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First form, second form, third form?
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Chancellor

Joined: 31 Oct 2005
Posts: 1337
Location: Ji'an, China - if you're willing to send me cigars, I accept donations :)

Posted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 4:53 pm Post subject:

Sashadroogie wrote:

Learners taking IELTS or TOEFL will not need any metalanguage at all to take those tests. (Unless TOEFL has changed again...) They would only need these terms if they were studying linguistics at uni.

What about when these terms are found in the books from which they're studying for the exams or when these terms are being used by teachers that are helping them prepare for the exams? (Like the book I've been using with one student recently).

HLJHLJ

Joined: 06 Oct 2009
Posts: 1218
Location: Ecuador

Posted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 6:05 pm Post subject:

Chancellor wrote:

Sashadroogie wrote:

Then the book is inappropriate for that purpose. You can waste their time teaching them metalanguage that is irrelevant to the test they are preparing for, or you can find a better book.

Sashadroogie

Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 11061
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise

Posted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 9:32 pm Post subject:

Chancellor wrote:

Sashadroogie wrote:

I think you'll find that most Kazakh students, or Soviet students generally, have a pretty good grasp of metalanguage in all its forms. I don't know about your situation, obviously, but it would be surprising if they didn't know the term past participle and third form of the verb. It is all I can do to get them to stop using the term 'subjunctive mood' to each other here... (just coz I don't happen to like that term myself....)

Sashadroogie

Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 11061
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise

Posted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 9:33 pm Post subject:

Plus ditto what HLJHLJ said. Double plus good : )

Denim-Maniac

Joined: 31 Jan 2012
Posts: 1238

Posted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 1:31 am Post subject:

Chancellor wrote:

Denim-Maniac wrote:

My Chinese students introduced verb 1 / verb 2 / verb 3 to me, and Ive kinda adopted it too. I have lots of material referring to grammar with specialised words like 'infinitive' and 'past participle' and my students can stumble and stutter over the meta-language. So if you can find a simple common ground I think its a better option to use it. 'Auxiliaries' has become 'verb helpers' ... which is much easier and possibly better for my students.

But if they go on to take the IELTS or TOEFL or go on to university in an Anglophone country, they're going to need the academic language.

Id thought about that ... very few have an intention to do IELTS / TOEFL or go to university abroad. I would guess around 50 students have passed through my classes so far (4 months into my contract) and only 2 have plans for studying abroad. Struggling over meta-language when the students have provided a solution they are all comfortable with seems silly to me.

95% of my students are adults who are attending classes purely to improve their communicative ability and help them in their workplace. Horses for courses etc ... If I was teaching different classes Id be tempted to stick with meta-language.

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