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RM1983
Joined: 03 Jan 2007 Posts: 360
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Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2014 10:54 pm Post subject: |
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water rat wrote: |
Shimokitazawa wrote: |
water rat wrote: |
I was paying more attention than you are. I was respected by all and reciprocated by maintaining a sterling reputation and exemplary behavior.
You had to be aware of what issues might crop up in your journey through life together. Are you really asking me to sort all that out for you?
"Pathetic." |
You're so full of shit that I actually laughed out loud when I read that.
And not only that, but you're nasty, too.
"sterling reputation", "exemplary behavior", "respected by all"
LMFAO!!! |
That's right. It was a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away. All this was possible in the mid-1980s, and if you are little old me.
Hey, do me a solid and tell RM1983 (registered moron 1983) he's on my ignore list. He's way too sarcastic, even for me, which is saying something! Ask him if he can do anything, besides whinge and how much he is paid to do so? |
Here you go folks. How to get ahead in Japan - name calling and starting a boasting contest over how much you get paid, all done in a public space  |
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mateacher
Joined: 07 Sep 2013 Posts: 180
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Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2014 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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mitsui wrote: |
These things are not always funny, but if you can laugh, good.
Five years ago I reported my new address at city hall.
The woman could not believe a foreigner would live in house, just in a mansion or apato. |
No, I totally believe you as I have had similar experiences. The Japanese as a whole are downright rude and condescending, or totally fawning when they found out you are earning more than they are. I will give you a few examples. Since this was in the mid to late 90s I was a full time University teacher, I was being paid a lot more than the entry level university positions being talked about on this site. I don' want to appear vulgar by mentioning the amount but it was good. The university I worked at has decreased this pay and I now chuckle when I see it paying close to 6.5 million. If I tell people I was paid 8.5 million for the same position in 98 hey think I am talking shit. But, anyway back to the story as I was a single guy and needed the status symbols to attract women I would often indulge. I was once at a jewelers, buying a girlfriend something and the salesman in his 50's commented, "nice Rolex, how much did it cost". I told him i didn't really know and that I just paid by card, but this was a lie and it had actually cost me 400.000 yen. He then asked me what job I had and when I told him I was an English teacher, he asked me if I worked at Nova. I just said yes, to kind of mind-*beep* the guy and because I found him rude as hell. No salesman in their right mind would behave like that in the states.
Another example was a few years later, when I went to the realtor to buy the summer house in Izu. It was around 35 million yen and the realtor kept asking me if I was sure I wanted it as if I was mad to take out a loan and even think of buying property as a gaijin. The pure fact I was a gaijin, made her think it was impossible that I could dream of owning Japanese land. I had to basically beg her to take me seriously. I think to 99% of Japanese, all gaijin are from America, from some BFE nowhere sate, teach English at an Eikaiwa, are single, live in a Leopalace in Saitama and can't use chopsticks or speak Japanese. |
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Shimokitazawa
Joined: 16 Aug 2009 Posts: 458 Location: Saigon, Vietnam
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Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2014 11:38 pm Post subject: |
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mateacher wrote: |
The Japanese as a whole are downright rude and condescending, or totally fawning when they found out you are earning more than they are. |
The vibe I get is that they detest us.
When a non-Japanese isn't an eikaiwa teacher but a banker, diplomat, researcher or scientist, etc. they are flummoxed.
We are tolerated, at the most. |
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Black_Beer_Man
Joined: 26 Mar 2013 Posts: 453 Location: Yokohama
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Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2014 2:01 am Post subject: |
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I wouldn't go so far as to say that foreigners are detested.
I think that some Japanese people have an inferiority complex with the world. I mean, I hear many Japanese people saying how great their country is. Just yesterday a Japanese friend asked me a typical question.
Japanese Friend: Which country is the safest in the world?
Me: I think the countries of Northern Europe such as Holland, Finland, Norway, and Belgium are the safest. How about you?
Japanese Friend: Japan is the safest.
Yeah, of course, Japan.
I should have guess he was fishing for a compliment.
Basically, what I am saying is that many Japanese don't like interacting with foreigners because they can't speak English well. This weakness is an affront to their national pride. This is simply unacceptable and such an embarrassment is to be avoided at all costs to maintain the assertion that Japan has a superior culture.
How often do you hear Japanese people speak negatively about their culture? It's rare in my experience.
Therefore, the problem is self esteem, not the hatred of foreigners.
Japan has to go through what Americans are going through right now. This is to realize that their country is not THAT great. 20 years ago, all I'd ever hear from Americans is how wonderful their country is. However, nowadays I am hearing them admit that there are things in their country are problematic (expensive useless wars, being the only wealthy country not to have free or heavily subsidized healthcare, financially-crippling university tuitions). I think this more balanced and humble attitude is exactly what Americans need to fix up their country. Japan very much need to do the same IMHO. |
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nightsintodreams
Joined: 18 May 2010 Posts: 558
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Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2014 11:26 am Post subject: |
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We used top have a survey at my old school for all the students to fill out, it included things like "Why do you want to study English?", "What do you like about Japan?" and "What do you dislike about Japan?". I swear, I saw hundreds of students go in and out of that school, but I can only remember two that answered that question, everyone else wrote "nothing" or just left it blank.
I find it really odd, I could talk all day about what I dislike about my country, Japan or any of the countries I've visited.
Oh, and if you're interested in the two people's responses, one guy (a photographer/video editor for a car company or something) wrote that he hated how weak and uncreative most of the young Japanese people coming into his company were and how none of them went against the grain, the other guy said that he didn't like how he often couldn't communicate hisd true feelings about matters when around Japanese people. |
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steki47
Joined: 20 Apr 2008 Posts: 1029 Location: BFE Inaka
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Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2014 9:05 pm Post subject: |
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Black_Beer_Man wrote: |
How often do you hear Japanese people speak negatively about their culture? It's rare in my experience. |
I have had many incidents of Japanese complaining about certain aspects of Japanese culture to me in private. Solo students, drunk friends, drunk students (!) and such.
My exGF complained a lot about Japan and Japanese society to me. Funny, if I complained about Japan (even when agreeing with her), she would react quite negatively. "You don't understand Japan", etc.
Fear of losing face and eggshell egos all play into this. Throw in a lack of perspective and virtually zero self-analysis and-voila!-Japan. |
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rxk22
Joined: 19 May 2010 Posts: 1629
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Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2014 10:35 pm Post subject: |
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steki47 wrote: |
I have had many incidents of Japanese complaining about certain aspects of Japanese culture to me in private. Solo students, drunk friends, drunk students (!) and such.
My exGF complained a lot about Japan and Japanese society to me. Funny, if I complained about Japan (even when agreeing with her), she would react quite negatively. "You don't understand Japan", etc.
Fear of losing face and eggshell egos all play into this. Throw in a lack of perspective and virtually zero self-analysis and-voila!-Japan. |
I got a lot of that too. A lot of Japanese people would vent about Japan to me. Kinda interesting, as they could never say any of that to anyone else that they knew, so they chose me, a relative stranger
If you don't have the freedom to be critical, suddenly no one is critical, ever. |
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steki47
Joined: 20 Apr 2008 Posts: 1029 Location: BFE Inaka
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Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2014 11:11 pm Post subject: |
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rxk22 wrote: |
I got a lot of that too. A lot of Japanese people would vent about Japan to me. Kinda interesting, as they could never say any of that to anyone else that they knew, so they chose me, a relative stranger
If you don't have the freedom to be critical, suddenly no one is critical, ever. |
I suppose speaking to foreigners (outside the circle) and speaking in a foreign language may give the Japanese the freedom to speak more freely and vent a bit. Sort of like how people may pour their hearts out to a random bartender.
Several Japanese people have admitted to me that they tried marijuana at some point and I suspect they would not talk about that in a room full of other Japanese. Westerners would be more likely to admit something like that with less risk of shame.
What I found a bit jarring was that the same individual Japanese would react quite negatively to me saying something critical about Japan. In a high context culture such as Japan, my critical comments would typically be viewed as an outsider criticizing their society. I have since learned when to give my opinions and when to shut my mouth. |
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RM1983
Joined: 03 Jan 2007 Posts: 360
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Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 12:15 am Post subject: |
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Lots of people are like that I find. Theyre happy to lay into their own country but get a bit defensive if an outsider does it. |
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Maitoshi
Joined: 04 May 2014 Posts: 718 Location: 何処でも
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Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 12:45 am Post subject: |
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RM1983 wrote: |
Lots of people are like that I find. Theyre happy to lay into their own country but get a bit defensive if an outsider does it. |
This! |
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nightsintodreams
Joined: 18 May 2010 Posts: 558
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Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 1:42 am Post subject: |
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Yea, when I think about it, I'm a but like that. Don't like it one but when a foreigner mocks the queen. Not bothered if a British person does though. |
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natsume
Joined: 24 Apr 2006 Posts: 409 Location: Chongqing, China
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Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 1:56 am Post subject: |
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A math teacher at my high school was visibly shocked and upset when I denounced our (then current) president in the staff room during a political conversation. I was a bit surprised that he would care so much, and I did point out that it is fairly common in the US to publicly voice your real, actual thoughts. But I guess he didn't feel I should be speaking negatively of my "leader" as a representative of my country in Japan. |
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steki47
Joined: 20 Apr 2008 Posts: 1029 Location: BFE Inaka
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Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 4:12 am Post subject: |
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RM1983 wrote: |
Lots of people are like that I find. Theyre happy to lay into their own country but get a bit defensive if an outsider does it. |
I felt the same way when I lived in the US and foreigners criticized my country. So I tried to remember that feeling now that I am the foreigner. |
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RM1983
Joined: 03 Jan 2007 Posts: 360
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Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 6:59 am Post subject: |
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steki47 wrote: |
RM1983 wrote: |
Lots of people are like that I find. Theyre happy to lay into their own country but get a bit defensive if an outsider does it. |
I felt the same way when I lived in the US and foreigners criticized my country. So I tried to remember that feeling now that I am the foreigner. |
I used to teach in England and Id here complaints everyday. People are unfriendly,always drunk, false, etc.
They were often right but still you get that impulse to defend it.
Most people do the same. |
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