Job Discussion Forums

mk87 · Joined: 01 Apr 2013 Posts: 61

at that being a reason not to learn Vietnamese.

Anyway generally you are right. I mean the idea that in Vietnam a physical conflict is unavoidable is silly. Vietnamese people don't like to fight, they pretty much seem to avoid it at any costs - if they do fight they don't mess about, hence the weapons. Just ignore it - so what if some Vietnamese guy calls you dirty? I would have thought as teachers we could all agree that force is not the best way to educate people.

I'm With Stupid · Joined: 03 Sep 2010 Posts: 432

Yeah, I've never known anyone down in Saigon to get criticism for being with a Vietnamese woman. When I was in South Thailand, two women that we were sitting with got rude comments though. From the bar staff, no less.

I know someone who got started on by a group of men in the Mekong after they'd been in a nightclub, including the security staff. From his account it sounded like they basically wanted to show that they could beat up a foreigner. Obviously still too cowardly to attempt it in anything other than a big group though. But compared to back home, I'm far more relaxed around drunk people here. No-one going to start a fight with you for "looking at them funny" in Vietnam.

I'm With Stupid · Joined: 03 Sep 2010 Posts: 432

just noel · Joined: 17 Jul 2006 Posts: 168

mk87 · Joined: 01 Apr 2013 Posts: 61

Wow... anecdotal evidence is always a winner. I've never heard anyone called a *beep* in saigon, so it musnt happen.

Also, punching someone because they called your wife a *beep* is pretty stupid really. As you said, uneducated and poor - the people who most deserve physical justice

1st Sgt Welsh · Posted: Sat Dec 21, 2013 8:56 am Post subject:

mk87 · Joined: 01 Apr 2013 Posts: 61

Really? Instead of just thinking "oh that guy is a *beep*" and then getting on with your life. If you want to follow that logic I dont really think you can complain when they guy turns up with his friends or some form of weapon.

He's not just going to say "Oh fair play old chap...I see you stood up for your woman, lets go and have a tra da and forget the whole incident"

As I said I come from an area where violence isnt unusual when you are growing up, so its not something I'm scared of it but niether is it something that I think is a good idea, if you dont want to carry on problems. Vietnam is not like where I am from, people don't go out at the weekend and have a fight as entertainment, so IMO if you start a fight here you have to expect what is coming to you.

1st Sgt Welsh · Posted: Sat Dec 21, 2013 10:26 am Post subject:

Hi mk87,

In my view, the one who made the comment started the fight. If you are trying to go about your business and some anti-social douche bag, for whatever bizarre reason, makes a point of going out their way to insult your family then, as far as I'm concerned, they provoked it. Even the law in Western countries accepts this. If you are charged with battery, and you can make the case that the degree of provocation was such that a reasonable person would have reacted the way that you did then you'll walk. I think that's fair. That doesn't give you the right, of course, to beat someone within an inch of their life because they disagreed with you about the weather, but, calling your nearest-and-dearest a *beep* for no reason is a very different matter and, if you decided to punch another guy for that, then I honestly don't have a problem with it. In my view, I would consider it justified and understandable, but, that's not the same as saying it would always be sensible.

Indeed, if some husbands decided that it wasn't worth it and, in your words, got on with their life then I'd be OK with that too. I honestly don't know what I'd do in those circumstances as it has never happened to me, but, if and when it does, I'll have to make a judgement and I'm old enough and experienced enough to know that no good will come out of losing a fight, especially here. You mentioned weapons and I've spoken about that on this forum before:

http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=103480

I guess it comes down to where can you morally draw the line and raise your hands? On this question, everyone is going to have different moral thresholds and that's fine, but I think 'reasonableness' should be key. Crudely insulting your wife, in my view, crosses that line. A stranger walking up to and spitting in your face would cross that line. Some creep stalking your wife, girlfriend or daughter crosses that line and so does a lot of other things. Some jackass trying to cut-in at the queue at the Citimart, in my view, wouldn't. However, IMHO, the onus should be on the anti-social douche bag not to act like such an anti-social douche bag instead of expecting everyday people to practice high degrees of tolerance when experiencing their unwarranted abuse.

RustyShackleford · Joined: 13 May 2013 Posts: 449

I'm with Luke on this. Incidentally violence is something that shouldn't concern e average person here. That said, I have been involved only in two incidents: the first one involved another foreigner pulling a knife to my neck and threatening to kill me (the matter is resolved now and I will provide no further identifying details to not libel their name on a public forum). Another was when I directly prevented an angry Vietnamese man from whacking two women with a tire chain. He got quite angry at me as I started to film him with a crowd watching but I kept my distance and I made it out without a scratch.