Job Discussion Forums

[Trebek]

I've been talking with people from "AHEN" or (Australian Higher Education
Network). Here is what one of their recruiters says about their organization:

"AHEN runs and manages more than 10 Sino-Australia programs in
different cities in China , and all the programs
are cooperating with Chinese public universities and
colleges.The students will go to Australia for
further education after two years' study in China
. We are not ordinary intermediary you usually contact and not searching
teachers for universities which give us commission, what we do
is recruiting our own teachers and dispatching them to
our cooperative universities all around China"

Just a fancy name for a recruiter right?
They did send me an offer for "Guangdong Industry Technical College" which is in a district of "Foshan" called "Nanhai".

Is anyone familiar with the "AHEN" program or this university???

[Shroob]

I contacted the AHEN organisation when I was looking for work. The number of hours required put me off, from memory I think it was 25 teaching hours a week (plus office hours), for 12,000/month. I could be wrong, it was a while ago.

[Bud Powell]

Just a fancy name for a recruiter right?

Not necessarily. Several Chinese universities have turned over part or all of their English Language studies over to Canadian and Australian companies. Some just operate language and writing centers within the universities while others administer half or all of the English language program.

I've never worked for one, but a contact I've seen leads me to believe that they have a set program and tend to work the teachers pretty hard (20 hours) for mediocre pay.

They could use a little remedial English themselves.

Reason for edit: change of wording to " a contact I've seen"...

[Simon in Suzhou]

Just a heads up, these kinds of programs are becoming common at universities across China: students study for a couple years here prepping to go abroad.

THESE ARE THE DREGS OF UNIVERSITY STUDENTS! AVOID! AVOID! AVOID!

Essentially these are spoiled rich kids who didn't have a gaokao score high enough to actually get into this chinese university. But always looking for a money-making opportunity, the university decides to set up a "special program" and charges these laziest of students double or even triple the normal tuition so that these kids can be prepared to "study abroad." The rich parents see this as a great face-saving option- "Hey my stupid, spoiled brat is going to study abroad (rather than go to some 3rd tier, shameful public university)!" Most of the students don't want to be in your class (or even studying AT ALL), it is simply mom and dad's plan for their disappointing child.

Most of these kids will NEVER study abroad, as they are so lazy and/or academically challenged that they cannot string more than 3 English words together. Yet the university will make all sorts of grandiose promises to the parents ("In just 2 years your son can score a 7 on his IELTS exam and study in England/America/Australia! No problem!"). Of course, when said student eventually scores a 2 or 3 on his IELTS after two years of study, the same university administrators will turn and blame the "highly paid" foreign teacher.

Some of the chinese universities have agreements with very low quality institutions in the Americas or Australia that guarantee placement of these students (i.e. normal IELTS qualifications unnecessary). But that does not mean they will be any better to deal with in the classroom here.

I have worked at 3 universities in China that have started programs like these. All are almost identical, and all are TERRIBLE. It is just a money-making scheme preying on rich, arrogant people. The reason these kids are in this program is because they coudn't even qualify to attend this public chinese university! I can't emphasize this enough! The frustrations are not worth it.

[wangdaning]

[Shanghai Noon]

Simon in Suzhou is absolutely right. These schools are good if you want to make some money and maybe gain experience as a subject teacher; nothing more. While the Gaokao may be flawed, the overwhelming majority of students at these "schools" simply don't have the aptitude to score highly on any exam whatsoever. I just finished a contract at one such institution and swore off them for life. Then, another one offered me 18,000 per month plus accommodation and I guess I was enough of a prostitute to take it

Trebek: If you take the job, make sure you get at least 14,000 per month plus accommodation for ESL teaching. For subject teaching, ask for more, because it's grueling trying to teach chemistry to students who barely know their ABCs. If they insist on putting "ESL teacher" in your contract, maybe you can negotiate a higher rate for subject teaching. That way, you can be compensated appropriately for the possible situation in which you turn up for what you think is a typical ESL job only to be handed an Economics textbook and simply told "Classes start tomorrow."

[Trebek]

Excellent advice as usual! I just got a part time job at an International school in my neighborhood so I'm done with this year's job search. Good to know about programs like AHEN and others like it.

[wangdaning]

One of the biggest problems with Simon's post is the claim that these schools can run under a Chinese public university and charge more. If that is happening, it means they are illegal. Or the local education bureau...Not impossible, but I think people are talking two ways.

The schools are horrible and steal from the students who are bad and rich and spoiled. Then, to keep this from happening you should demand more of their money. You are going down the same road, yet everyone but you is evil for doing it.

[Trebek]

Yes I agree Wang, If the whole system is corrupt and if I play a key role in the action but not take home my fair share of pay.... This would be a damned shame indeed!

The good thing about this program is that there really aren't any victims (except us low paid teachers), but the lazy students save face, their parents do as well, some overseas crap school makes a bundle, the occasional student gets serious and transfers to a better school. Only the teacher is getting screwed...

Teachers of the world unite!

[Bud Powell]

I don't think that all of the schools in question that employ a native English-speaking second party to take over part of the English Language Departments are necessarily bad schools, nor do I believe that they ALL exist to whitewash student grades. There's an Australian school called New England University that (last time I checked) was in negotiation with a former employer to establish a program in the English department. I taught first, second and third year English majors whose fluency approached native ability. This was a lower second-tier university located in a cow town by most FT's criteria, but these kids were wonderful speakers. They certainly didn't need to have their records whitewashed.

Sometimes universities see their limitations and reach out to western schools for help. It's one way to improve a department, but I can see many drawbacks to such a method.

To the OP: I wouldn't touch such a school that required 20 hours for less than 10- 12,000 rmb per month plus free private accommodations. The school would also have to provide good, well-written, and well-conceived textbooks with a teacher's manual.

[Simon in Suzhou]

[roadwalker]

My last school, a public university charged 3 or 4 times the regular tuition fee for the 'international' program' wherein the students would go their final (4th) year abroad to finish their degree. As far as I know, this is all above board. These students did not gain or would not have gained admission under the regular rules. Public universities are under a lot of financial pressure and this is a typical method for trying to increase revenue without increasing general tuition fees.

At that school I had a few of these classes. One was horrible: the students were mostly IT majors and wouldn't or couldn't communicate. The others were business majors and for the most part at least tried. I usually felt exhausted after teaching the former but I wouldn't call it a nightmare scenario. If all my classes were like that one, though, I'd definitely expect a higher salary.

[Shroob]

Reading the replies on this thread has left me feeling conflicted.

My most recent job was in the UK teaching international, predominantly, Chinese students (15/20). I have to say it was an absolute pleasure, I got on well with the students, they were engaged, OK a few weary eyes at 9am but nothing major. I'm still in the city were I worked and still see some of the students around town, they're more than pleasant people.

I also taught on a pre-sessional before that and had one class that was 100% Chinese, for the most part they were fine. A few entitled attitudes here and there, but mostly good.

In China I taught 'regular' and 'pay more' students. The regular students were by far the best students I've ever taught. I mean attitude wise not English ability. Though the 'paying more' student classes were a drag at first as it took a while to get through to them. But when I did it went fine.

So if you do end up at a 2+2 or 'international' school, don't write them off just yet. I'm not disputing there aren't awful classes out there, stereotypes exist for a reason, rightly or wrongly, just that you may be pleasantly surprised if you do teach this sort of class.