Job Discussion Forums

molihua · Joined: 02 Apr 2004 Posts: 59 Location: purgatory

Yikes! My contract has run out, finally! I am talking with another school, but my current school will not return my teaching lisence. Can they do this? They are claiming that because they worked soooo hard to get it, they don't want to return it to me. However it is no use to them as it has my name on it. Can they do this legally?

nolefan · Joined: 14 Jan 2004 Posts: 1458 Location: on the run

as far as I know, there is no valid reason for them to keep those papers. The Foreign Expert permit and your residence permit are issued to YOU and You only... they are yours to keep and you are technically supposed to keep them on your person at all times in case of an inspection

prawn · Joined: 04 Apr 2004 Posts: 73

what are you talking about? you don't have a "licence". the only relevant licence is the licence that allows the school to employ a foreign teacher, and that's nothing to do with you.

work and residency permits are not yours to keep regardless of your situation. they are employer specific and if you, for example, changed your job, your new employer would have to reapply for these documents for you. if they did not do this, and it was discovered that you were living and working in China using permits provided by an institution for which you no longer worked, you would technically be an illegal alien and that could mean deep $ |-| ! T for you my friend.

struelle · Joined: 16 May 2003 Posts: 2372 Location: Shanghai

Let's just look at the facts.

Prawn wrote:

kev7161 · Joined: 06 Feb 2004 Posts: 5880 Location: Suzhou, China

Prawn said (perhaps a bit too hastily): "what are you talking about? you don't have a "licence". the only relevant licence is the licence that allows the school to employ a foreign teacher, and that's nothing to do with you. "

Actually, my school requested a copy of my teaching LICENSE (aka teaching certificate) as I stated in my application and on my resume that I am a licensed teacher in the states (and it's true). However, they requested this AFTER I got here - duh! - and I didn't bring a copy with me and I told them so. Luckily, I had a copy of my diploma and that seemed to satisfy them. Also, I considered applying at an international school here in Hangzhou (but didn't) and they too requested the same thing when I talked to the principal on the phone.

So, once again, here is Prawn jumping down someone's throat and trying to make them feel like an idiot without truly knowing all the facts. Maybe what her school has is her actual certificate/license (and not a copy). Maybe the OP meant "permit" and stated "license" - - - they are certainly similar enough to make that mistake. Can't you picture him looking down his nose while he typed that statement above?

I'm sorry folks, I'm usually not this snippy. But Prawn does this to ALMOST everyone when he chooses to respond to a post/thread. Maybe he feels like it is his place to correct everyone but why he does it in such a condescending manner is beyond me. Prawn, couldn't you have said "License? Do you mean permit?" . . . and gone on from there in a MUCH friendlier tone? Is it really all that difficult for you? (and now I'm steeled for the onslaught - - - or maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised!)

prawn · Joined: 04 Apr 2004 Posts: 73

gee sorry. u handle it then.

kev7161 · Joined: 06 Feb 2004 Posts: 5880 Location: Suzhou, China

I think I just did.

prawn · Joined: 04 Apr 2004 Posts: 73

thinking's free kev.

Redfivestandingby · Joined: 29 Mar 2003 Posts: 1076 Location: Back in the US...

Molihua, just for future reference, the school cannot keep your papers while you are employed with them. It says so right in the Residence book and the Foreign Expert card.

Once you finish the contract then they keep your Foreign Expert card(teacher's license).

You surrender your Residence book to the Immigration officer at the airport when you leave. Sometimes the dates on these coincide. Sometimes the Residence card might have a longer date if you ask for it, so that you can do some traveling afterwards. Most schools will not do this since technically they would still be responsibile/accountable for you during that period.

Your school saying that they're keeping it 'cause it was difficult to get' is a half-truth. They want to cover their butts and/or use it in negotiations if necessary to release it to your next school.

Roger · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 9138

Steve,
yes, if you stay at a PASB-approved hotel you can tet a visa extension by staying at that hotel for at least two nights.

THUD & BLUNDER · Joined: 05 Jun 2004 Posts: 34 Location: Guangzhou

molihua · Joined: 02 Apr 2004 Posts: 59 Location: purgatory

Thank you to everyone who replied. Just a few things to add.
I am sorry I was talking about my "Red Book". Sorry to Prawn, thank you to Kev. I was told that I should keep my passport, green book and red book on me at all times. However the school has never let keep my red book on me. To be honest I don't even know if I ever got a Z visa? What I did get was something in my passport that said changed? In chinese....My resident permit, and a red book.
I think what worries me the most is that the date in the red book is good until Feb. of next year. Being that I am in a "small town" everyone seems to AROUND the law and quite frankly I think that the school will just use my book for another teacher. I know this may sound insane since yes, it has my name on it! However things were shady right from the start. Another school had to go to the government with us at first, the first contract they wanted us to sign was not even with this school. ( I am in PINGXIANG, Jiangxi. Middle School Number Four. ) The real poopy thing about this is, I won't be able to work at any other school in PX because they are "good friends".
I do not trust this school and really don't want them using my name on any legal papers, I don't know what else to say or do to make them give me back that book? On top of this they hope I can stay another six months...what the.....?

anthyp · Joined: 16 Apr 2004 Posts: 1320 Location: Chicago, IL USA

molihua · Joined: 02 Apr 2004 Posts: 59 Location: purgatory

Well I finally recieved my "red book". All it took was the Canadian Embassy in China to call my school! It upsets me that I had to go that far to get something that was mine in the first place.
Everything seems to be so complicated. My roomate is trying to change a single entry visa to dual. It has been non stop "perhaps", "well you see", "they don't know", "yes they know" "sometimes they know".
Then when you catch them in a lie it's just a "cultural" difference?
It's working for people like this that give China a bad name!

Sechelt · Joined: 26 Jun 2004 Posts: 35

Molihua:

It seems you've sorted it out- hopefully. If you're ever in doubt, go directly to the PSB/entry-exit admin. (which may be difficult in smaller cities- go to a larger centre, if you have the chance). They will provide the straight goods. As Redfivestandingby wrote, the Red Book MUST be returned to the school (there is no need for you to keep it, as it is employer specific). However, the Green Book is yours to keep, until you leave the country. The paperwork involved in changing jobs, is really quite simple. People who don't know what they're doing, make it complicated (referring to school officials, who should really know better). Once a new school/employer has recieved a new Red Book for you, just take it & your Green Book to the local PSB (translator in-tow, if necessary). The PSB will take all of 5 minutes to change the name and address of your empolyer and residence- there is no need to get a new one, as it is possible to change the info. 4 or 5 times, in the book. This, of course, depends on how familiar the local PSB office is with the proceadures (in larger centres, there should be no problem; in smaller centres...).