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Fuzzy Lizard
Joined: 06 May 2014 Posts: 4
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Posted: Mon May 12, 2014 11:36 pm Post subject: Ideas on where girlfriend and I should teach our first year |
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Hi all,
As the topic says, my long time girlfriend and I recently earned our TEFL certifications, and I was hoping to get some firsthand advice about programs and locations that we should consider.
We have already applied to JET and EPiK. For JET, I made it to the alternate list, but was informed by my contact at the consulate that they got very few short listers this year, so it is very unlikely that I will be bumped up. I plan to reapply next year. As for EPiK, we are both waiting to hear back about our applications in the next week or so.
A bit of background info on us:
We both graduated with our B.S. in psychology, and just completed a graduate level TEFL course at our university. I had about 90 in class hours and 110 online, and she had a bit less in class but roughly the same.
We have both been working as substitute teachers in our local school district since September. We have also both been tutoring English language learners in writing for the past two semesters at the intensive English program that our university runs for international students who wish to attend university here.
In addition, I took a practicum class and taught a few classes at the intensive English program myself.
We are aware that it is unlikely we will be placed together, and we are open to either being a bit of a distance away, or having one of us get a job and the other move out to the same area to look for one.
With all that in mind, what are some good programs/locations for us to apply? We are thinking South Korea, Japan, China, Taiwan, etc., but we are very open to any and all suggestions.
Thanks for taking the time to read; I know I kind of gave you guys my life story. Looking forward to reading what everyone says!  |
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jtea
Joined: 22 Apr 2014 Posts: 69
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Posted: Tue May 13, 2014 12:07 am Post subject: |
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I would suggest you two look at which countries interest you and which cultures/languages you would be interested in learning about. Teaching English in a foreign country isn't all about being exotic and fun and if you're teaching in a country that you don't have much interest in, you'll quickly find yourself wanting to leave.
If you're not in an immediate hurry and you have the finances to do so, take a tour around Asia or any country you might be interested in. I always recommend visiting the country first before making the decision to move out.
Also, you two have a better chance of teaching together or near each other in lesser popular countries.
What do you look for in terms of getting out of teaching English in a foreign country? |
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Fuzzy Lizard
Joined: 06 May 2014 Posts: 4
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Posted: Tue May 13, 2014 12:28 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the reply jtea.
I think we both realize that it will not be all fun and games. I know that wherever we end up, we will be working a very difficult job that will require a lot of planning, dedication, and sacrifice. That being said, of course we would like to explore a bit and drink in the culture on some of our days off.
Honestly we don't know too much about many of the countries we are considering, which is why I'm here on the newbie forum. Would you say that blogs are good way for us to do some first hand research?
While we would both love the tour idea, financially I'm not sure we will be able to swing it. It's something we will have to look into, though.
When you say less popular countries, where exactly are you referring to?
In terms of what we want to get out of it, I think there are a few things. I have found that teaching is actually very enjoyable for me, so I would love to be able to engage the students and get them excited about learning English. We are also both very passionate about learning and trying new things. I think what it boils down to, is we want to affect a positive change in the students, and explore and learn from them and their culture at the same time. I think we would like to do this for several years, and eventually end up back in the states for grad school. If I like it enough, I may even pursue my MA in TESOL.
Thank you for being a realist and not hyping it up as the penultimate exciting career; I appreciate your post and your suggestions. Anything else you have to offer is more than welcomed. |
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nomad soul

Joined: 31 Jan 2010 Posts: 11454 Location: The real world
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Posted: Tue May 13, 2014 1:06 am Post subject: |
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Asia is where many newbies start, especially couples. I suggest you explore the various countries on the Asia forum for info. |
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jtea
Joined: 22 Apr 2014 Posts: 69
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Posted: Tue May 13, 2014 1:23 am Post subject: |
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Other people will be able to offer you better insight but here are my 2 cents.
Reading blogs and YouTube videos are a great way to see other people's experience living overseas but I would highly recommend you take everything with a grain of salt. Experiences vary on the person and people handle situations differently. That's one main reason why you'll see some people say great things about their teaching jobs and other people will tell you to stay far away. It's also why I suggest visiting a country yourself but I understand that's not always possible.
What type of exploration are you interested in? Landmarks? History? Nature? etc. With your current knowledge, what countries stand out to you and why? If you let us know your current thoughts on some of this I think it may be easier to help you.
My opinion about China might be too biased lol. I'm originally from China and have most of my family there so I've visited a few times throughout the decades. China, in my opinion, is a great country. It's got a really rich and fascinating history and you can explore it to no end. In terms of sightseeing, you can pretty much find it all in China whether it's city life, country life, mountains, rivers, etc. I personally can't get enough of the food. I've heard plenty of people say they cant get used to the taste of the food in China because they're used to the BS crap in the states (sorry but its true) so I'm not sure if the cuisine will be up your alley. However, there are a few things that keep me from returning to China. 1) Unfortunately, Chinese people aren't exactly the bestest and nicest people around. This is not to say that all of them are like that. You'll be in for a nice culture shock there. Don't bother holding doors open for people, don't bother letting people go in front of you. You'll never get on a bus or get a taxi that way. Any rude, dirty, etc habits you can think of? Chinese people will do it. On top of that, you won't have the freedom of the internet so if you're big into facebook, google, youtube, blogspot, etc like I am...no more of that. It's not too hard to hack around if you want to bother with it but you didn't hear that from me. In a nutshell, I definitely recommend China. You'll have a great time and there's so much to see and do. It's a great place, you just have to get used to the way of life. I could probably go on but again, my 2 cents.
In terms of jobs, I haven't looked into pay but I think average pay is around $1000 US? It's considered pretty good in China especially since a lot of places will cover your housing and plane tickets. In a country where you can eat a meal at the cost of a quarter, you'll be fine with that salary. Really the most expensive stuff in China is housing. Clothing can be expensive depending on where you choose to buy. Taxis are cheap, food is cheap, maids are cheap.
Taiwan was my backup plan. You still have your great food, great sightseeing, people are a little nicer, and the country is probably overall cleaner. There's still plenty to do and a lot of history/culture although not a s much as China for obvious reasons. You also don't have to deal with a wacky government. I can't tell you much about jobs in Taiwan since I never looked into them but you can skim through the ones available on Dave's ESL cafe to see how much you're paid and perks, and look into the cost of living. I know some jobs, if not most of them, will either provide you housing or subsidize it.
Japan is my country of choice, mostly because I've always loved Japanese culture, language, food, whatever since I guess middle school. Teaching English in Japan mostly falls into 3 categories: ALT (assistance language teacher) where you work alongside a Japanese teacher (this is what the JET program is), eikaiwa teaching where you work in English language schools and teach on your own mostly to a small group of students, or university teaching. Pay is decent, not incredibly high but if you can manage your money well, then you can still save a bit and travel. If you're wanting to pay off student loans I may not recommend Japan unless you're okay with teaching in more rural areas. The pay is sometimes better if not the same but cost of living is less. JET pays the best but your chance of being in a super rural town is high (but you'll save a ton of money) and the chances of you and your girlfriend being together or even remotely near each other is slim to none.
South Korea I don't know too much about. I know someone teaching currently in SK and she's having the time of her life but I think Korea has always been something she's interested in. I would like to visit Korea one of these days but I dont have any interest in living there or learning the language.
You'll get a lot better insight on what it's like to teach/live in each country by going to the specific job boards. |
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suphanburi
Joined: 20 Mar 2014 Posts: 916
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Posted: Tue May 13, 2014 2:09 am Post subject: |
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Op:
You didn't say what country your passports are from (it DOES make a difference when visas come into play). I assumed you are from the US and the reply is based on that assumption.
Korea is an OK start for newbies, especially working in the public school system. They cover pay, housing, airfare, medical, pension and a severance package. Most newbies manage to save about 1/2 of their salaries over a year ($12k per person is very achievable).
China is very much the "wild west" of the east. The cost of living (outside of places like Beijing and Shanghai or the Pearl River Delta) is pretty cheap, allowances are made for housing, airfare, meals, etc. While the salaries aren't as good as Korea the potential savings aren't far off and affordable travel is an option that doesn't exist in Korea.
Japan is nice but it is a tight job market to get into, especially for newbies.
The cost of living is also high so potential savings aren't what they were 10 or 15 years ago.
Taiwan is OK. Any work that you do find (assuming you don't have state licensure as a teacher (you did say you did sub work in schools) won't be in a public school. Language academies abound and the cost of living is OK (cheap compared to the States). At the end of the year the potential savings are comparable to Korea.
Thailand is a mecca for newbies. Salaries are LOW ($1200/mo range) but outside of Bangkok or the tourist areas (Pattaya, Phuket, etc) the cost of living is really low and two can comfortably live on one salary and save the other to send home. One of the great advantages of working in Thailand is the ability to travel throughout SE Asia on your breaks from work. It is a good gap-year experience.
Vietnam has potential. Low cost of living and wages comparable to Korea for anyone who can qualify for a Korean E2 visa. Again, ease of travel throughout Asia, decent savings and old cultures surround you. It is certainly a culture change.
If you are American then Central/South America are also options.
It has been a long time since I was last there but it is easy to get to, work to be had and plenty of adventure and/or ancient cultures to explore if that is your interest.
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Fuzzy Lizard
Joined: 06 May 2014 Posts: 4
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Posted: Thu May 15, 2014 4:13 pm Post subject: |
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Hi All, thanks for the replies; I'll try to address them all in my post. Sorry for the delay, the last few days have been a bit of a whirlwind. I recently found out that I was rejected from EPiK, which came as a shock to me. My application must have gone in too late, I'm thinking. So options are wide open as of now.
Suphaburi- Yes, our passports are American. My girlfriend is ethnically Vietnamese, but was born in the US. Do you think there's any danger of her being turned down for jobs or being prejudiced against because of this? As far as Thailand, I'm a bit worried about the political situation there. It looks like it could get pretty nasty. Do you think that is something that is likely to affect us if we took a job there? As for China, why do you say the travel is more affordable than Korea? Is there a better rail network? And I'm sure my girlfriend would love to return to Vietnam as well, but again I'm a bit worried about the recent political situation and the protests against China. Reading over my reply to you, it looks like I'm focusing on the negatives. I would love to teach in any of those countries, just unsure if political situations are likely to affect us as foreigners. As for South America, where did you end up? I hadn't really considered that yet but it sounds like a good idea to do so. Thanks so much for your input, I really appreciate it and hope to hear more.
jtea- I agree with what you say about taking people's experiences well-salted. I usually try to take an average of all the opinions I can find about certain places. As far as what our interests are, we really enjoy historical/cultural sites and national landmarks, as well as taking the occasional nature hike. Especially some sites that are off the beaten path. In my experience those are often the ones most worth visiting. Honestly I'm not too sure what exactly we are looking for country-wise, which is what led me to post the topic. I'm very confident that we could adapt to wherever we end up. We both also love trying new foods. There's really nothing we won't eat, and I'm actually very excited about trying all kinds of foods that are new to me. China does sound very intriguing. One of the big draws would be the size, variety, and history of the country. Japan was my first choice as well, but since we didn't get into JET, I think we may want to get a little bit of experience and save up a bit of money before we go to Japan. If the right job pops up though, we would definitely take it. Thanks for giving me your thoughts, I look forward to hearing back.
Nomad soul- Thanks for the post, I'm going to have to start reading up on all the forums. I need separate accounts to post, correct?
Thanks all, hope to hear back |
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jtea
Joined: 22 Apr 2014 Posts: 69
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Posted: Thu May 15, 2014 4:49 pm Post subject: |
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Fuzzy Lizard wrote: |
My girlfriend is ethnically Vietnamese, but was born in the US. Do you think there's any danger of her being turned down for jobs or being prejudiced against because of this? |
Possibly, but most likely not as much as you would think. I'm ethnically Chinese and wasn't even born in the US although I've lived here most of my life so I have no accent. I found a job a lot quicker than I estimated. It's just a matter of where you apply and what they look for. If they're adamant about having someone who looks western teach their students, then she's SOL but I don't think there are too many places like that.
Fuzzy Lizard wrote: |
jtea- I agree with what you say about taking people's experiences well-salted. I usually try to take an average of all the opinions I can find about certain places. As far as what our interests are, we really enjoy historical/cultural sites and national landmarks, as well as taking the occasional nature hike. Especially some sites that are off the beaten path. In my experience those are often the ones most worth visiting. Honestly I'm not too sure what exactly we are looking for country-wise, which is what led me to post the topic. I'm very confident that we could adapt to wherever we end up. We both also love trying new foods. There's really nothing we won't eat, and I'm actually very excited about trying all kinds of foods that are new to me. China does sound very intriguing. One of the big draws would be the size, variety, and history of the country. Japan was my first choice as well, but since we didn't get into JET, I think we may want to get a little bit of experience and save up a bit of money before we go to Japan. If the right job pops up though, we would definitely take it. Thanks for giving me your thoughts, I look forward to hearing back. |
If that's the case then anywhere in Asia would most likely suit you two. It's just a matter of where you want to start. If Japan is still where you want to go, I wouldn't let not getting in JET set you back. No one really knows what JET looks for and experience definitely has nothing to do with it. If you ask me, it may be better for you to not have gotten into JET. Outside of the higher pay for easier work and the fact that everything is set up for you, JET really isn't the best. |
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nomad soul

Joined: 31 Jan 2010 Posts: 11454 Location: The real world
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Posted: Thu May 15, 2014 5:34 pm Post subject: |
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Fuzzy Lizard wrote: |
I'm going to have to start reading up on all the forums. I need separate accounts to post, correct? |
Nope, separate accounts aren't needed. The exception is the Korea forum (http://forums.eslcafe.com/korea/). |
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Sashadroogie

Joined: 17 Apr 2007 Posts: 11061 Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise
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Posted: Thu May 15, 2014 7:12 pm Post subject: |
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Come to Russia! |
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suphanburi
Joined: 20 Mar 2014 Posts: 916
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Posted: Thu May 15, 2014 10:09 pm Post subject: |
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Fuzzy Lizard wrote: |
Suphaburi- Yes, our passports are American. My girlfriend is ethnically Vietnamese, but was born in the US. Do you think there's any danger of her being turned down for jobs or being prejudiced against because of this? As far as Thailand, I'm a bit worried about the political situation there. It looks like it could get pretty nasty. Do you think that is something that is likely to affect us if we took a job there? As for China, why do you say the travel is more affordable than Korea? Is there a better rail network? And I'm sure my girlfriend would love to return to Vietnam as well, but again I'm a bit worried about the recent political situation and the protests against China. Reading over my reply to you, it looks like I'm focusing on the negatives. I would love to teach in any of those countries, just unsure if political situations are likely to affect us as foreigners. As for South America, where did you end up? I hadn't really considered that yet but it sounds like a good idea to do so. Thanks so much for your input, I really appreciate it and hope to hear more. |
If her passport, place of birth and education are American then she is American and NOT Vietnamese-American.
Politics are always an issue when working abroad.
Politics in Thailand are NOT what you would think based on CNN. Move 200 yards away from a protest site and you'd never know there was turmoil in Thailand (not that it is a new thing... been happening since 2004).
Travel from anywhere on the mainland (China or SE Asia) is cheaper than from Korea or Japan. Korea is isolated (landlocked by the north) and the only way in or out is to fly. Japan is an archipelago so again, flying is the only option.
Vietnam isn't an issue (she is ethnically Vietnamese and not Chinese).
Just stay away from Chinese staffed factories or the border region.
For work in China, read the china boards but mostly, look for a recruiter, find a school, get your visa and fly.
For the rest of SE Asia, fly in as a tourist, get a job, get a visa and go to work.
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nomad soul

Joined: 31 Jan 2010 Posts: 11454 Location: The real world
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Posted: Thu May 15, 2014 10:47 pm Post subject: |
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Sashadroogie wrote: |
Come to Russia! |
And Sasha will be at the airport welcoming the two of you with a big cheesy grin, a bouquet of flowers, chocolate-covered strawberries, and a bottle of _____.  |
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Sashadroogie

Joined: 17 Apr 2007 Posts: 11061 Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise
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Posted: Thu May 15, 2014 10:49 pm Post subject: |
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You are welcome too, Nomad Soul!
Plenty of vodka for everyone!!! |
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Prof.Gringo

Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 2236 Location: Dang Cong San Viet Nam Quang Vinh Muon Nam!
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Posted: Fri May 16, 2014 4:09 am Post subject: |
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Fuzzy Lizard wrote: |
Hi All, thanks for the replies; I'll try to address them all in my post. Sorry for the delay, the last few days have been a bit of a whirlwind. I recently found out that I was rejected from EPiK, which came as a shock to me. My application must have gone in too late, I'm thinking. So options are wide open as of now.
Suphaburi- Yes, our passports are American. My girlfriend is ethnically Vietnamese, but was born in the US. Do you think there's any danger of her being turned down for jobs or being prejudiced against because of this? As far as Thailand, I'm a bit worried about the political situation there. It looks like it could get pretty nasty. Do you think that is something that is likely to affect us if we took a job there? As for China, why do you say the travel is more affordable than Korea? Is there a better rail network? And I'm sure my girlfriend would love to return to Vietnam as well, but again I'm a bit worried about the recent political situation and the protests against China. Reading over my reply to you, it looks like I'm focusing on the negatives. I would love to teach in any of those countries, just unsure if political situations are likely to affect us as foreigners. As for South America, where did you end up? I hadn't really considered that yet but it sounds like a good idea to do so. Thanks so much for your input, I really appreciate it and hope to hear more.
jtea- I agree with what you say about taking people's experiences well-salted. I usually try to take an average of all the opinions I can find about certain places. As far as what our interests are, we really enjoy historical/cultural sites and national landmarks, as well as taking the occasional nature hike. Especially some sites that are off the beaten path. In my experience those are often the ones most worth visiting. Honestly I'm not too sure what exactly we are looking for country-wise, which is what led me to post the topic. I'm very confident that we could adapt to wherever we end up. We both also love trying new foods. There's really nothing we won't eat, and I'm actually very excited about trying all kinds of foods that are new to me. China does sound very intriguing. One of the big draws would be the size, variety, and history of the country. Japan was my first choice as well, but since we didn't get into JET, I think we may want to get a little bit of experience and save up a bit of money before we go to Japan. If the right job pops up though, we would definitely take it. Thanks for giving me your thoughts, I look forward to hearing back.
Nomad soul- Thanks for the post, I'm going to have to start reading up on all the forums. I need separate accounts to post, correct?
Thanks all, hope to hear back |
If your g/f speaks VNese that is a huge plus in VN for living and work.
Instability in VN??? Are you serious? if there were prostests, etc against CHINA it's because the VNese govt. gave a GREEN light to those protests.
On the other hand, there IS a lot of discrimination against Viet Kieu in VN, both in regards to jobs offered and mostly, a lower salary.
Thailand is far more unstable than VN. You basing this off what, a report in the news? Well, take a look at Thailand and all the BS there for the last few years.
Thailand never impressed me, low wages, long hours. Ditto Cambo.
China is a good deal, esp. for a new TEFL'er.
EF China has some great packages including a 2 year development contract so you can get a DipTESOL paid for.
All of Latin America is an option as well.
And don't be surprised if you break-up after a while, TEFL'ing has a way of doing that  |
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Fuzzy Lizard
Joined: 06 May 2014 Posts: 4
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Posted: Sat May 17, 2014 12:56 am Post subject: |
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jtea- In light of what you've said I think we might start looking into Japan and China pretty closely. Korea is still an option too. I had hear that some schools wanted teachers who looked western, but wasn't sure if that was largely the case or not. Good to know. Also yeah maybe it is good that we didn't get into JET. Gives us more flexibility at least. Thanks for the input.
Sasha and Nomad- I can't wait for our Russia Party! Are chocolate strawberries and vodka a good combo? In all seriousness, is Russia somewhere worth considering?
suphanburi- It looks like we'll be looking more into China and SE then, probably. We would like to be able to travel somewhat cheaply during time off. For China, why exactly do you say it's better to go through a recruiter? Is it harder to get a visa on your own? Haha seems a bit daunting to fly in and then look for a job but iI'v eheard that from a few people. Thanks.
Prof.Gringo- To be honest I' m not too plugged in to what's going on in VN, aside from a few news stories I've read. most of what I get is from my GF's mom who always says that it's not a good time to visit. She's understandably biased because she was imprisoned by the gov't for a few years back in the day. Sounds like we might have better access to jobs but she might get lower wages in VN? And yeah I haven't looked too much into Thailand either, just some light reading on news sites. EF is Education First in China? We'll have to start looking into Latin America too. Haha yeah hopefully we'll make it through in one piece!
Thanks for the replies all; I really appreciate the input. Looking forward to more.
P.S.- To quote, do i just copy and past the text between the bracketed quote command?
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