I doing it right so far? I guess that's what I'm asking here.

[ExpatLuke]

Sounds fine overall to me. I don't much like Saigon, but you seem to have everything in order. You'll need notarized copies of your degree and certificate.

[LettersAthruZ]

Sounds like you've been setting things up well....so far, so good.

But, as is stated repeatedly on this forum, you most likely will have better luck boots-on-the-ground / in-person getting a gig as opposed to over the Internets....

Best of luck.....

[mark_in_saigon]

This may seem like a technical nitpick, but on the issue of resumes, I think the number you mentioned is not what matters. I find that almost none of the guys here put together a professional employment package, which can be a big help, though a lot of these hiring managers are not qualified to know who is good or who is not, but maybe that is the central point anyway. This place is very different from other countries, you are in Japan, right? Those guys are like from another planet compared to the VN managers. So, it really pays to play around with your employment package and alter it based on what you see. For example, I was fascinated to actually watch a hiring manager look over my resume once, he was like a child almost, looking at a coloring book or something. The words were like hieroglyphics, he did not want to try to actually read them, as he did not want to admit he did not understand what it all meant. So he looked at the pictures in the portfolio, while comparing them to my live visage, this was the essence of the interview.

Of course, they are not all that "interesting" but I am sure some are even worse. We have to understand their mentality (uhh, or try to anyway), and then adjust our schtick. I have come to the conclusion we have mostly these game show host jobs, with a small need for serious teachers in a few locations. Presenting yourself as a serious teacher is not a good idea for the game show host job, and vice versa. So, best bet is to see how it goes, make sure you have a good picture on your resume, and adapt your resume/employment portfolio to the reality of what happens. Copies are cheaper than dirt here.

[RustyShackleford]

Thanks Mark and everyone else. I was thinking much the same thing. I'm looking to come to Vietnam to hone my teaching skills since that seems the career path that has opened before me, but since I'm hitting the ground running I know that I will have to keep my options open.

[mark_in_saigon]

Hi Rusty.

[RustyShackleford]

Okay sure I said two different things but doesn't mean that there can't be some overlap. I speak Japanese, which I find a lot of fellow teachers actually discourage and, so by moving to Vietnam I can force myself to teach more exclusively in English, although I am studying the language for survival/general comprehension. That and I find that it's actually cheaper for me to move to Vietnam than it is to move WITHIN Japan itself and pay ridiculous fees for "key money," but that's a whole other argument.

I find many of the "edutainment" arguments to be just as relevant to Japan actually. However, I am determined to try to make it work as I have in the public school environment in Japan, where, just as anywhere, it seems that the job is what we can make of it.

[ExpatLuke]

Sounds good Rusty. Like you said the job is what you make of it. That's how it is almost anywhere you teach. Its definitely like that in Japan and Koran as well. Sometimes i think all the people you see warning others about how "not serious" teaching here can be haven't been to teach in other countries. Ever try teaching in China? That's about as unserious as you can get. Korea you're just a kindergarten baby sitter. Japan its much the same unless you teach with something like the JET program. I've seen some of the parent and baby classes they have over there. The white babysitter is much sought after. At least here there's not much of that.

So come on over. If saigon is too in your face don't give up. Vietnam has some much nicer locations. Best of luck.

Excuse any typos... Writing this on my phone.

[mark_in_saigon]

[ExpatLuke]

Businesses might be run "better" in Japan than they are here. Actually, most Vietnamese run businesses are rather laughable. It boggles my mind how Vietnamese will open the exact same kind of store next door to someone selling the exact same things for the exact same price and expect to make a profit.

That said, I don't think I'd ever work for a Vietnamese run school here in Vietnam. I did that for my first year of teaching, and there was too much of "Oh you don't teach today, surprise!" or "You teach a different class today, surprise! .... Oh you don't have a lesson planned? Well just go sing some songs or play some games. The students just need to hear you talking anyways" etc....

There's plenty of other, more serious, better run places to teach in this country...

[deadlift]

[skarper]

Indeed...VN may bit a bit like the 'wild west' with outlaws running around doing as they will - but it cuts both ways. The better employers try to informally blacklist people who the deem 'unreliable' but there are so many opportunities it is hard for them to run anyone out of town.

There is a + and - side to this of course - some scumbags ought to be run out of town or maybe even lynched!

Korea can be OK if you take elementary precautions. They might not check your references but you'd be a fool not to demand to speak to former satisfied employee or two - the better places will not have any problem with this, anymore than the better teachers should have a problem providing good references themselves...

The big advantage of Korea is a regular steady income with negligible set up costs. Japan has a 3-6K USD set up cost that you will never recoup...[Jet programme and similar notable exceptions to this.]

Here - you can take a suck it and see approach - work a week or two and dump the job if it was a mistake.

VN has modest set up costs but is never going to be reliable.

[charlesmarlow]

Howdy Partner

[RustyShackleford]

Bumping my thread instead of starting a new one to ask about notarization.

I can only get the Letter of Good Conduct (Background check) notarized/authenticated/etc in the states, yeah? I'm due out of the country next month so it'll take more time than I have in Japan but it's at least able to be sent from Vietnam, am I correct?

Yet I saw a different thread saying I can get my degree/TEFL and other documents notarized in the US. Am I missing something here? Can I just go about mailing my background check and let my degree and cert get notarized at the Consulate in HCMC?

[Tigerstyleone]

The US Consulate will notarize your documents. The charge is $50 each.

There is a cafe across the street from the consulate too.