Job Discussion Forums

[RustyShackleford]

Hi everyone,

I've just been thinking about this. I'm currently in Vietnam and have been teaching English for six years total now (five in Japan, just finished my first year in Vietnam). I have only an online TEFL from ITTT but have made the decision to go to Spain for an MA in Teaching.

Now, my question is how much DOES the Japanese English teaching job market expand with an MA instead of a BA? Would a CELTA be something I should consider investing or would it just be window dressing (Japan never seemed too concerned with this but everywhere else around seems to strongly prefer one so the question linger on my mind.)

[fluffyhamster]

Hi Rusty. Unfortunately I have no idea if hiring committees (i.e. beyond the entry level and demanding an MA) can or will overlook the lack of a BA (I'd imagine there'd be no shortage of candidates with both first and second degrees and perhaps even PhDs and/or quite a few published papers). Looking to the long term, getting a BA first would help you continue working in ELT beyond Japan, and outside Japan may be where the addition of a CELTA might come in too.

I see you've posted something similar in the Japan forum, but neglected to mention the lack of a first degree. It might help responses there if you included this information.

Can I ask how you got onto JET without a BA? (Hope you don't mind me asking, just curious).

I've posted this down in the Japan forum too ( http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?p=1165003#1165003 ), so I guess you can answer in either or both threads.

[RustyShackleford]

Oh frak! I didn't realize I actually posted that bloody thing. Thanks for pointing that out. I'll keep both up for the time because perhaps the General people can point out something I don't know.

I thought mentioning JET would make it clear that I did indeed have a BA. I meant to say "instead of <b>just a</b> BA." To be honest, I didn't even know it would be possible to get a BA without an MA! (Not that I'd trade those years for anything outside of a golden rocket house)

[fluffyhamster]

Oh, I see! Sorry for the misreading LOL (it wasn't just the 'MA instead of a BA' part, but also the 'I have only an online TEFL from ITTT'). It's just there have been a number of queries over the years from people who've been hoping an MA could replace a BA for work visa purposes wherever.

I'd say go for the MA, especially as you seem leery of further AET or even eikaiwa work after JET. Just be prepared for the fact that an MA may be only a starting foot in the door for securing university work in Japan.

[Shroob]

Pocket sand!

But on topic - Japan's a notoriously hard nut to crack. Most job adverts I've seen (I prefer university level work) require at least an MA. I've seen none that ask for a CELTA, but I haven't really looked into it deeply, just skimmed a few adverts. I'm not saying the CELTA is not worthwhile (though others will :rolleyes:) just it's not that recognised in Japan.

Ideally your MA would offer teaching practice.

[fluffyhamster]

Haha, pocket sand indeed!

[RustyShackleford]

Sh-sh-shaaaaa!

My MA does offer teaching practice and is accredited by some legitimate-enough American institution whose name escapes me at the moment, so there's that.

I am aware that Japan is a tough nugget, but I have experience with the country and speak/read the language to a degree where I feel I have at least an edge over some other candidates. (Although yeah, I realize that the Japanese-capable expat teacher is no longer as rare a bird as it was)

[fluffyhamster]

Hey Rusty, in the Japan forum duplicate thread you mention that it's a presumably general "Masters degree in Teaching with a practical teaching component". You might want to check some of the J uni job ads to see if they usually require a specific type of MA (in TESOL, TESL, TEFL, Applied Linguistics, these sorts of areas) or not. I can't recall offhand. Again, apologies if I've misread or assumed anything.

[RustyShackleford]

Thank you fluffyhamster for the great advice both here and on the other thread. You come across as someone who's kept their head on straight through most of this ESL game that destroys so many and I appreciate your insight.

I have my own observations on seeing directly the methodologies employed by Vietnamese and those employed by Japanese. The CELTA ideals may well be flawed but they're a sight stronger than the constant "on-rails" feeling of the Japanese classroom. I need more hard-core research and training to know if I'm on to anything insightful, however.

The MA is specifically labeled as one for Teaching, not Applied Linguistics or anything more specific I'm afraid. The program seems to be designed so it can be played in any of those directions but not specifically enough to be targeting them. I dunno. I apologize for any ambiguity here as I am writing quite fast and will be more than happy to clarify anything else being misunderstood.

[fluffyhamster]

Heh, thanks, and you're welcome!

Sure, anyone who's seen more than a few average Japanese high school lessons will have come to the same conclusion, that they're pretty weak on all manner of things (countless threads attest to this, just do a search for JTE LOL). I'm not sure one actually has to then do a CELTA though to see where CLT (it's a very broad term, and I'm a fan of the approach(-level thinking)) in general is coming from or can offer in comparison. For example, there are certainly a lot of good ELT reference books (dictionaries, grammars, lexicogrammars) around nowadays!

Just thought of another quite interesting thread (esp. as fairly large classes may be inescapable in schools and colleges, particularly in Asia):
http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=104062
.

[rtm]