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Non Sequitur
Joined: 23 May 2010
Posts: 4724
Location: China
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 Posted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:04 am Post subject: |
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| chinatimes wrote: |
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| isn't this a little late in the piece to be wavering? |
Not at all, I was looking for a job from May to August. I went to a new school in June, was told by other teachers to not take the job and left after a week. I spent the end of June until about end of July trying to find jobs, but recruiters only wanted me to take summer camp positions they couldn't fill or the schools were on holiday. So, I waited and waited and no response.
Now that Chinese teachers are back from holiday, recruiters are contacting me about jobs I applied for back in May. When I tell them I already got a job, they say, "Why didn't you tell us?" or "Did you sign the contract yet?"
This is a perfect time to transfer to another school because Chinese schools work based on a fixed schedule. When it is holiday, they don't think about the upcoming September jobs. They wait until August and then they take whoever is available. I literally don't have a job offer I can't take now that I wanted before. It's Thursday and recruiters are still contacting me. The last time I replied to an ad was 2.5 weeks ago.
Get on Skype, get those recruiters added, they usually advertise their Skype ID names on echinacities. Contact them directly. Show them offers you like and don't back down when negotiating. When you are asked to talk with the school, you might need to get a QQ account.
One school wanted me to pay rent, and now that they know I am with another school they want me to leave and they will pay rent 
I told them, "If you were willing to give me housing from the beginning I would have gone with you, but I am not going to pick up and leave this school that has been honest with me so far and gave me a place to move into immediately."
They will try to get as much out of you as they can. Don't be afraid to say no to a good offer with a few crucial sore spots like this. These recruiters will eventually come to their senses.
You need:
housing, reasonable salary, a schedule of what classes you are to teach (should be easier now because September is right around the corner), resources you can use
And the big one, the contract. Don't play into their trap that you can't see the contract until the interview. Get it emailed so you can look at it. If the contract is bad, there is no need to go to an interview. You don't need to meet with the recruiter for an interview first. You don't need to do a demo video for the recruiter first. All this is only for the recruiter's benefit. Also, do not pay commission to the recruiter.
Get an idea of the city you will move to, look at train stations on a map compared to where the school is http://map.baidu.com or use Google maps. Are there subway stations? What bus routes are in that area? You can get the bus numbers from the school and look them up at http://www.8684.cn/ |
You don't mention the time required to complete the visa requirements. |
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zactherat
Joined: 24 Aug 2011
Posts: 295
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| Posted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 6:09 am Post subject: |
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Qingdao:
+ nice setting, nice air, nice landscape
+ beer in a bag!
+ mild mandarin dialect (so good place to learn)
+ tier 1 city, the size of a tier 2 or 3
+/- lots and lots of Koreans
+/- popular with tourists
- small and insular expat community
- popular place, so low salaries
- high rent (almost in line with the metropoli)
Chengdu
+ Food. Although this is obviously subjective, and most places have nice food.
+ Colourful, more beatnikish expat community (compared to, say, Shenzhen - again this might be a minus for you)
+ cheaper rent
+ more oppourtunities than QD, which is good if you stay on for another contract
- Tier 2, so it's less developed than QD, which had the Olympics steam through in 08
- more polluted than QD
- Sichuanese dialect. Yuck in my ears!
...
Neither has a metro system, so public transport is prone to occasional gridlock. Both are pretty fun cities (if you like China - not everyone does!), so I agree with other posters that recommend going with the best job.
And best job means (to me, at least) the best balance of low hours: high pay: good location: nice colleagues: progressive career track. |
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chinatimes
Joined: 27 May 2012
Posts: 478
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| Posted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 7:38 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| You don't mention the time required to complete the visa requirements. |
I am sorry are you saying I didn't or are you suggesting people don't mention it?
I not really sure what your point is. Why was it necessary for me to mention it or why should we avoid mentioning it? Does it really matter?
If you have time on your residence permit and your previous school hasn't canceled then you should be able to have ample time to get a new job relative to what is in your passport. It varies from person to person so there isn't a set time. Some teachers worked summer jobs and some found a September job and just traveled around for a couple months. |
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bacalao
Joined: 04 Aug 2013
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 7:41 am Post subject: |
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Thanks everybody. Very helpful advice. I’m especially compelled by “less developed,” “more opportunities” and “colourful” in the Chengdu corner. The heart wants what it wants, and not what the lungs do.
I don’t have any offers in Qingdao yet. I’m currently negotiating the Chengdu offer. But I don’t feel at all desperate/attached to it. If they pass on me, that’s ok. I’m prepared to spend some time on a shoestring, visiting these places and trying to find a job when I’m on the ground. And if anyone wants to share/PM me any advice on schools they think I should be aware of in either place (my main criteria are students over 12 and fair treatment), I’d be grateful. |
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zactherat
Joined: 24 Aug 2011
Posts: 295
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| Posted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 8:41 am Post subject: |
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| bacalao wrote: |
| I’m especially compelled by “less developed,” |
Careful with that.
Outside of China:
'less developed' - quaint, traditional, quiet, unencumbered, historical
'developed' - concrete, lacking in soul, bland
In China:
'developed' - functional sanitation, rules of eqiquette, English language
'less developed' - stares, spitting, hostility, xenophobia, sickness
edit: yeah, and also what choudoufu says below.
Last edited by zactherat on Thu Aug 15, 2013 8:44 am; edited 2 times in total |
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choudoufu
Joined: 25 May 2010
Posts: 3325
Location: Mao-berry, PRC
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| Posted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 8:42 am Post subject: |
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| bacalao wrote: |
| I’m prepared to spend some time on a shoestring, visiting these places and trying to find a job when I’m on the ground. |
are you prepared to fly back to your home country to apply for the work
permit? fewerer and fewerer provinces and allowing visa runs to third
countries and/or hongkong. |
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wangdaning
Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 3154
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| Posted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 9:43 am Post subject: |
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| zactherat wrote: |
Neither has a metro system, so public transport is prone to occasional gridlock.
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Just a correction, Chengdu does have a metro system.
Many locals blame the construction of the metro system and the recent building of an upper level to the second ring road for the pollution problems.
They finished the ring road work, mostly, but they are still extending and adding new lines to the metro system. |
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bacalao
Joined: 04 Aug 2013
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 10:13 am Post subject: |
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| zactherat wrote: |
| bacalao wrote: |
| I’m especially compelled by “less developed,” |
Careful with that.
Outside of China:
'less developed' - quaint, traditional, quiet, unencumbered, historical
'developed' - concrete, lacking in soul, bland
In China:
'developed' - functional sanitation, rules of eqiquette, English language
'less developed' - stares, spitting, hostility, xenophobia, sickness
edit: yeah, and also what choudoufu says below. |
Ok, yeah, thanks for the reality check. I conveniently overlooked that you had listed that as a negative. Less English I hope could be an uncomfortable positive, very uncomfortable positive while sick and spit-addled.
| choudoufu wrote: |
| bacalao wrote: |
| I’m prepared to spend some time on a shoestring, visiting these places and trying to find a job when I’m on the ground. |
are you prepared to fly back to your home country to apply for the work
permit? fewerer and fewerer provinces and allowing visa runs to third
countries and/or hongkong. |
I’m still reckoning with all of that. Haven't found clear answers about which provinces still do/might. The school I’m dealing with now specifically prescribes Hong Kong run as the visa process they’ll ask me to use, but I expect that information doesn’t say much about its actual current possibility/legitimacy in Sichuan. Probably it does disqualify the employer in a lot of eyes though. I’m not in my home country now and would prefer not to tag up there, which I suppose complicates things further. |
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choudoufu
Joined: 25 May 2010
Posts: 3325
Location: Mao-berry, PRC
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| Posted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 12:56 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="bacalao"]
| zactherat DID NOT wrote: |
| I’m not in my home country now and would prefer not to tag up there, which I suppose complicates things further. |
wherefore art thou and whatfore visa art thou upon?
Last edited by choudoufu on Thu Aug 15, 2013 1:39 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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bacalao
Joined: 04 Aug 2013
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 1:18 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="choudoufu"]
| bacalao wrote: |
| zactherat wrote: |
| I’m not in my home country now and would prefer not to tag up there, which I suppose complicates things further. |
wherefore art thou and whatfore visa art thou upon? |
New Zealand, working holiday, there's a Chinese consulate in Christchurch, to Z or not to...... |
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zactherat
Joined: 24 Aug 2011
Posts: 295
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| Posted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 1:20 pm Post subject: |
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| ^ I said nothing of the sort! |
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Non Sequitur
Joined: 23 May 2010
Posts: 4724
Location: China
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| Posted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 8:03 pm Post subject: |
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| chinatimes wrote: |
| Quote: |
| You don't mention the time required to complete the visa requirements. |
I am sorry are you saying I didn't or are you suggesting people don't mention it?
I not really sure what your point is. Why was it necessary for me to mention it or why should we avoid mentioning it? Does it really matter?
If you have time on your residence permit and your previous school hasn't canceled then you should be able to have ample time to get a new job relative to what is in your passport. It varies from person to person so there isn't a set time. Some teachers worked summer jobs and some found a September job and just traveled around for a couple months. |
My comment was related to the OP - remember him?
He isn't in China. |
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chinatimes
Joined: 27 May 2012
Posts: 478
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| Posted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 10:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Non Sequitur wrote: |
| chinatimes wrote: |
| Quote: |
| You don't mention the time required to complete the visa requirements. |
I am sorry are you saying I didn't or are you suggesting people don't mention it?
I not really sure what your point is. Why was it necessary for me to mention it or why should we avoid mentioning it? Does it really matter?
If you have time on your residence permit and your previous school hasn't canceled then you should be able to have ample time to get a new job relative to what is in your passport. It varies from person to person so there isn't a set time. Some teachers worked summer jobs and some found a September job and just traveled around for a couple months. |
My comment was related to the OP - remember him?
He isn't in China. |
Wow, we have a crazy thing in common then.
| Quote: |
| The closest major city would be Chongqing, is this something you might want to branch off to later on? |
If you get a Z visa out of China, and then you branch off to a second city in China guess what? You missed this in your attack preparation.
I was addressing the OP too. |
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bacalao
Joined: 04 Aug 2013
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 12:32 am Post subject: |
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Should I buy claims from a potential employer that they can't consider giving me a less-than-one-year contract because they can't get me a working visa for a shorter commitment than that (not that they don't want to get me a working visa for less, but that it's a requirement of the working visa to have at least a one-year contract), or is that an excuse?
I 'd very much like to avoid making a commitment that takes me past the start of next school year, since it would ruin my chances of trying to find something better. But I am sympathetic to the idea that if a school invests in me it's fair for them to want me for a year. |
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Non Sequitur
Joined: 23 May 2010
Posts: 4724
Location: China
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| Posted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 2:05 am Post subject: |
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[quote="bacalao"]
| choudoufu wrote: |
| bacalao wrote: |
| zactherat wrote: |
| I’m not in my home country now and would prefer not to tag up there, which I suppose complicates things further. |
wherefore art thou and whatfore visa art thou upon? |
New Zealand, working holiday, there's a Chinese consulate in Christchurch, to Z or not to...... |
You can't get a work visa at the Christchurch consulate, only Wellington.
This may be related to the earthquake or not.
Some parts of the process involve couriered documents. Additionally, there could be a law enforcement check initiated from NZ to home country. Accordingly, I stick with my comment that to achieve a reasonable arrival date in China, visa issues come first and OP should go with the offer on hand.
For OP to go off on another path and come back to the offer may result in a 'sorry job taken' response. |
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