Job Discussion Forums

[johnslat]

Dear greyskies,

"And why can't such students be taught syntax, spelling, punctuation, capitalization, etc. concurrently with principles of academic writing?"

They must be amazing students. I've been teaching academic writing for about a dozen years now, but I wouldn't try teaching, say, the use and misuse of commas simultaneously with APA format and citations to beginners in my writing classes. My opinion is that academic writing requires a gradual logical sequence in curriculum planning.

But if your method works for your students, that's great. Wish I had such fantastic learners.

Regards.
John

[Rostom]

[grayskies]

Dear John,

You taught 19 years at the Institute of Public Administration (IPA). It is a government institution in Riyadh which focuses on ESP for medical and business oriented students.

I was not aware they taught academic writing.

[Muhammed Abbas Khan]

How would one go about using a western construct of writing for academic purposes if the resources, namely physical copies of books, are not available?
There is of course the option (if available through one's institution) that relavant books and peer reviewed articles could be accessed online. Although this is not perhaps true for all subjects and disciplines where there may be a dearth of online material. So, in terms of the practicalities of referencing, is it possible for students from KSA to access books and digital material?
Thanks,
Abbas

[johnslat]

Dear Rostom

How/Why did this question:

"Do you think that being a non-native speaker makes success in teaching Academic Writing more likely?"

provoke this response:

"Do you think the English language is the property of native speakers by virtue of their cultural affiliation?
Don't you think that English is an international language, and other people (non-natives) own it?

What do you think about eminent and modern novelists like Nabokov and Soyinka who are non-native speakers of English and writing in English?

Rostom (The non-native speaker Laughing)"

That strikes me a just a bit defensive.

Dear greyskies,

As you may have noticed, I'm not at the IPA now. I've been teaching an Academic Reading and Writing course that I created (and to answer Muhammed Abbas Khan question, I don't use textbooks) called Transitions at Santa Fe Community College since I came back.

Regards,
John

[grayskies]

Hi Abbas,

I learned how to teach academic writing while on the job!

My curriculum coordinator was wonderful. He came to my
classroom before class and demonstrated what needed to
be taught. He did this for a week, until I understood what
needed to be taught (learning outcomes according to the
coordinator-Scott).

I ran to him for all my questions, and I had plenty. None
of the instructors were accustomed to teaching Academic
English. We were all trained-on the job.

To answer your question, the books we used can be
purchased in Riyadh ie: Azar's grammar series, Academic
Writing, 10 Steps to Academic Reading, etc.

We also found books that we used to demonstrate various
rhetorical styles including: Corroboration/Refutation, Synthesis,
Extension/Expansion, even a Literary Analysis Essay.

Mind you, we used these books back in 2007. This is when
our IEP department adopted an academic approach to keep
up with the international arena.

[Muhammed Abbas Khan]

Dear Grayskies,

Thank you for your prompt and rather candid response. Let me rephrase my initial question with regard to the viability of academic writing in KSA. An integral part of academic writing in the western context requires one to reference using peer reviewed articles or published literature of a similar standing. The question is how readily available and accessible is such material to the average Saudi student? So you would expect that an English language or linguistic's student would have access to a set of core books on a reading list for modules such as 'dialects in the British Isles' or 'English as a lingua franca'.

[grayskies]

We did not use peer review research.

Keep in mind, this is an IEP unit. We had APA/MLA
reference books. The APA handbook is available in
Riyadh.

Many of my colleagues had their own reference books.
Our coordinator used an essay from one of his personal
books and used it to model many of the essays from.

The coordinator researched and created material for
the students. At the time, we used the ...Academic Writing
textbook (available in Riyadh).

These books (APA Handbook & Academic Writing) can be purchased
for your bookstore with the university, or you can have the
students purchase it from Jahrir Bookstore.

I cannot stress the intelligence and determination held by
both the director and curriculum coordinator. Without them,
the IEP department would be in shambles.

[johnslat]

Dear Rostom,

In addition, I surprised that you, as a non-native speaker, were not more perturbed at the response I got - rather than the question (which, in fact, implied a bias towards non-native speakers.)

"If I were a director, I would not hire non-natives in an IEP unit.

If an American curriculum was in place, then I would try to
hire as many Americans who are suited for the job and
willing to learn.

The same principle goes for a British curriculum, etc."

Regards,
John

[grayskies]

Abbas,

I would like to add, our coordinator would choose
a topic for the corroboration/refutation essay.

We (instructors) in turn, gave the topic to the
students, and they would find supporting evidence
to corroborate and refute the thesis statement and
specific quotes from an article that students had
to research.

Our classrooms were equipped with computers built
into tables for 20 students.

Students also found similar topics to create their
essays. I sat with each and every student to
assist them in their writing skills.

We also had a Writing Center that proved invaluable.
The under-grads who worked there were also trained
by our coordinators to help our students.

[johnslat]

Dear Muhammed Abbas Khan,

Would you like some Academic Writing and Reading materials. PM me if so.

Regards.
John

[nomad soul]

[grayskies]

@Nomad Soul:

The IEP unit is in one of the most prestigious
universities in the Gulf. I was privileged to
work there.

[nomad soul]

[johnslat]

Dear greyskies,

Would this be it? (You don't have to answer - you can just nod yes or no)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Princess_Nora_bint_Abdul_Rahman_University

Regards,
John