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RustyShackleford
Joined: 13 May 2013
Posts: 449
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 Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 5:22 am Post subject: Enrolled in MA No CELTA but online TEFL cert w/ exp = No Go? |
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Hi,
I apologize if you get a glut of these types of messages and I do see people mentioning that online certs are often non-starters.
However, I will have seven years experience in ESL with an MA in Teaching (Not TESOL but Teaching nonetheless) by next summer and I was thinking of heading to the ME to look for the better salaries offered there.
Wondering if my online TEFL cert would nullify any other qualifications and if I should just take the time (and money....sigh) to do the CELTA. I don't think I'm "above" it, but I'd rather not invest yet more money if it isn't absolutely necessary. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 5:56 am Post subject: |
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Yep, much of this region doesn't like online anything. That said, your major will still matter. Saying you simply have a MAT isn't enough and will likely confuse employers. And as I recall, you're getting your degree from a Spanish university. What courses does your program include? I ask because I too have a MAT (from the US) but with a focus on TEFL, which required a semester-long ESOL practicum. Since you're still in your grad program, why not add a practical component in ESOL? Otherwise, get a CELTA, SIT TESOL, Trinity CertTESOL, or better yet, a PCELT. A Delta would especially do you well, if you're up for it.
By the way, in addition to a rather generic degree from a non-Anglophone uni, so far, all of your experience was prior to the MA. If you expect to compete for the better jobs in this region (right now, KSA seems like your only bet), then you'll need to beef up your qualifications and experience.
Last edited by nomad soul on Tue Oct 21, 2014 6:02 am; edited 1 time in total |
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MuscatGary
Joined: 03 Jun 2013
Posts: 1364
Location: Flying around the ME...
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| Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 6:00 am Post subject: |
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| You could try Oman. The money isn't as good as KSA but the lifestyle is infinitely better. They're desperate right now for teachers for the Colleges of Higher Technology, seven weeks into the semester and still very short of teachers. |
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Voyeur
Joined: 03 Jul 2012
Posts: 431
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| Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 10:29 am Post subject: |
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| If you get a residential MA TESOL, is having an unrelated BA still a major and permanent strike against you? Updating one's BA to an English major is often more time consuming and expensive than getting the MA. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 10:45 am Post subject: |
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| Voyeur wrote: |
| If you get a residential MA TESOL, is having an unrelated BA still a major and permanent strike against you? Updating one's BA to an English major is often more time consuming and expensive than getting the MA. |
An unrelated BA is not an issue for the majority of university employers in the Gulf; they're more interested in your highest, relevant academic credential (generally, an MA) and years of post-degree teaching experience. |
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Voyeur
Joined: 03 Jul 2012
Posts: 431
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| Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 12:50 pm Post subject: |
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| What kind of post-degree teaching experience satisfies them? |
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RustyShackleford
Joined: 13 May 2013
Posts: 449
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| Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 1:04 pm Post subject: |
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| nomad soul wrote: |
| Yep, much of this region doesn't like online anything. That said, your major will still matter. Saying you simply have a MAT isn't enough and will likely confuse employers. And as I recall, you're getting your degree from a Spanish university. What courses does your program include? I ask because I too have a MAT (from the US) but with a focus on TEFL, which required a semester-long ESOL practicum. Since you're still in your grad program, why not add a practical component in ESOL? |
My grad program actually involves me be actively going to a local school as an assistant English teacher and doing a research paper. I don't know if I could have this transfer but I will inquire to the academic coordinator. And why not, the answer would be simply that, as far as I know, the program is a "set course" in a one-size fits all capacity. Classes are conducted at an intensive level only once a week with assignments/tests to demonstrate competence.
| Quote: |
| By the way, in addition to a rather generic degree from a non-Anglophone uni, so far, all of your experience was prior to the MA. If you expect to compete for the better jobs in this region (right now, KSA seems like your only bet), then you'll need to beef up your qualifications and experience. |
I figure that this would be case. I suppose that having that experience be with internationally recognizes programs/schools couldn't be made to mean too much more to bureaucrats eh. Funny enough, I have been betting on KSA out of all the areas.
Oman might be okay too I guess but, actually, I have very little interest at the moment in lifestyle. The current plan is to just save up as much cash as I can and go back to (South)East Asia.
And thank you everybody, by the way, for fielding my query. |
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coder
Joined: 12 Jun 2014
Posts: 94
Location: USA
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| Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 2:57 pm Post subject: |
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delete
Last edited by coder on Fri Oct 31, 2014 6:05 am; edited 1 time in total |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 6:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Voyeur wrote: |
| What kind of post-degree teaching experience satisfies them? |
Since the majority of TEFL jobs in the Gulf are in universities, relevant experience generally means tertiary level and is typically stated in a job posting as a requirement or employer preference. Therefore, if your experience has been in teaching a mix of ages in language schools or strictly children, your CV may not get a second look, especially if you're applying for the more desirable, top-paying positions in the region. Of course, Saudi employers would be interested in you, but they're not likely to be the Kingdom's better (direct-hire) employers.
By the way, keep in mind many employers in this region require job candidates provide signed employment verification letters or certificates of employment from each previous place of employment. In addition to verifying prior teaching experience, these documents are also used to calculate salary. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2014 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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| RustyShackleford wrote: |
| My grad program actually involves me be actively going to a local school as an assistant English teacher and doing a research paper. I don't know if I could have this transfer but I will inquire to the academic coordinator. And why not, the answer would be simply that, as far as I know, the program is a "set course" in a one-size fits all capacity. |
Without knowing what types of courses this MAT consists of, I'm not sure what you mean by a set, one-size-fits-all program. What teaching situation is this program designed for? By the way, a solid practicum in a grad-level degree program basically entails supervised and observed teaching practice with real students, writing lesson and unit plans and creating materials, observing other teachers, creating a teaching portfolio (mine was about 60 pages), writing reflections on his/her teaching, and so on.
| and wrote: |
| I suppose that having that experience be with internationally recognizes programs/schools couldn't be made to mean too much more to bureaucrats eh. |
It's not about bureaucracy or having work experience from programs and schools that are "internationally recognized" (whatever that means). Employers in this region generally expect job applicants to have experience that matches both the type and level of position they're applying for. For example, an applicant with Chinese university teaching experience emphasizing conversation English isn't going to spark the interest of university employers requiring/preferring experience in EAP. |
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Voyeur
Joined: 03 Jul 2012
Posts: 431
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| Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2014 8:39 am Post subject: |
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| nomad soul wrote: |
| Voyeur wrote: |
| What kind of post-degree teaching experience satisfies them? |
Since the majority of TEFL jobs in the Gulf are in universities, relevant experience generally means tertiary level and is typically stated in a job posting as a requirement or employer preference. Therefore, if your experience has been in teaching a mix of ages in language schools or strictly children, your CV may not get a second look, especially if you're applying for the more desirable, top-paying positions in the region. Of course, Saudi employers would be interested in you, but they're not likely to be the Kingdom's better (direct-hire) employers.
By the way, keep in mind many employers in this region require job candidates provide signed employment verification letters or certificates of employment from each previous place of employment. In addition to verifying prior teaching experience, these documents are also used to calculate salary. |
Thanks. So it's messy, but once you have your MA you can work your way up to better jobs, even doing that work in the ME. That is to say, you can get lower paying Uni jobs or other relevant experience in the ME so that in time you access the better jobs. I imagine that what they ideally want is someone who has gotten their MA, and then taught TESOL at decent, accredited universities in English-speaking countries like the US and Canada. They aren't going to look too kindly at Uni. experience in say China or Korea, even if documented. But one way or another, you can get there--it's not, however, a matter of getting your MA and then rolling into 60K+ a year jobs right away. You must find a way to pay your dues.
Heh, if was easy, everyone would do it. And ME salaries wouldn't be so high.
Just my own deductions from your post--if I got anything wrong, please let me know. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2014 9:57 am Post subject: |
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| Voyeur wrote: |
| I imagine that what they ideally want is someone who has gotten their MA, and then taught TESOL at decent, accredited universities in English-speaking countries like the US and Canada. They aren't going to look too kindly at Uni. experience in say China or Korea, even if documented. But one way or another, you can get there--it's not, however, a matter of getting your MA and then rolling into 60K+ a year jobs right away. You must find a way to pay your dues. |
Not exactly. Be aware there are many nationals as well as expats from non-Anglophone countries teaching in Gulf university English foundation year programs alongside Americans, Brits, Canadians, etc. Obviously, they certainly don't have teaching experience from the US or UK, yet they still possess the requisite academic credentials and level/type of teaching experience.
As a guide, here are samples of qualifications from a few university employers' job ads (from previous years):
| Quote: |
ACADEMIC QUALIFICATIONS
• A Master's Degree in TEFL/TESL
SKILLS AND EXPERIENCE
• A minimum of 3 years teaching English (preferably at a tertiary level)
• Must be able to provide instruction at various levels within the program areas
• Experience in developing course curriculum as per accreditation and international standards
• A high degree of computer literacy and demonstrated ability to integrate technology into the learning environment and teaching methodology
• Current knowledge of contemporary teaching practices and computer assisted learning in the area of English as a Foreign Language and English for Specific Purposes.
• Evidence of a personal professional development plan with membership to an internationally recognized professional association being preferred
• Overseas teaching/training experience to non-native English speakers is desirable |
And another from a private university...
| Quote: |
Education / Job Requirements:
• MA in TESOL or closely related field and BA/BS in English, TESL/TEFL, linguistics, applied linguistics, or related field.
• A recognized and appropriate TESL/TEFL teaching qualification (teaching practicum).
• Excellent communication skills, the ability to work as a team member; flexibility and versatility; awareness of and sensitivity to linguistic and cultural diversity; appropriate IT competence.
• A minimum of two (2) years TESOL experience teaching adult EAP students, preferably in the Middle East at the university level.
• Experience teaching in an intensive English language program (i.e. foundation, pre-university, IEP program) and IELTS/TOEFL exam preparation |
And...
| Quote: |
Education Requirements: Master’s degree or higher in English / Linguistics / TESOL, with PGCE or certified teaching qualification.
Experience Requirements: Minimum of one year of college level teaching experience in an academic ESL program and/or a combination of teaching and mentoring in ESOL, plus three to ten years of related work experience, with additional experience in curriculum development. |
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Voyeur
Joined: 03 Jul 2012
Posts: 431
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| Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2014 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks a bunch. I see now that for the good jobs they want true, ESL professionals in mid-career who have been developing and continue to develop themselves as educators.
It's serious stuff. |
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RustyShackleford
Joined: 13 May 2013
Posts: 449
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| Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2014 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Thank you all for your contributions. I thank Nomad Soul for a little bit of a reality check and Coder and Voyeur for their slightly more optimistic view. I'm going to start testing the waters as Summer rolls closer around. I doubt I'll be swinging the big leagues, but if I can get anywhere close to double my Vietnam salary, I should be okay. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2014 4:41 pm Post subject: |
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| RustyShackleford wrote: |
| I'm going to start testing the waters as Summer rolls closer around. I doubt I'll be swinging the big leagues, but if I can get anywhere close to double my Vietnam salary, I should be okay. |
Again, Saudi Arabia is your best bet. Contracting companies that staff teachers in university English programs and some of the government/military contractors Coder mentioned tend to post on the Cafe's job board and elsewhere on the Net. But seriously, don't wait until next year to look at job ads. Start checking out postings now to see if your Spanish university degree/major (or even your BA) and previous TEFL experience will meet employers' requirements. For example, Vinnell (one of the contractors mentioned by Coder) is requiring teachers have the following:
| Quote: |
Qualifications:
1. In accordance with the Saudi Military Policy only MALE applicants will be considered.
2. Must be a U.S. citizen.
3. Must have: a) M.A. in teaching English as a Second Language or Education; b) B.A. or B.S. in Linguistics; c) B.A. or B.S. in English or a foreign language. Certification in Teaching English as a Foreign Language desired but not required.
4. Earned degrees from U.S. based universities
5. Two (2) years teaching English as a foreign language outside of the U.S. and preferably in Saudi Arabia or anywhere else in the Middle East.
Source: http://www.eslcafe.com/joblist/index.cgi?read=31412 |
Anyway, you'll get something in KSA. Whether your MAT from a non-Anglophone country will help bump up your salary is another matter. |
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